To Think Non-Medically Required Circumcision Is Abuse?

[BigFatBully]

Circumcision of a child if not required for a medical reason is abuse. I don't believe a child can consent to mutilation and it should be for them to decide when they reach adulthood if they want such a procedure.

I don't understand how anyone could take a happy baby who is otherwise healthy and do this to them.

It's male genital mutilation (MGM).

But in that case your also part of a different culture and have equal rights to speak up and to make an informed choice therefore wouldn't you read up on medical research before agreeing?

Think what you want. I don’t care.

i always feel a bit confused with this as i had my ears pierced when i was a week old - i have portuguese/south american heritage and it is, culturally, a very standard thing.

i’m grateful i had them done as a baby so i don’t remember it but i just don’t think i could do it to my future children. feels a bit barbaric!

You said at the start of the thread you were a British atheist and then later on said you agreed with circumcision due to your culture and beliefs. it made no sense.

I know you don’t care. If you don’t care about newborn babies going through unnecessary pain, you won’t care about what people think of you. I expected nothing else

In a US context, it's somewhat similar to FGM to the extent that its a practice partially rooted in a cultural aversion to sexuality (in male circumcision's case, the belief that masturbation was both sinful and medically harmful).

A lot of men I’ve been with have been circumcised and they love the fact that they are/been proud. Although they have often recalled the trauma of recovery after having it done as a child (it seems to be common around 6)
DH is and thought it would be natural for our son to be. He was born a poorly baby and the last thing on
earth I would ever do is put him through unnecessary pain. Nearly split up over it, but it was something I felt so strongly about. My son was absolutely terrified at the thought of being cut. So no way ever was it happening.

Well done on standing up for your son.

This is what I don't get. How can any parent that actually likes their kid put them through pain and suffering for no fucking good reason at all. Necessary medical interventions obviously are fair enough, but lopping off a bit of someone's body for "religious" or "cultural" reasons? No. Fuck off.

I am British and I am an atheist. I married into a Catholic American family and would not object to my son being circumcised as is completely normal and accepted within this family. So yes, my culture and beliefs.

If you want to interpret that as not caring about causing babies unecessary pain that’s fine. I don’t really in this instance. Are we done now?

I lived in the US for a while and was surprised that the men I met were so proud of it, and so convinced that non-circumcised penises are ugly and dirty. Then again the women I met were absolutely horrified at the thought of “dirty” pubic hair (on women; for some reason male pubic hair is totally clean and fine 🧐). People will always find a way to justify cultural norms that were imposed on them. And that way is normally denigrating and ostracizing others who don’t fit those norms.

Having slept with both I prefer non-circumcised. Partly aesthetically and physically, but also because uncircumcised men never blather on, completely unsolicited, about how much better it makes them than other men.

It's still mutilation though, and completely unnecessary.

YANBU.
It is mutilation. No baby should have healthy tissue removed that serves a purpose for the sake of culture or religion (because that's what it is). And for those who say its wrong to compare it to FGM, it's not wrong s some 'lesser' forms of FGM include pricking and removal of the clitoral hood, the equivalent of removing the foreskin. To me, it is the equivalent of sexual assault and it became popular in places like the USA to discourage masturbation; the same way FGM is done to remove sexual pleasure. I can't believe people are even supporting this as mothers in the 21st century!

You didn't get your dd's tongue tie fixed? That is a medical issue though. My DS couldn't feed, it was agony for both of us, so his was snipped. DH's never was & he can barely poke his tongue out. My nephews had to have theirs corrected as teens & it was a far more serious op.

Circumcision for any reason other than medical necessity can absolutely get in the bin, though.

And if you married into a family that mutilated its daughters you'd be cool with that cos 'tradition'? Where do you draw the line, exactly?

Give it a rest, you should be ashamed.

The amount of passive women on this thread spouting 'well my husband's family', 'my husband's culture' makes me want to vomit. That future child has two parents & one of them wants to chop bits off of them for absolutely no good reason - it's up to you to say absofuckinglutely not in every circumstance.

& fwiw, I also don't agree with ear piercing children either - it just doesn't make me feel quite so nauseated.

Once again for those in the back, MC is legal, FGM is not, so no, she wouldn't be cool with FGM

Thank you for your comment. I just watched a video of a baby being circumcised by a doctor. I've not done that before but because you say "that's not what's happening here" I thought I'd better get more informed. Here's what happened in the video I watched.

The baby was strapped into a baby shaped basin thing, including ankles. During the procedure you did not see the baby's face, but you could hear the baby. The baby was still to start with, so I thought must be anaesthetised, but no, he did move a very little. During the procedure the Dr inserted and stretched the foreskin with pointy type implements and then snippped down and twisted the foreskin and held it with a medical instrument (I don't know the names of these things so you'll have to forgive me that). The Dr then took another instrument and placed it over the twisted flesh and cut it off. Dr smiled to camera "that's how I do circumcision and look no crying".

Camera goes to baby's face. Baby's breathing during this has been fast and noisy. Baby has something in his mouth that he's sucking deeply on, looks like a folded cloth. My first thought is "learned helplessness". I don't know how else to describe that baby's behaviour. The breathing noise and speed, the sucking on the cloth, the stillness. It's not normal. I wonder how long the little boy was strapped and restrained in that basin to be so quiet and still.

Fight, flight, fawn, flop, freeze. All responses to danger and trauma.

I can't respect any culture, religion or fashion that condones this. We have soap and condoms. It's child abuse.

So? Morality is not decided by what is legal or not.

FGM is horrible, but that doesn't mean something less horrible is ok.

People are not doing proper research they are googling an answer from an American company that is invested in the money making health American system where every easy procedure makes money. Have you looked at global stats for penile cancer? Preventing STCs is down to education and contraception. People in America also spout it reduces smell and uncircumcised looks funny......that's good hygiene and what we are used to seeing.

I think FGM is wrong and would tell anyone my opinion if the subject came up.

Has your Somalian friend been mutilated and is her thinking it is OK her way of coping? I believe that many victim are probably like post-op trans people in that they simply cannot face the reality of what has happened to them and have to pretend (to themselves and others) that everything is ok.

I honestly find your attitude crazy / evil

Not your culture and beliefs if you’re a British atheist. His. You’ve just decided his culture and beliefs are more important than yours and you would have your son pay the price of that.

you don’t really care about causing babies unnecessary pain in this instance. Wow.

Catholics do not require-or even suggest-infant circumcision.

The rates of penile cancer is similar in both cut and uncut....the risks are reduced by education......around safe sex, hygiene, smoking cutting off a foreskin to save a bloke washing is extreme. Saying it's okay to have multiple partners without a condom because you've no foreskin isn't right.

But both should be illegal saying your mutilation is less than mine so I'm okay with yours doesn't sound like a good leg to stand on, nor does the idea that it's only the legalities that matter. There are many things that were legal once like slavery they were wrong when they were legal. Luckily people stood up against them that is what is happening now.

Careful, your prejudice is showing.

She’s a fricking GP, she doesn’t need you to explain why FGM is bad to her.

And no, she hasn't been mutilated, have you?