AIBU to think this tutor has an attitude?

[SoCloseToNothing1981]

First time posting on here (long-time lurker). I'm not sure what I'm looking for here tbh, maybe just a hand-hold or just (brutally) honest opinions, but I'm just feeling a bit weird about a Zoom call I had with my DS' history tutor yesterday. I might be overreacting but it's just left a bad taste in my mouth.

Me and DH decided to get DS a tutor for GCSE History. He's in Year 11 and he's had a bit of a shit time with the course. When he was choosing his options in year 9, his history teacher did recommend that he do geography instead because his essay-writing and memory surrounding dates was not good (he did roughly the same in terms of achievement in both history and geography). The thing is he is interested in it, but he just can't remember key dates very well. The thing is he wants to do history at A Level. I feel bad for him because he likes the subject, but he's just not very good at it and obviously that's problematic if he is considering this subject as a potential academic or career pathway.

So we meet this tutor and he says in our initial meeting with him that tutoring is to complement ongoing revision. I don't agree with this because I view tutoring as teaching my DS how to revise. The tutor says that he likes to do a baseline assessment with the students so he can determine their areas they need work on, which again I found a bit overkill because why are you already testing DS when you haven't taught him how to revise yet?? We scheduled a lesson for later that week, but DS was running a little bit late as he'd woken up late so we only had 30 minutes of a lesson with the tutor (it's all done on Zoom). DS thought he had been working on the Cold War that week in school and so the tutor set him some questions on the Cold War. DS, bless him, really struggled with the first question so didn't have time to look at the rest of the questions. The tutor ran through the questions with DS, and that was when DS realised he hadn't actually done the Cold War and he'd gotten the name confused with something else.

The tutoring has been going on for 2 months, and the tutor scheduled a Zoom call with me to basically tell me that we may want to reconsider choosing History as an A Level option. This really caught me off guard, and it came across as him telling me how to parent my child! He said that there are loads of issues regarding essay-writing and analysing sources and interpretations, and whilst he is totally happy to support DS with this he can't ignore the fact that if these skills aren't being mastered in Year 11 history then this is going to severely set DS back when he starts Year 12. I ask the tutor about what revision methods he has taught DS, and the tutor said that the subject knowledge is a key area of weakness, and DS apparently said to him that he doesn't make notes in the lessons because his teacher isn't good. I said to the tutor that I think DS just needs to be taught how to create his own quizzes, and how to create flashcards and mindmaps. The tutor said that with mocks coming up those "knowledge gaps" need to be filled in. But I'd prefer him to prioritise teaching DS how to revise history, and if I'm asking for a particular service surely I should receive it?

So, AIBU to think this tutor has a bit of an attitude and is overstepping the mark a bit? I don’t need him to tell us which subjects DS should or shouldn’t do at sixth form, I just want him to teach DS how to revise properly!

Lots of great posts on here btw @SoCloseToNothing1981

Please please listen to what the tutor has to say today. Make sure your son is on time and ready to learn. Talk to the tutor about how you see this going forward. Take his advice as he is the expert. All the best to your son – but he might want to reconsider A levels and look at subjects he really enjoys and does well at.

To echo another poster, to do revision you need to have subject content to revise. Until you know the syllabus content, you’ve actually nothing to revise. (I’m a teacher BTW)

Yes I was wondering if English Lit might be more up his street, as you get the ‘olden days vibes’ but without having to refer to dates, facts, cross referencing sources

Oh dear. You asked for a history tutor, but then ask the history tutor to teach revision skills in the vacuum that is your son’s knowledge of history. In all honesty, your son sounds hopelessly disorganised and inattentive. Does he not have a diagnosis for ADHD or dyspraxia or something? And how come you think he is doing OK in other subjects if the problem is his revision skills? Surely an inability to comprehend how to revise effectively would impact every subject?

From the way he worded the response and the fact they are speaking on the phone later, I'd highly likely that he's reconsidering the arrangement.

Many tutors are teachers/ex teachers and one of the benefits is not having to work with families like this if you don't want to.

Most won't continue to work with a family where they don't feel the child is making progress because they're not just in it for the money and there's a high degree of professional integeity involved too. It's not uncommon for tutors to end the tutoring arrangement if the child isn't making progress or even engaged and where the parent has unrealistic expectations and isn't listening.

Is this one of those daft reverses? If not you are being obtuse. Plenty of posters have already told you that. You make way too many excuses for your son and sound a bit slapdash yourself so maybe that is where he gets it from.

A good tutor would always want to establish a baseline. They need to have a starting point to know key weaknesses and where the improvement is needed. What on earth is the point about going on about mindmaps when your son isn't making actual notes during classes and isn't engaging with the subject matter in a meaningful way.

The tutor is not a good fit for you and you are wasting their time and yours. Speak to school,ask which exam board he is studying for history. Print off the curriculum and go from there. If you want a tutor specifically for exam skills try to find someone who focuses in those skills rather than a specific subject so he can learn how to organise, plan and prep his revision no matter what the subject.

It is important to listen to the experts. If his teacher and the tutor are saying he shouldn't pursue history to A-level then maybe he shouldn't. He isn't motivated.

Funnily enough I'd say the poor bloke has seen a mind map before - lol - although @SoCloseToNothing1981 seems to think she's discovered nuclear fusion ...

He's hopefully girding his loins to deal with a yet another parent who thinks by throwing money at something they can overcome their child's lack of ability, hard work and organisation. Must be a hell of a job.

I don't want to be kind about a child, but maybe this is a subject that isn't really for him. Not every subject suits every student.

The only time I've ever used mindmaps is when the essay comes to me very clearly in a kind of flash of inspiration and I want to capture it visually.

I never found them useful unless and until I was all over the topic. (A * student)

ETA they certainly aren't the fundamental aspect of many courses, nor are they a cure for lack of knowledge.

Sorry, but if you know that your son has an online meeting in the morning, you need to get the laptop and charger organised the night before. You need to make sure he has set an alarm and is up on time. These are basic things that he should be responsible for, not you, but in any case you allowed them to happen and wasted the tutor's time. The fact that your son wasn't sure about going ahead with the meeting at all suggests that he is not actually committed to this, and there's nothing worse than tutoring a child who doesn't care. The tutor might be worried that his efforts are going to be pointless with your son, because he struggled to attend his very first session.

You sound obsessed with mind maps (these don’t work for everyone)

Oh god, this! I am one for whom they don't work. They seem messy and disorganised to me. I like a good list, possibly with subsections- which is basically the same process, just without the messiness. But I often feel very alone in feeling this.

Analysis of sources/ historiography is the most important skill in history (and the one that leads to critical reasoning skills, which are beneficial in wider context).

Yes, this. I have said I use the critical thinking and research and writing skills from my history degree far more than my computing skills from my comp sci degree, even though I'm in a technical IT job.

I would listen about the A-level.

It's a different board to DS who did history - wjec - but it was the shear voulme of content that was the issue and he had a very good background knowledge of history and a very good memory for dates and events. He actually did Geography as well - its A-G here - He got A in geography - and most other subjects but a B in history - way too much content. He did science A-levels and is doing a particular typr of engineering degree. I think all the GCSE did was put him off history.

I was heavily involved in GCSE revsion with him - thanks to a school in special measures and huge teahcing churn and DC SEN - he hadn't been taught how to revise - and memory maps aren't acording to research best methods- it's any summary that means you condense information and re-order it and answering previous questions - history the content in middle of all other exams it was really hard to cover it all. My kids and me all hate mind maps - I persoanlly like a summary diagram and kids like bullet point lists.

I would also say DD1 couldn't take history at her school at GCSE and thus couldn't at A-level - her degree in a subject area heavily linked to history. So I'd have a think about what he likes about history and if A-level history is actually needed for a career in that.

Especially a family where the mother is sending the tutor advice on how to tutor 😆

Your DS seems to be floundering and needs help and direction. You're not helping things by your insistence on revision. There's nothing to revise as he doesn't know the content. Just from your posts he seems confused and out of his depth. I think the tutor sounds great and his approach logical, listen to him. If it were me I'd gently steer DS away from History A Levels.

A lovely friend of mine (extremely bright) ‘loves’ history. What she loves are the exciting stories, Ladybird Book style, and there’s nowt wrong with that - I think History as a subject should always start with great stories.

BUT! That’s not what academic history is like. As pps say it’s about research, analysis, evaluation of source material and the construction of well-informed arguments. It’s not for the faint-hearted! OP, you say your son loves history, and that’s great, but it’s not always the same thing as having the intellectual skills and deep interest to study it as an academic subject.

(I speak from long weariness at having to defend history as a subject from a snooty scientist friend who despised students of arts subjects. She thought history was learning dates and recounting the accepted narratives and therefore of no practical use. My son did a history degree and is now a barrister and his training in the rapid absorption of lots of conflicting information and evaluation of the evidence, framing questions etc has been very relevant.)

Geography is probably a better subject to be honest. It would give much better career paths than history (unless he wants to be a history teacher).

Also notes - DS notes in all subjects were bloody awful and were often taken in and lost by school. He was also in a few subjects told off for making notes - as the were using pre printed work books and it was "unnecessary" apparently.

We relied heavily on bought GCSE text books for correct board - work books and past papers. You do have to make sure notes are taken from the appropriate GCSE revsion books - and that their questions at end of chapters and sections are all done. His history teacher was awful for sending as revision the most verbose dense materials last minute - so text books with nice clear summaries were vital. My daughetrs have need less input and been more hands off but even they've benefited from revison books and past paper questions.

Also with history - find the correct time periods and watch documentaries or short summaries on youtube - help cement key points in downtime as well.

I don't understand why you're so focused on revision when he doesn't have the subject knowledge. You can't revise what you don't know. How can he make a mind map if he doesn't know what to put on the mind map? The tutor is saying he basically needs to start from scratch with the subject knowledge and building his essay writing skills. Revision comes AFTER you've got the knowledge and skills, revision is not how you learn.

They’re all considerably harder than History at A level.

Oh Dear OP.
What is your educational standard? Do you not have any experience to draw on? Do you remember revising GCSEs? Do you remember studying GCSEs?
Let me tell you how it works: Students start studying in year 10. They take notes in lessons and complete homework tasks. At the end of each topic they will have an assessment. They will use their notes to revise and complete the assessment. They will have assessments or exams every half term or every term. Teachers will also be marking their homework.
Have you been attending parents' evening and getting feedback on all of this? Have you been getting a school report with his exam/assessment results?
In year 11 the studying and assessment continues until sometime after Christmas. Then students switch to full on revision mode. This is hard work. They will draw on 2 years of written notes in order to do this. They may be bombarded with exam questions. (They can draw mind maps if it helps). But they need to be able to write an essay. The examiner is not looking for a mind map.
Sorry to tell you this, but you have about 6 months until the exams and about 18 months worth of notes to get written.
I suggest that when he comes home from school you should say "Have you had a good day at school today. What did you do in History" Then check what he has actually produced in his lesson.
Then I suggest that you buy a GCSE revision book - available at all good booksellers. Start helping him to write up 18 months worth of notes. Spend an hour a week on this. Keep the tutor if he will agree to stay.

There’s only one person here with an attitude and it’s not the tutor.

Two people (OP and her son) and not the tutor.

DS thought he had been working on the Cold War that week in school and so the tutor set him some questions on the Cold War. DS, bless him, really struggled with the first question so didn't have time to look at the rest of the questions. The tutor ran through the questions with DS, and that was when DS realised he hadn't actually done the Cold War and he'd gotten the name confused with something else.

I just can't get past this. This is not a boy who "loves history", as you claim.

I dont know how you think a mind map or quiz will help. DS will be learning revision techniques across the board in school and more wont help.

Let me summarise what you've told me in your OP:

DS doesnt pay enough attention in his lesson to know if he was studying the cold war or not

DS cant remember dates associated with any of the historical events hes supposedly interested in

DS isnt making notes in history because he thinks his teacher isnt very good

You arranged a tutor for DS because he says he likes this subject and his first session was 30mins because he slept in?

School is teaching him history from the syllabus, the tutor (against your preference) is teaching him history and DS still has knowledge gaps, as well as issues like essaywriting (which may impact others subjects) and analysising sources.

With respect, he doesnt sound passionate about history. He sounds lazy and like he knows best. Which tbh the "knowing best" he seems to get from you. Yes if you pay for a service, I can understand why youd want to confirm what you want from it. But youre actually paying for someone to help DS pass history, and if you knew how to do that or it was just about flashcards you could do it yourself. You didnt you hired this person who is so attentive and honest hes told you your son should reconsider despite the fact it may mean you no longer need his services.

I think he sounds a really decent, fair and honest tutor. If you dont, end the arrangement. If you want DS to learn some revision techniques, fine but he cant revise what he doesnt know. And any revision technique I ever learnt started with learning the information and taking notes. Sounds like DS isnt doing well enough to revise it yet.

But id caution you to consider his advice. Because honestly if DS isnt taking notes and cant remember what he studied that week and cant get up prompt for the tutoring appointment in the subject he "loves" hes not going to improve with flash cards or mind maps.

Apologies if I've missed this, but does your DS have any SEN either diagnosed or suspected such as dyslexia or ADHD? That would affect working memory around facts. Processing issues could be to blame for mistaking the term Cold War for something else. It could explain the running late/ disorganisation. None of that should rule him out from doing A-level history if that is where his interest lies.

Sounds like he needs more support in general with essay writing and studying. I would have an urgent chat with the school. Is he getting tutoring in English? That would be worth looking into with a tutor who specialises in dyslexia - if that is the case. I would also make contact with the college/ sixth form where he plans to do A-levels and speak to the SENCO there. I would be tempted to go down the private assessment route to get things moving quickly. He is unlikely to get any extra time at this point but worth doing what you can. The more you know, the better you can support.