To think my mum has fallen down a conspiracy rabbit hole and I can't get her out

[Coffeesoon]

My mum has just sent me a video of Ant Middleton explaining how in 2027 the migrants / boat people who are seeking asylum and have already been made legal, will kick off and attack us all.
He says there will be a civil war, he knows because of army contacts and that we need to prepare.
What am I suppose to say to that?
She fully believes that an army is being formed and is constantly telling me or sending me videos about it.
I love my mum but since covid, which she thought wasn't real, she has been thinking the government is out to get us. We live in an area of increased immigrants and she absolutely hates them.
I've tried to talk to her but shes adamant and its really getting me down.

I'm a "leftie" myself. As are many others. So I'm afraid that particular accusation doesn't wash. I also have life and daily experience, as do others. Have you considered employing a better, less tribal, and more intelligent way of arguing than this?

@Charlize43

I have heard this, too.

Many victims of the grooming gangs have spoken about exactly this, being told as they were being raped that they deserved it because they were white and non-muslim-referred to, I believe, by the word, "Kafir," which means "infidel."

I heard about the case in Hyde Park. Horrifying. I just...it doesn't have to be like this.

Wow that’s interesting.

I think that although it might not affect your MIL personally by 2050 native British will be 55% of the population in the UK and the Muslim population will be around 17%,in a high migration rate scenario (as it is now if continued) non British born population will be around 40%.

This will run the risk of society breaking down into sectarianism with political parties being dominated by ethnicity and not social cohesion.

Not being happy with the state of the immigration service at the moment is one thing.

Believing that immigrants are planning on taking over the country, as stated in the original post, is nothing short of conspiratorial batshittery.

Whether you like it or not, there are many media outlets, especially on SM, spouting absolute bullshit in order to stir up fear and hatred for political gain.

They are praying on the uneducated and lower working classes and many are, in truth, too stupid to realise it.

It could be "dark propaganda" or it could be... facts? Or shared opinions? Like, maybe more than one person is concerned about young men arriving illegally on boats. It's a fact that women have been raped and killed by immigrants. It's a fact that there have been several terror attacks by Islamists. If people talk about these facts then is that because they're all brainwashed by 'dark propaganda'?

What about when people wave the Palestinian flag around and call for a 'global intifada'? Is that some 'dark propaganda'? Or is that okay with you because it's the sort of thing that's okay with middle class white Guardian readers?

I'm just saying that everyone, whatever their views, is likely to have views in common with other people, and may likely use similar, widely understood, terms and descriptions. I don't think that's anything really to worry about. It doesn't suggest anyone is being brainwashed.

I know. People go on about the Daily Mail but the Express is way more xenophobic. My ILs also mainline the Express and it does them no good at all. DH has to endure the anti immigrant rants whenever he goes to visit.

Whether you like it or not, there are many media outlets, especially on SM, spouting absolute bullshit in order to stir up fear and hatred for political gain or economic gain- the former Welsh leader of Reform making pro-Russian speeches for bribes. I mean what would the allies of China/Russia, have to gain from destabilising our society and sowing further seeds of discontent?...

True.

I think there will be trouble in pockets of the country . Every time a female is raped you can see the strong emotional reaction in the area where it has occurred.

When a car mows crowds of people down. People are stabbed on trains. It's human nature to be fearful.

It is a powder keg. Thankfully there aren't mass shootings yet with our gun laws they're difficult to acquire.

It's harder now to get the ingredients to build a bomb.

We have to rely on our security services to keep one step ahead of more organised attacks.

Exactly. I'm not a DT reader (my late father was), but it is to the right what the Guardian is to the left. It's broadsheet with a known political perspective. It's not "far right" and it's not "clickbait" like the Daily Mail or my particular bugbear, the Express (which is far more like the 'Fail' of popular imagination than the DM actually is. That tends more on gossip, talking about things like THAT dress and THAT outfit and speculation on people's house prices, in my experience).

And yes, the DT does have columns from lefties like Suzanne Moore, from when she was bullied out of the Guardian (although people like my father couldn't get to grips with her because... well, strangely she's expressing a traditionally leftie perspective).

But it's bizarre to claim the Daily Torygraph is practically Breitbart. it really isn't. I think it's healthy to read a variety of views and media - even if some of it offends you, you can at least see what 'the opposition' is saying and their perspective. Not a bad thing, surely?

Ah, snap!

Out of interest what destabilising effect did the paid for questions or speeches in Brussels have on our society? I haven't seen anything explained anywhere? It's mentioned a lot but no details.

I read both right and left papers and same for flicking through the news channels, I think it's a good idea to be informed. I even think we should be able to access Russia Today from the UK just to see what the propaganda looks like from the other side (it's inaccessible now in the West). We have no idea what is going on in China and people are going to be extremely surprised indeed when it turns out that it won't be the current fairly impoverished outgroups in our society that are the danger, but the highly technologically advanced already Chinese who are going to make our society look very primitive indeed.

Perhaps I am a conspiracy theorist!

I don't think the BBC have done any favours to themselves over the years, trust has eroded in them, I would say I'm left- of -centre, but they certainly don't represent me, I prefer my news consciously biased, not pretending to be impartial. A lot of people appear not to be paying their TV license any more which I can understand, as I'm not sure we need the BBC to offer World News when we have Sky and other outlets and I surely don't want to watch any of their 'entertainment' shows.

There has been a lot of lies, misinformation and general bullshit designed to stir up hate against refugees. None of which has any evidence and much of which has been rebuffed here with actual facts.

Something someone said on line is not fact.
Something someone thinks is not evidence.

There has been no well reasoned debate so sigh would be an appropriate response to the rubbish being spouted.

I don't think a few speeches in the European Parliament are destabilising, I do think Trump and Russia are more than cordial and constant right-wing bias in particular sites such as X is making sure that more favourable (or at least controlled) narratives that are helpful for Russia-Chinese power axis are absolutely promoted.

Here's the Sky report on this:

https://news.sky.com/story/the-x-effect-how-elon-musk-is-boosting-the-british-right-13464445

They did experiments with left wing and right wing and extreme content created on purpose to see which the algorithm promoted more over time. Guess which won?

Have a look at countries like Iran and Afghanistan before they became Islamic countries.......

Omg this is my mother !!!! Everything you have said wow

It's true, but those of us who have been "educated" are also, the evidence suggests, not above such brainwashing and propaganda efforts. In fact, we are MORE likely to find ourselves inducted into cults than the general population. Why? Precisely because we assume we are 'too intelligent' to be silly enough to be caught up in cults We assume that our 'questioning' has better answers and solutions than found by mere uneducated masses. We assume we are more enlightened than the average, and that assumption makes us MORE susceptible to gaslighting.

So I think people should be VERY careful with that assumption, as there is plenty of evidence that refutes it. A university education is no guarantee that you are miraculously immune to propaganda; I get why people think it should be, but the opposite is very often the case.

"Sigh" is not an appropriate or adequate response. It's a deeply immature one.

We KNOW that "something said online" is not a fact. Why are you assuming that that is where people are getting their evidence from?

Op, I'm sorry your thread appears to have been hijacked by those spreading this kind of misinformation.

I manage my relative by challenging gently the misinformation, trying to keep ahead of the nonsense before visits so that I can be prearmed with facts. I visit them so that I can leave when it gets too much or they start shouting (they seem very angry with everything at the moment).
I always, regardless of the conversation leave with a hug and remind them of how much I love them.

People that keep posting this harmful rhetoric really boil my piss.

Have you not seen it, even on MN? I have. Even on this thread. If you don't experience this then cool.

I put a post up earlier, explaining yesterday's conversation with neighbour who lives around the corner. Very polite to each other, we have known each other years (I know his amazing wife who is a friend) and explained some facts against his extreme views. All polite, cordial. Instead of him even considering them to be true, or even wanting to think about it or research for himself, he told me that my source (multiple, varied and news bonafide sources) are not to be trusted, that they have an agenda and the things they write are untrue. He only applied the agenda/untrue part for anything he disagreed with.

Sorry. This blanket refusal to be level-headed, seek the truth for yourself is on the rise.

How do you know it's been "designed" though? Isn't that a conspiracy theory way of describing something, using the word "designed"?
Aren't you just ignoring any natural response people are having to their actual lives being affected?

And what have they (whoever they are) "designed" this for? There is no explanation in this thread at all for this, what this malignant design is for? Do you know what is it for as all that effort for an unidentified outcome is odd?

You make statements that nothing is evidenced. Isn't it just as likely that you censure your own information sources to ensure you don't see the evidence others do? So you call them liars when in fact they aren't, and it's you that has deliberately misinformed yourself by editing out information sources you don't like?

It is, but your neighbour is not the only person to be guilty of it. I am saying that you have a tribal assumption that 'only you' are capable of looking at the facts. There are multiple instances of those who claim to be 'on the left' spouting as much unevidenced bullshit as those like your neighbour. Sorry, but I think you're missing the point here. YOU are not immune to it, but appear to think you are. That is also a massive problem.

There have been quite a few comments that have been well argued. If you think those comments or points within them are unsupported by evidence, you should respond to them and give the evidence for your own point of view.

It's called debate. You need to learn how to engage in it. Just name-calling and insults isn't going to help you to get your views across. If you genuinely believe your ideas are better and your views are the right ones, I don't understand why you wouldn't want to talk about them.