AIBU to think this tutor has an attitude?

[SoCloseToNothing1981]

First time posting on here (long-time lurker). I'm not sure what I'm looking for here tbh, maybe just a hand-hold or just (brutally) honest opinions, but I'm just feeling a bit weird about a Zoom call I had with my DS' history tutor yesterday. I might be overreacting but it's just left a bad taste in my mouth.

Me and DH decided to get DS a tutor for GCSE History. He's in Year 11 and he's had a bit of a shit time with the course. When he was choosing his options in year 9, his history teacher did recommend that he do geography instead because his essay-writing and memory surrounding dates was not good (he did roughly the same in terms of achievement in both history and geography). The thing is he is interested in it, but he just can't remember key dates very well. The thing is he wants to do history at A Level. I feel bad for him because he likes the subject, but he's just not very good at it and obviously that's problematic if he is considering this subject as a potential academic or career pathway.

So we meet this tutor and he says in our initial meeting with him that tutoring is to complement ongoing revision. I don't agree with this because I view tutoring as teaching my DS how to revise. The tutor says that he likes to do a baseline assessment with the students so he can determine their areas they need work on, which again I found a bit overkill because why are you already testing DS when you haven't taught him how to revise yet?? We scheduled a lesson for later that week, but DS was running a little bit late as he'd woken up late so we only had 30 minutes of a lesson with the tutor (it's all done on Zoom). DS thought he had been working on the Cold War that week in school and so the tutor set him some questions on the Cold War. DS, bless him, really struggled with the first question so didn't have time to look at the rest of the questions. The tutor ran through the questions with DS, and that was when DS realised he hadn't actually done the Cold War and he'd gotten the name confused with something else.

The tutoring has been going on for 2 months, and the tutor scheduled a Zoom call with me to basically tell me that we may want to reconsider choosing History as an A Level option. This really caught me off guard, and it came across as him telling me how to parent my child! He said that there are loads of issues regarding essay-writing and analysing sources and interpretations, and whilst he is totally happy to support DS with this he can't ignore the fact that if these skills aren't being mastered in Year 11 history then this is going to severely set DS back when he starts Year 12. I ask the tutor about what revision methods he has taught DS, and the tutor said that the subject knowledge is a key area of weakness, and DS apparently said to him that he doesn't make notes in the lessons because his teacher isn't good. I said to the tutor that I think DS just needs to be taught how to create his own quizzes, and how to create flashcards and mindmaps. The tutor said that with mocks coming up those "knowledge gaps" need to be filled in. But I'd prefer him to prioritise teaching DS how to revise history, and if I'm asking for a particular service surely I should receive it?

So, AIBU to think this tutor has a bit of an attitude and is overstepping the mark a bit? I don’t need him to tell us which subjects DS should or shouldn’t do at sixth form, I just want him to teach DS how to revise properly!

You’re totally unreasonable. Your son should have study skills by now. Would you rather the tutor continue to take your money, even though your son has little aptitude and motivation for the subject?!

As others have said, you can’t revise what you never knew in the first place. If DS is genuinely interested in history there’s nothing stopping him learning about it as a hobby, but I don’t think doing it for A level is a good idea.

My DS did history and philosophy A levels. Having spent a lot of time helping him revise ... history is very fact based, lots of remembering things in order to argue and structure the essay. If he's showing little inclination to remember dates and things now, he will struggle.
Philosophy is strangely another memory subject. You have to precisely learn lots of different ethical and philosophical arguments and be able to quote them in the correct way. These are often very similar to each other. It was a lot of flash card revision. To get you to the point where, again, you can start writing an essay/argument.
If DS does not love these topics then it will be tough for him to do. If he does not like or is not good at essays. It will be tough for him to do.

If you know exactly what he needs - mind maps etc, why are you wasting money on a tutor? There is endless material online for how to revise effectively, even on Tiktok etc.

When I was studying A level law, I needed to remember countless law cases and the dates. Our teacher taught us to write down all the cases and make a little saying out of the first letter of each case, eg the following would be ‘the cat sat on the mat’. Its a good way of remembering it.

Thomas v crown
Clarke v crown
Smith v crown
Owen v crown
Thompson v crown
Matthews v crown

Spend some time researching techniques and find one that suits him. But to revise, you need to know the content. Does he? He’s not even making notes. He should find some bitesize videos on each topic, and get up to speed with all the info before looking at revising.

History requires you to be a good essay writer. If he’s not, and struggles with memory, it’s not the right subject for A level. He’s got time to increase his knowledge on each topic. Pick one and spend some time helping him to learn the content and remember dates etc. Then randomly test him over dinner etc. Put the dates on the fridge - kitchen cupboards etc

I can't believe that you didn't ensure that your DS was ready in time for his tutorial by making sure that he woke up in time and had found his laptop charger and charged his laptop.

History is one of those subjects where you need to be able to retain historical facts which involves revising and remembering stuff which your DS seems incapable of doing. There isn't a magic wand to wave so that your DS suddently becomes good at History without him (and you) taking the advice of an experienced tutor rather than thinking that you know best.

You lost my sympathy when you wrote 'bless him'

What’s the highest level of education in history that you have obtained, OP? It sounds as if you are telling his tutor how to do this job, what are your credentials?

Tutors can’t make the impossible happen. You have a son who doesn’t really give a shit, doesn’t make notes, turns up late, puts no meaningful effort in, and frankly is not good at history. The tutor can’t complete your son’s history assessment for him, and your son has been through 3 history tutors now. Most pupils that succeed in history do it without the help of a tutor. Yet your son, with every opportunity given to him, still doesn’t get it. A tutor can’t make someone who fundamentally isn’t capable, capable unfortunately. No matter how much money or “mind maps” you throw at a stone, you can’t make blood come out of a stone.

This is a wind up ! The OP just keeps coming back more and more ghastly😂

You really need to listen to the tutor here, your DS is clearly no good at history. Why don’t you suggest that he has it as a hobby but focuses on the things that he’s good at for actual exams? It sounds like he likes it but would probably get more pleasure from it without the pressure of exams.

How can the tutor teach your son how to revise when DS has not learnt the content of the course work? You should be asking DS to take down notes from his lessons so that he has something to revise.
You should learn, yourself, what the topic and content is each week. Have DS tell you and show you his notes. Encourage your DS to reread texts and rewrite out key points from his notes.
Your DS has to motivate himself to do things better.

You can do that and also ask his teacher what it is that DS needs to know.

The tutor doesn't seem unreasonable at all.
You should expect that DS is not suited to History; you have been told that already.
Does your DS also need to have intense lessons in how to construct sentences and write in precise English?

Definitely do not take history at A Level! If he needs tutoring at GCSE, he will not cope with A Level.

Stop messing the tutor about when it comes to lesson times. It’s really rude! I’m not surprised that he’s been a bit off with you.

It can be hard to get the balance right between supporting your kids and letting them get on with things to build up their own resilience and independence, but my guess is that you are possibly doing too much for your DS at this age and stage. You are just a mum trying to do her best, but you have had some good advice on this thread, even if it has been blunt at times.

Do you have someone IRL who you trust to be honest with you?

The arrogance, the entitlement, the demands, the insistence on being right, the enabling of what sounds like a lazy, passive, unmotivated student...as someone who used to tutor id run a fucking mile. If you do insist on banging a very worn drum, I would:

• start respecting your tutors expertise, advice and judgment (especially as you so clearly know nothing about tutoring)
• work on your manners
• show some humility
• start expecting (a lot) more from your son
• teach your son some manners
• stop blaming the world around you for not bending to your demands and turn the spotlight on yourself. There's a very loud, obvious, common denominator here
• be aware that if you keep disregarding professionals, the result will not be good
• start listening to other people, namely the 98% who think you are being entirely unreasonable know that your name will be known in circles now as being that* type of parent and child
• grow the fuck up. I genuinely cannot believe some people navigate the world with this attitude. Fascinating.

Hth.

In the kindest way possible, you need to listen to the tutor here. He’s reached year 11, getting close to the mock exams next month and he’s still struggling to retain basic information but more importantly, to structure and write essays.

He needs to practise the essay writing more than revise the topics imo. It obviously isn’t just history, it’s definitely English and possibly some of this other choice subjects (I know my DS writes a lot in photography for example).

Enjoying a subject isn’t enough to study it at a higher level. He needs to work on his writing and comprehension skills.

YAB(hugely)U @SoCloseToNothing1981

We scheduled a lesson for later that week, but DS was running a little bit late as he'd woken up late so we only had 30 minutes of a lesson with the tutor (it's all done on Zoom). DS thought he had been working on the Cold War that week in school and so the tutor set him some questions on the Cold War. DS, bless him, really struggled with the first question so didn't have time to look at the rest of the questions

So many things wrong with this paragraph in the absence of SEN. None of this is acceptable even in a younger child.
And “ bless him”?!! No wonder he is struggling. How can he not remember the topic he studied the previous week? Stop enabling him.

I view tutoring as teaching my DS how to revise

Your son needs to know the subject material in order to revise. He can’t write mind maps and flash cards with blank information. He really should have be told by you/your DH that he is in charge of his own learning - if he doesn’t understand a topic, look it up, there are huge amount of resources out there. He can’t be passive in his education especially once he gets to A level.
Are A levels suitable for him? Such a big jump from GCSEs.

Harsh words warning but it’s not the tutor that has the attitude, it’s you & your DH for enabling your son to be disorganised, not taking ownership of his learning & disrespectful of his teacher’s & tutor’s time.

Good god. School have advised it isn’t the right subject for him at A level, your son struggles (which you admit) and now the tutor has advised against it and you get in a strop about it?
You are NOT helping your son. I was a teacher and my good friend teaches History at A-level. It’s an essay-heavy, difficult subject if someone is struggling at GCSE level. Do you want him to fail miserably? That’s where you are headed.

Your son isn’t right for it. You need to have that conversation with him.
The entitlement from you is actually mind blowing.

But any history grad will know one of the first things you learn at uni is that to be a good historian, you don’t need to memorise dates. It goes much deeper than the dates and precise facts. It’s core and critical analysis, close to English in that sense.

I started off as dual honours English Lit and History but didn’t enjoy the History side as much because the writing style was different, they were more pedantic with backing up every single point you made with evidence. In English I could just write a really banging piece filled with my own critical analysis which I enjoyed greatly. The two subjects are still interlinked e.g I lecture in American Lit so I’m always linking back to colonialism, civil rights, Jim Crow etc. I need to know a few core dates but I don’t expect and would not want my students to reel off dates in an essay. It isn’t enough at that level.

Anyway beside the by, OP’s DS needs to rethink his A Level subjects unless he’s willing to put in hard graft to practise essay writing.

And you can’t revise stuff if you know nothing about it. Your son sounds like he’s actually quite lazy- not concentrating in class or taking notes.
You’ve gone through 2 tutors already who aren’t right for your clearly ‘perfect’ boy.
How about looking at the common denominator in this situation and stop blaming everyone else??
I do wonder how people like yourself never look inwards and contemplate whether this might actually be a ‘you’ problem. It’s like people who fall out with everyone and never consider if the problem might actually be them and not other people.

I haven’t read all the replies so apologies if this has been said already.
I understand that you value revision, it is a key tool in allowing children to show the best of what they can do in exams. However as the tutor has said, if the knowledge isn’t there, you need to learn it before you can revise it.
To compare it to the example your friend gave about the mind map for English. Say he was writing about the Roman invasions of England (primary history) and he began to mind map about the different attempts, the emperors, dates etc but found he knew there were 3 could only remember 2 names, one of the dates etc. Before he can write an essay of decent quality he needs to know these facts to then do anything with them.

Perhaps he is struggling with retention, in which case regular revision on material quickly after the point of learning and repeatedly may support him. Could you try asking him about what he learned straight after the session and you make notes on it while it is fresh in his head, modelling how to make flashcards and notes. Then ask him again in the morning about it and again at least once before his next tutor session?
I teach primary so don’t know much about the skills needed by GCSE though. But you can help him with this aspect while the tutor teaches him the knowledge and then once he is building that can teach him what to do with it. Apologies for the essay!!

Is your son in the first or second year of A level? (I may have missed this if you have said already.) If the second year, it is worth considering starting a different A level, and doing a 3rd year of A levels. Or even starting A level history again, if he is really set on doing it. If it is his first year, it is not too late to change things; make sure he takes notes, talks to the teacher when he needs extra help etc.
Any tutor worth their salt will do a baseline assessment in their first session. They don't know if they are working with a whizz kid or someone who needs the basics otherwise.

The tutor is giving you the heads-up that they think your son will struggle. Does the school agree?

To ask for revision help is fine, but your son needs to have something under his belt to revise in the first place. If he doesn't know key facts and possible essay arguments, what would he put on a mind map? Or are you asking the tutor to create a mind map for him with those facts and arguments to give your son something to revise in the first place? There is a difference.
It is ok to change your mind re A level subjects. People do it all the time. A tutor will not be a magic fix. It has to be a two-way process between student and tutor. It sounds like your son is out of his depth, to be honest, and that is ok too. It can be sorted by Plan B!

You should have made sure your son got up early enough for his first tutoring session. That was very rude.
Revision techniques are taught in school, that’s why they have tests all the way through.
The upcoming mocks will give you an idea of his knowledge, anything below a 6 at this stage then forget doing it at A level.
If he doesn’t make notes, what is he revising from? Just the revision guides?

I have sent the tutor a sample mind-map template my friend uses with her class as I thought it might help him see what I mean. He hasn't replied yet, which again is frustrating.

The tutor knows what a mind map is. The issue is your son will have no information to put on the mind map.if he doesn't have the subject knowledge.

I do see your point about baseline assessments but I just feel like it could have been done after teaching him some strategies rather than at the very start of the tutoring journey.

The baseline assessment enables the tutor to see exactly what your son does and doesn't know. Exactly where the gaps in his learning are. Otherwise, how can he plan what he teaches?

He needs to get a feel for what any student can do himself. I'd be more concerned about a tutor who didn't do a baseline assessment because where would they be planning on even starting?

It sounds as if the tutor is giving entirely appropriate advice. It also sounds as if your son is simply not suited to studying history. Is your son good at any subjects? It is really odd to want to study a subject at A level when he clearly struggles with that subject.

How can the tutor teach him to revise when there is nothing to revise as your child has not absorbed any content?

There is no gain in the tutor behaving this way. Think about it. If he was just after regular sessions and money, he could do exactly as you said and keep your child struggling with A-level history and have a regular income coming in. But he has been clear and open and honest with you both rather than misleading you both and taking your money. I think it’s quite impressive.

But this is all about you and your son. You should not have been late. You should have had the laptop set up and your son set up at least five minutes ahead of the Zoom call. You are making excuses for your lack of organisation. It is not the tutor's fault. From the rest of what you have written, your son is no good at history or else he would be getting a grip by now. It is quite a tough subject and you have to be fairly academic. Brushing off the basics with he is not very good at remembering dates is a big red flag. The tutor is doing his job and being brutally honest with you for which you are paying. Dear me, if I had pupils and parents like you when I was tutoring I would definitely refuse to continue. He is not a servant or a service you can buy for your historically inept son. He is someone who probably has a first degree, if not second, in history and he takes pride in his work. Are you sure your son would not be better of doing a subject he is good at or possibly concentrating on getting good results in English and Maths to give him some sort of a start re A levels or an apprenticeship, if he can get on.

I feel like some people are completely missing the point. I want to make sure he is getting the right support.
i feel like the focus keeps drifting away from the key issue which is about how DS is revising and whether he's getting real, structured guidance.

I’m not sure that your understanding of the situation is giving you the best insight into it.

First of all, the baseline is the starting point, so it has to be done at the beginning of the tutoring journey, as you put it. It informs the tutor’s planning for that journey.
Secondly, revision is for when you learned the stuff a while ago and need to freshen your knowledge. But it sounds like your son hasn’t learned a lot of what he needs to know at all, so revision is impossible and revision techniques pointless. He needs to learn it.
Thirdly, from what you are saying about his grades and performance, he will struggle with all the essay subjects. It doesn’t sound as if he is motivated to do what needs to be done in the lessons (like make notes) and his skills are ok for GCSE but poor for A level (English predicted grade 6).

I don’t say this to be mean, but I have taught an essay subject at A level to people with grades in the 4-6 range for English, and they have really struggled. It’s a big step up anyway to A level and you do need those basic skills in making an argument, and if at this point in Y11 you don’t even have the facts and awareness to base your argument on, you’re on an uphill journey. I do wonder whether you and your son both expect him to be handed his results on a plate (he doesn’t make notes in history because the teacher isn’t very good!? Really!?)

As he’s not that academic in the humanities, maybe you should start looking at the sciences, maths, or more vocational pathways like T levels? A levels are not for everyone, even if they’re intelligent: they assess a very specific set of academic skills.