Fiancé asking for a prenup

[Aquea]

Fiancé and I have had a relatively short relationship. We’ve only been together for two years. I basically had to make it very clear that I would not be having children without being married. Just for legal protection. Got a bit of push back on that in the early days but I did say that marriage was a non negotiable for me and if that wasn’t for fiance then he and I should part ways.

Anyway, now we are engaged. Fiancé has asked I sign a prenup. Fiancé has his own successful business. We’re not talking a champagne lifestyle but he is comfortable enough and owns several assets. His business is fairly large - employs 35 people. But the margins are small and the overheads are massive.

I don’t have an issue in some regards as I’m certainly not marrying for the sake of money alone. I plan to carry on working FT.

But the actual concept is extremely cynical and unromantic. It’s really made me feel shit. Like I can’t be trusted. I’m kind of sick of indirectly having to convince fiancé that I am good person to marry.

We plan to have children.

it just feels like it’s one thing after another. Ie having to explain my reasoning for wanting to get married and now a prenup. The path to being engaged just seems already so negotiated.

A lot of assumptions there.

The incredibly obvious distinction between your positions here is that you're the one taking all the physical and social risks involved in having children. Your positions in that respect are not equal, and nor could they possibly be.

If I really wanted to get married anyway, I'd suggest more negotiation of the prenup. He appears to be giving you the ick though, which is never a good sign.

Make this a reverse and you would be getting totally different answers … I’ve got a successful business that I’ve built up over years, 2 years ago I met partner, he’s insisting on getting married which is fair enough but I’m worried about my business should it all go wrong.

Literally everyone would have replied don’t marry him without seeing a solicitor and protecting the business!

If things are a battle now how do you think it’s going to go if and when you have kids
Also he’s already planning divorce so what’s the point

Then you are a hypocrite. Why you think you deserve protection but that he doesn’t?

A pre-nup isn’t planning divorce, it’s a contingency. I wish more women protected their assets. So many threads posted here where posters were screwed over in a divorce.

As a family solicitor I always advise people to be practical and not get caught up in the romance of money. I see it all too often sadly! You want the marriage before children to protect yourself. He was a pre nup to protect himself. Seems sensible to me.

I really would walk away from this one. Seriously. Your gut brain is trying to tell you for a reason!!!

This 💯

Wanting to be married before DC is sensible for women. OP’s DP doesn’t want to share his wealth in the event of breaking up, which would be fair if they had no DC and were married a short time, but very unfair if they stay married for many years and OP works much less than him after DC, negatively affecting her personal earnings.

In the event of a breakup being self employed could also make it easier for him to minimise what he pays for the DC - lots on MN about that.

But it isn't possible to do a reverse when childbearing is involved. There's an inherent risk to the woman that cannot be replicated. The answers OP is being given reflect this.

Is your partner going to take the physical and financial hit of having multiple children? Are they going to be in a very vulnerable position for years on end with tiny children to care for?

They say don’t get married to someone you wouldn’t want to get divorced from: 50% of heterosexual marriages end in divorce, so it’s not unlikely. Would you take a 50% risk on losing half of a business you’d worked hard to build up?

As someone who is twice divorced (no, I didn’t expect either of them to happen but that’s life), I wouldn’t get married again but if I were to do so, would have no problem signing a prenup. If you don’t want to, I think you should examine your expectations of marriage and reasons for getting married.

And so he should, he built his business before you arrived on the scene. Sounds sensible for him to not want to have to hand half over should things go wrong

They're not legally binding anyway??
I'd be more worried about the conditions in it, what is he trying to deny you and how long will it stand? You want to be married for legal protection, but sounds like he doesn't want you to have that protection.

Just as an FYI, the divorce rate is more like 40% than 50. Its not something I'd take into account when making life choices myself, not least because the stats for cohabiting split rates are harder to find, but if people think it's important then it's worth getting right.

Exactly. You can not overlook the power in balance, financial risks and the vulnerability of the woman that is pregnant in this scenario.

She’s not though, is she? She said she plans to continue working FT. Which is very sensible since we’re all responsible for ourselves and if you place your financial future in someone else’s hands, you might find out that that was a poor decision, especially if you divorce or they die and you find out things about their finances you weren’t aware of. Like my friend whose husband tragically died in an accident aged 42 leaving her with 2 young kids, no job, and a massive debt she knew nothing about because he’d hidden it from her

Have you told him this? How did he respond?

I'd be ok with a prenup if it was very specifically to protect assets/a business built before I was in the picture. But after marriage then I think everything should be pooled because it was earned while you were a team.

Imagine you're a sahm looking after the kids and he grows his business to 100 employees. He wouldn't have been able to do that without your work at home.

But really you should be able to discuss all these ideas and scenarios openly. Does he show any understanding of children affecting your earning potential and pension etc?

I think it's more to do with the fact that women's bodies get ruined by children. Fact. And they can also have long term consequences. It's mostly men who walk away from families. Fact. It's often men on here who refuse to share their nig salaries whilst women scrimpt and save to buy sanitary products and clothes for the children. So a woman wanting legal protection is very different from a man not wanting to provide for his family.

OP’s DP doesn’t want to share his wealth in the event of breaking up, which would be fair if they had no DC and were married a short time, but very unfair if they stay married for many years and OP works much less than him after DC, negatively affecting her personal earnings.

That wouldn’t happen, judges take pre-nups under advisement but they would also factor in how long the couple were married, how many kids, who worked, who was SAHM, who earned more, who has bigger pension.

You want legal protection eg marriage, he want legal protection eg prenup. Cannot see what’s your issue. You want your specific preference met (marriage) but are uncomfortable with his preference eg prenup. Why?
Look,prenup doesn’t mean that you’re inevitably think that the marriage end in divorce and that he needs to protect assets prior to being married. Prenup is sensible as it’s negotiated at a time of good will and when both parties are supposed to be cordial & amenable e.g. planning the marriage.

well you might as well have the big conversation now do you plan to work after you have children? Will you go back to full-time part-time? What will happen after the children arrive ? Will you Use nursery? Childminder ?nanny? Regards, finances how you divide money will you have shared money or individual money? Have all those conversations as well.

I suppose your niggle will probably that you’ve given him an ultimatum and if he wants to have children, he will have to marry you. He’s not an extent spontaneously decided , he’s been given an ultimatum . He’s been told you plus marriage = children.

Reclassify yourself as a sex worker and then draw up and present him with an employment contract for him to sign with your going rates, working conditions and bonuses and health benefits, maternity pay and pension. Factor in additional payments for exceeding quarterly targets, fiscal consideration for the depreciation of your vagina and boobs as he uses them, a good severance package should he decide to upgrade or your hardware becomes obsolete, etc.

Beat him at his own game!

This. If I had a successful business and/or assets I'd definitely want them protected, there's nothing romantic about divorce!

Honestly just sign it then forget about it. When married make wills. Live your best life.

if you divorce the pre nip will be considered but not legally binding.