Keeping kids in from play at lunchtime.

[0gfhty]

I wonder what people think of this. My sons school has something called "times table club" during lunch time play for one day a week. Alll children in year 4 have to go to who don't know all their times tables yet. This hasn't been communicated to the parents but it seems to be true after speaking to some other parents and children. Apparently most of the children in year 4 are in this club. I dont think the children should lose their main playtime for this and if it is most children attending then it indicates to me that their lunch time is being used to teach the curriculum. I wonder what people's views are on this? How would you complain since its more about a general practice and not just my individual child? I have found the teachers to become a little hostile and defensive in the past about anything other than praise even when being polite and approachable.

I've no idea how your response is relevant to my post. Are you saying that because some people can't learn times tables I shouldn't have taught my son and instead got him to use a calculator?

I’m responding to your explanation of why it’s ‘essential’ to learn them. Sure, if it’s easy to learn it could make some things quicker or easier. It’s not essential though. Source: my life.

Well that's just not true - the post I responded to was asking about the 'benefit' of knowing them and I responded for with a specific example of benefit to my son. I never said anything about essential at any point, or said or implied anything about anyone that doesn't know them.

Ok. Not sure what you are so cross about.

As usual teachers are dammed if they do, dammed if they don't.

Here you go, OP…

There is a times table test at the end of year 4. The curriculum prescribes 10s, 2s and 5s in year 2. Across lower key stage 2, all the other tables are taught and their division facts, but practice at home embeds this. We are not in Victorian times where primary education is about rote learning of facts, chanted back to the teacher every day. We have a broad, diverse and interesting curriculum, the downside of which is that core learning needs to be supported at home.

In year 3 children get their TTRS (or similar) logins for home and school and have some times table instruction in school. There is an expectation that children practice their times tables using TTRS as homework, along with reading every day and weekly spellings. Children should know the majority of their tables by the end of year 3, and have instant recall of multiplication and division facts by the May half term of year 4.

It sounds to me like the club, which is probably using TTRS or similar, is for those children not practising at home. Kids resent missing lunchtime play? What a great incentive for them to start doing their homework. Kids struggling with maths but doing their times table homework will probably still get their playtime.

It’s wrong, children need that time to get their energy out. I’m sure the school would be complaining if they were being disruptive after lunch. They should take 10 mins every morning to do it when brains are more fresh and awake. 10 mins a day can make a huge difference over time.

Year 4 teacher here. At my school, we have open classrooms and give out information to parents (hard copies & on our website) listing everything they need to know about what’s going to be going on in Year 4, within the first few weeks of the new school year. Fewer than half of my cohort’s parents generally turn up & no one took the information leaflet this year, or last!

I’m a huge advocate of learning times tables - NOT just because of the National testing at the end of year 4 - but because they lay the foundations of understanding maths in so many other areas. I set all of the maths homework for my class & less than half the class complete it. I have sent several messages to parents ‘gently’ reminding them to encourage their children to complete their homework (which, I have explained reinforces the work we have done in class that week) but some never will…however, they are quick to come to us later in the year & complain that their child is struggling to get to grips with maths. I can’t win!
Teaching now is so different to when I started 20 years ago. If parents could spend a day in class, they’d see that a massive chunk of our time is spent dealing with behavioural issues. I have about 35 mins for my lunch break, in which I may have to deal with problems on the playground, type up & record any issues from the morning & maybe eat my lunch & go to the loo! If your child’s teacher is giving up just 1 of their lunch breaks, I’d be thanking them, not thinking of confronting them about it!

Many years ago, when the wrong people got their hands on education, any kind of rote learning was not just frowned on, it was actively banned. There will be teachers now who were never taught tables, I recall a Headteacher when I was supply having a real go at another supply teacher for teaching tables and she was his wife! We used to get pupils in High school at 11 who were totally unable to recall, say 3 x 9, the best they could manage was going through the 9x table. Apart from the 7x table there are many short cuts.

I’d be grateful that the teachers were willing to give up their break to support my child with their progress. I’d be spending more time helping them learn at home as well.

Absolutely this!
And I doubt it's for the entire lunch break either because the teacher surely needs a bit of time to get ready for the pm lessons, nip to the loo, grab a hasty sandwich etc.

Maybe check how long it's for & the set up before deciding you need to complain about it.

Your 5yr knew all their times tables ?

Thank you Cardibach! As someone who has really struggled with maths. No matter how much my parents tried to help etc I couldn’t memorise all my times tables. I can work it out no bother if I take my time. But I instantly freeze on the spot at quick fire questions.
I’m mid 30s and a nurse. I can work out my drug calculations etc. I do sometimes struggle with memorising all the bones and tendons etc I can asses, I know the locations of just the names take me a little longer!
In this day if I was at school it may have got picked up on and may have got some support.