To not understand people who talk about being the first in their family to go to uni like it’s a badge of honour?

[Kyrgyzstan]

Sorry if this sounds dismissive of their achievements but isn’t it less of a rags to riches tale of personal achievement and more of a generational difference? I mean barely any of our parents generation went to university and now it’s pretty much expected if you want a half way decent job.

Obviously if you were raised by heroin addicts and managed to still get good grades and go off to uni that’s different but the children of ordinary parents who just didn’t go to university talking about it like a huge achievement sounds a little strange to me?

Sorry but this:

"I think it’s very rare to have parents who can’t read if you’re my age tbh that would be very unusual and I acknowledge you’re childhood probably would have been very hard if that was the case."

You are assuming that what you 'think' is as good as a fact. It isn't. 18% of adults in England have what is described as very poor literacy skills, it's 26.7% in Scotland. So almost 1 in 5 in England, and more than a quarter in Scotland. Very poor literacy means they will struggle to understand quite basic written information, especially if on topics not already familiar to them, or using terminology that is not in their regular vocabulary. That is a LOT of adults with very poor literacy, and a large chunk of them will be parents. So it isn't very rare at all, it's devastatingly common for children to grow up with parents whose poor literacy make it very difficult for them to operate effectively in our society. For those children, applying to university is a huge ask when they have grown up with parents who will struggle to support any of their academic learning.

but isn’t it less of a rags to riches tale of personal achievement and more of a generational difference?
My sister and are are both first generation to go to Uni in our family. We were really encouraged to go as our parents were prevented by difficult circumstances and dire poverty. We both went to Uni in the 70s. Parents had to pay some contribution and ours found it really financially challenging but they valued education and the opportunities it brought. We are the rags to (not quite) riches generation. Both of us had to work very hard academically to go. We have both used our degrees professionally.

DD went to Uni as she needed to for the career she was aiming for. She has a massive debt she'll be paying off for ever and jobs in the industry she was aiming for are few and far between. We are really proud of her achievement though as she didn't find it easy at all. We could support her as we had some idea of what to expect and were more confident when dealing with the paperwork and so on. It was much more the norm for her friends to go to Uni than mine.

How many people have parents who help them with their GCSEs? That’s the teachers job! My parents were old af when they had me so had no idea what a gcse was (called something else back in their day) I still got pretty good GCSEs and I was five months pregnant when I took them.

I knew a girl who’s parents were alcoholics and junkies and her house was a complete mess with no where to study now if SHE had gotten a degree or even an a level it would of been a great achievement. Like I say I acknowledge some people have it a lot harder but I don’t think not having parents that went to uni is unusual

There’s a difference between “very poor literacy “ and “unable to read and write”. I completely agree there are a lot of people with very poor literacy you only need to check Facebook to see that.

And you must see that children raised in those families face enormous barriers in their academic achievements, including likelihood of going to university?

ETA Cuddlypug described it as "parents who are hardly literate (through no fault of their own)"...it was your own post that summarised that as being unable to read or write. I quite agree there is a difference, but in terms of likelihood of achieving academically, having parents who are hardly literate is likely a pretty devastating blow to your chances.

As I have previously asked you a few times, do you understand that the fact that more people are going to university than in previous generations does not negate the fact that some people going to university today are still the first in their family to go, and that this is something they are entitled to feel proud of?

You have no idea how much of an advantage it is to a child to have a parent who can help them with their education and help navigate educational and career choices.

I have a year 6 child who will be doing his SATs this year. We have already started practising and revising for the tests. Can you not see how beneficial that will be for my child? When it comes to GCSEs we'll support him with his revision and his revision timetable because we understand the education system.
If he chooses to apply to university we'll be able to support him pick the best course and university for his career plans and help him navigate the system.

We have a house big enough for him to have his own study space. We won't need him to contribute to the family finances so he will have more freedom in what he chooses to do.

I can't say the same for some of my son's peers.

I think you are trying to make the same point that other poster made so I will copy and paste my reply

How many people have parents who help them with their GCSEs? That’s the teachers job! My parents were old af when they had me so had no idea what a gcse was (called something else back in their day) I still got pretty good GCSEs and I was five months pregnant when I took them.
I knew a girl who’s parents were alcoholics and junkies and her house was a complete mess with no where to study now if SHE had gotten a degree or even an a level it would of been a great achievement. Like I say I acknowledge some people have it a lot harder but I don’t think not having parents that went to uni is unusual

It’s used as shorthand for expectations.

Colleague recently told me she was first in family to go.

it wasn’t about kudos it communicated experience in family/ parental expectations etc.

Yeah, this!

But OP, you don’t know the background of anybody on Mumsnet that says they’re the first in their family to go to uni.. you’re saying it’s not a particularly big achievement, and I understand your reasons for saying that, but you don’t know anyone’s background? You’re just assuming?

Lots of people! My parents helped me so did many of my friends' parents. It's not just about helping with the content it's things such as study techniques, ensuring your child knows what to expect, time management, providing them with a safe/secure home in which to revise.

A degree is something to be proud of in general. I just found it a little strange when reading other threads on this site and a lot of people mentioned having otherwise normal families who didn’t go to uni as if it was something hugely unusual and a great hardship.

Ive only seen people say this on mumsnet in real life the people I know who went to uni just went without mentioning their families, hence I’m a little emotionally detached from this mindset and apologise if it seemed I was mocking people on the first few pages

@Kyrgyzstan i think you are missing the wider point yes in society having parents who didn’t go to uni isn’t unusual.

Bus social mobility is decreasing. So it is harder and harder for kids who don’t have family experience of university to get there/make good choices.

My vocational course requires work experience. It’s hard to get if you don’t have contacts. I help run the scheme at work as I know this but my peers kids just get Mummy or Daddy to sort it. The kids without that have to grub around trying to make it work and often don’t.

Again, your experience, and the people you know, is not the same as data that proves what we know about this. Not having parents that went to uni may not be unusual (although I didn't think the original point was about whether it was unusual per se, rather whether it was harder), but not having parents that went to uni DOES make it considerably less likely that a person will apply to and succeed at uni. It simply is harder for a lot of those people, regardless of whether or not you agree.

As I said on this thread yesterday, it's something you will encounter far more if/when you actually do go to university and in your professional life if that's the route that you take. I have never seen anyone mention on mumsnet that they were the first in their family to attend university, whereas I was asked the question on numerous forms when applying to/attending university, applying for training contracts, in interviews etc.

I’ve seen a lot of comments about it accompanied by something like “my parents were lovely, hard workers” etc.

One of my best friends growing up was raised by junkies hence I thought it a little strange people talking about not having uni going parents as if it was a huge hardship when it’s statistically pretty normal

Every single assertion you have made is based on your own experiences, people have overwhelmingly said that you are being unreasonable (as you asked whether you were), explained why they consider it so, and provided resources/statistics in support of what they say, which you appear not to have engaged with at all...

I think it’s very rare to have parents who can’t read if you’re my age tbh that would be very unusual and I acknowledge you’re childhood probably would have been very hard if that was the case

@Kyrgyzstan a quick google tells me that almost 20% of adults aged 16 to 65 can be described as having "very poor literacy skills." This means they can understand short straightforward texts on familiar topics accurately and independently, and obtain information from everyday sources but reading information from unfamiliar sources or on unfamiliar topics could cause problems. This is also known as being functionally illiterate.

So not really rare at all, just outside of your experience.

I'm actually amazed at the number of posts here, explaining the flaws in your viewpoint but you just aren't prepared to accept that you might be wrong.

I said it’s rare not to be able to read at all.
Anyway I’ll copy and paste what I said to someone else.

How many people have parents who help them with their GCSEs? That’s the teachers job! My parents were old af when they had me so had no idea what a gcse was (called something else back in their day) I still got pretty good GCSEs and I was five months pregnant when I took them.
I knew a girl who’s parents were alcoholics and junkies and her house was a complete mess with no where to study now if SHE had gotten a degree or even an a level it would of been a great achievement. Like I say I acknowledge some people have it a lot harder but I don’t think not having parents that went to uni is unusual

That's generally not the type of background the statement refers to. In fact, one poster has specificially pointed out that many careers now, such as nursing, have always been skilled jobs, they just didn't require the degree that they do currently.

As pointed out previously, many doesn't mean the same as all. Not everyone who is first in their family to go to university will face barriers and, even those that do, won't necessarily face all of the same barriers. The facts remain the same, however, that most people who are first in their family to go to university do face barriers and people whose parents did not go to university are less likely to go themselves and face poorer job and money making opportunities.

Coming from an educated, privileged background obviously puts you several steps ahead of those who do not.

That’s fair enough. But I think your experience is more unusual than mine, even at dcs primary school I’m one of the only ones who makes them do their homework and we are years away from gcses

I'll copy and past what I responded to you on this....

Lots of people! My parents helped me so did many of my friends' parents. It's not just about helping with the content it's things such as study techniques, ensuring your child knows what to expect, time management, providing them with a safe/secure home in which to revise.

I don't know where you're getting your stats from. Google tells me that it was more like 1 in 7 at the beginning of the 1980s and more like 1 in 5 by the end of the decade. Certainly, there was nothing unusual about my dsis going to uni from our state comprehensive school in the 1980s. I think pretty much all of her close friends went as well.

Your parents were obviously on the older end of the age spectrum for becoming parents, so most of your peers would have had parents who were a bit younger than yours. If you grew up in an average town, then it's highly likely that quite a few of them would have had at least one parent who had been to university. You are just making assumptions that they didn't, but perhaps they did, and perhaps that's why they ended up going to uni and you didn't.

You seem to be assuming that your peers who went on to university were typically the first in their families to do so, because you are assuming that their parents probably didn't have degrees. But you also say that you never asked the question and that this topic never comes up in real life, so actually you have no idea!

I responded to this but must of pressed the post button at the same time as you