To be upset that friends all love ‘new girl’ when I don’t

[purplerain100]

There’s a small group of us who hang out… all bought together by circumstance, random group but we’ve all clicked & have hung out for coffees/ drinks for about 4 years. We’re not close close friends but as far as ‘new’ friendships go, there’s warmth & support & laughs. I should point out we’re all 40-50 yrs old. About 6 months ago a new girl drifted into the ‘gang’- welcomed by all as others have been over the years. She’s a very big personality. Let’s call her sue. Sue seems to have built bonds with everyone but doesn’t give me the time of day beyond niceties. I’ve realised she has never once asked me a question about myself, in fact it’s like she ignores me.. She talks about herself all the time & every gathering is dominated by sue- it’s like the ‘sue show’ every time we meet. The thing is everyone else laps it up & thinks she’s great. Now I’m thinking maybe these aren’t my people after all. I know this makes me sound jealous & maybe I am. It just makes me sad that a group I thought were my friends all seem to just hinge around sue & I don’t enjoy spending time with them anymore.

If she shuts you down when you try to speak, always make what you say a question to another member of the group (“How are things going with X, Liz?”, etc). Then when Sue interrupts, it will make her look bad to the rest of the group because she’ll be interrupting Liz.

Do this for a while - always make your comments questions to others. Then continue the conversation with Liz or whoever. This will make it hard for Sue to shut you down, ensure you’re not pushed out, and show the others what Sue is like.

Another vote for she's insecure and you know something. I had this exact dynamic with friends where one also happened to be a relative and I knew her very secret & very messed up home life in detail, I think she had had such a nasty experience of people so far in her life that she just assumed on some level that I would use my knowledge against her if given any 'power' so she had to constantly put me down 😔 I feel so sorry for her to this day. But also had to accept that if my friends couldn't see what was going on and kindly tease her out of it, then they weren't the kind of people I wanted as friends really, and moved on. It makes me a bit sad but I don't regret it exactly. Maybe I was never a great friend in the first place 🤷🏽‍♀️

Don’t however tip into gossiping or bad mouthing her, that will reflect badly on you.

Thank you! One of life's fixers, exactly. School mum is not the only time I've been whacked, just the one that fits the OP's case, but I have so many more examples....no good deed goes unpunished indeed. Sorry that you've been stung too.

In schools they define exclusionary behaviour as bullying. So if Sue is freezing you out of conversations and setting up WA groups that she's not adding you to, she's bullying you. Is there someone in the group that you can trust to have a quiet word with, to find out if they know of any issue? You may find that, despite appearances to the contrary, the rest of them are sitting there feeling as frustrated as you with her convo hogging! And are also thinking that everyone else, you included, is in her thrall. Definitely worth putting feelers out, and if anyone else is feeling the same, start meeting up separately. It's a privilege to be invited to join an established friendship group but hijacking it isn't on.

Does anyone have a link to the Wendy thread?

People are massively overthinking and over engineering this.

The hard truth is it’s impossible to know what “Sue” thinks and what is in her head. If I am brutally honest I am not sure how much of this is actually happening and how much is in your head.

Going off on conspiracy theories about whether she thinks you are less easy to manipulate etc (as some people have suggested) won’t help this. It will only make you more paranoid and accentuate to the others that you have a problem with her, which wont make you look good at all.

I have observed this sort of thing play out many times and if there’s one thing I have learned its that you can’t control or even influence how others respond to a person and trying to do so will make you look small and petty.

All you can do is rise above it. Take a step back if you need to. Be pleasant but not overly available and for God’s sake don’t scheme to exclude her of anything like this: it will backfire and make you look ridiculous.

What will be will be and the only thing you have control over is your own behaviour and dignity.

The most annoying thing I find with people like this is when others make excuses ( as with a few posts on here) that these people are lacking in self-confidence, or feeling shy so go OTT in their behaviour.

So what?

They should still have some kind of self awareness of themselves and how they are excluding others.

And why can't their apparent lack of self-confidence result in them being quiet fgs, and not the LOUD LISTEN TO ME EVERYONE person who is such a bore

Agreed. There's no evidence of anything other than that ‘Sue’ and the OP just aren’t crazy about one another. Sue doesn’t have to be an evil Machiavellian mastermind plotting world domination and clocking the OP as resistant to her plots, and the OP doesn’t have to be the only one who chose the red pill. It’s just a clash of personalities, most likely.

First of all, don't remove yourself. Take this as an opportunity to 'study' human behaviour. Sue is an intelligent master manipulator. Her brain runs on limbic power and she can cut through situations with her fast scanning. However, this will also be her downfall. First, look at her background - job?, children? husband? What is her position? Is she stable or does she have a litany of catastrophes behind her? She is probably a good orator and can spin a good yarn to keep people fascinated. I belong to a group where we have a woman like this. Let's call her Big Sue. She is like a galleon in full sail. She enters the room and it stops. There is a discussion, whatever she has done is better, bigger, wider and more powerful than anyone else. Many a time she has made my fur stand on end. However, recently, I came across some evidence (can't say what as it would be outing) that showed her up to be the loneliest, saddest individual. The types of people she hangs out with after midnight - people I would run a mile from for fear of my reputation - the kind of people who make local headlines for shady stuff. She still plays the drama queen as a very mature woman. Your Sue is insecure inside or she is a master narcissist and all of you will soon see her rage side. Just hang in there. It won't last forever.

Sounds like she is using chilly vibes to control - she has clocked you're not buying into the Sue Show. It's a difficult one to handle as your friends are appearing not to see through it. She's doing it because she needs to be central to feel safe. It's a sign of fragility whereas you're showing quiet strength. Honestly, I'd just watch it unfold - you might find yourself drifting a bit from the group as Sue dominates but leave the door open and no need for any drama or getting anyone on side - let it play out. You've clocked her, you have every right to be in the group but if it becomes her group, you can assess your options. It's annoying when you have a good group but things change and not always for the better.

I really hope this is tongue in cheek: it is melodrama worthy of ITV daytime.

None of this woo is going to help the OP. It's going to make her look paranoid and batshit and drive a wedge between her and her friends. No wonder so many people on this forum struggle to make and keep friends with these sorts of attitudes.

People need to massively calm down. All we know for sure is that the OP and Sue don't love each other: we don't really know why and we only have the OP's word that its a Sue problem (as opposed to an OP problem). It's entirely possible that Sue is a harmless person who is trying to make friends and the OP has taken an irrational and jealous dislike to because she doesn't like her friendship group being infiltrated.

If Sue is indeed a master manipulator as some people are speculating then trying all sorts of daft strategies to alienate her is just going to make OP look utterly mad.

This sort of things happens in friendship groups, its as old as the hills and there's nothing you can do about it other than to accept that people make their own choices and sail sweetly on. People will choose who they will choose. You stand the best chance of coming out of it well if you don't behave like a complete dick.

I agree with either edging away from the group or staying and observing for now. I wouldn't start another WhatsApp group. Like you say they aren't even close friends.

@purplerain100 do you have many close friends? Maybe find things to do away from these people?

Trust your gut here. She will out herself soon I promise you!

It is pretty standard stuff in groups. Choose one to one friendships that tend to be free of this kind of dynamics if you find it difficult.

The colleague I mentioned upthread was very manipulative and was only interested in cultivating friendships with people who had something she wanted. That could be anything, admiration/a holiday home/access to the boss. Clearly I didn’t have anything she wanted so I got ignored.

Over time, people began to see through her though she maintained a loyal cohort until she left quite abruptly and ditched the lot of them for a new fan club. Not gonna lie, I did enjoy a bit of schadenfreude when they were all devastated at being dumped.

Came here thinking you meant the show with Zoe D and was disappointed.
Move on if you don't like the vibe, life is too short.

You obviously have little or no experience of real life. I speak from a very experienced and academic background of dealing with troubled people. And, where in my post did I say anything about reacting? Leaving the group? Non, whatsoever! But, I did say stay and observe. Dear, dear me. You really need to get real, smell the coffee and realise what a toxic world we really live in. Are you one of these touchy feely nurturing types?

@MrsDoubtfire1

Dear, dear me. You really need to get real, smell the coffee and realise what a toxic world we really live in. Are you one of these touchy feely nurturing types?

Nope, not touchy feely or nurturing in the slightest. Just can spot someone with an overactive imagination. I don't believe we live in a "toxic" world, though, I believe we live in a world where ordinary people sometimes have entirely human friction. You've speculated all sorts of utterly mad things about a woman you've never met on here, there is no evidence at all behind any of this.

Also let's look at the practical outcome of what you're suggesting. If for the sake of argument "Sue" genuinely is a master manipulator, approaching her with this scheming mindset is going to backfire and make the OP look paranoid and controlling and damage her relationship with this group. If Sue is a ne'er do well the group will eventually figure this out for themselves so scheming and plotting behind her back will achieve nothing except making the OP look hysterical.

If, as seems much more likely, this is just a personality clash between two people who don't gel, there's nothing to be done but just accept that Sue is never going to be the OP's best friend.

It is what it is but I guarantee treating it like the plot of a cheap novel will not help the OP.

Totally agree.

It sound a little bit like Mapp and Lucia, if you haven’t watched it do check it out the bbc version from a few years ago. It will make you laugh.
I had a similar situation, a new lady arrived who I initially really liked until she started making strange comments, silly little things that in the group no one else picked up on. She was both incredibly subtle and incredibly obvious, looking back it all came from a place of deep insecurity. She managed to make a comment every time that intended to make me uncomfortable.
Naively I mentioned it to a close friend, who thought I was being paranoid. So please be wary about mentioning to anyone in your group as they don’t always believe you.

@MrsDoubtfire1, I’d look into getting some help for your pantomime villain worldview. There’s absolutely nothing in any of the OP’s posts to suggest that anyone in this scenario is a ‘troubled’ person, or that this is anything other than a minor clash of personalities of the kind that’s entirely normal in loose friendship groups such as the OP describes.

I'll try and stream this, it sounds good. And has Prunella in it ♥️

If you don’t have a nice time when you go out with them, don’t go out with them.

OP, I would hang in there because I bet you anything this situation will resolve itself. She sounds like a big personality and anyone who is deliberately trying to oust someone else from an established friendship group has a nasty streak. It will just take time for it all to blow up, but it will.

Just hang in there quietly and eventually you will be in a position to sit back and watch it all implode.

For now, talk to others in the group and ignore her.