AIBU to think this tutor has an attitude?

[SoCloseToNothing1981]

First time posting on here (long-time lurker). I'm not sure what I'm looking for here tbh, maybe just a hand-hold or just (brutally) honest opinions, but I'm just feeling a bit weird about a Zoom call I had with my DS' history tutor yesterday. I might be overreacting but it's just left a bad taste in my mouth.

Me and DH decided to get DS a tutor for GCSE History. He's in Year 11 and he's had a bit of a shit time with the course. When he was choosing his options in year 9, his history teacher did recommend that he do geography instead because his essay-writing and memory surrounding dates was not good (he did roughly the same in terms of achievement in both history and geography). The thing is he is interested in it, but he just can't remember key dates very well. The thing is he wants to do history at A Level. I feel bad for him because he likes the subject, but he's just not very good at it and obviously that's problematic if he is considering this subject as a potential academic or career pathway.

So we meet this tutor and he says in our initial meeting with him that tutoring is to complement ongoing revision. I don't agree with this because I view tutoring as teaching my DS how to revise. The tutor says that he likes to do a baseline assessment with the students so he can determine their areas they need work on, which again I found a bit overkill because why are you already testing DS when you haven't taught him how to revise yet?? We scheduled a lesson for later that week, but DS was running a little bit late as he'd woken up late so we only had 30 minutes of a lesson with the tutor (it's all done on Zoom). DS thought he had been working on the Cold War that week in school and so the tutor set him some questions on the Cold War. DS, bless him, really struggled with the first question so didn't have time to look at the rest of the questions. The tutor ran through the questions with DS, and that was when DS realised he hadn't actually done the Cold War and he'd gotten the name confused with something else.

The tutoring has been going on for 2 months, and the tutor scheduled a Zoom call with me to basically tell me that we may want to reconsider choosing History as an A Level option. This really caught me off guard, and it came across as him telling me how to parent my child! He said that there are loads of issues regarding essay-writing and analysing sources and interpretations, and whilst he is totally happy to support DS with this he can't ignore the fact that if these skills aren't being mastered in Year 11 history then this is going to severely set DS back when he starts Year 12. I ask the tutor about what revision methods he has taught DS, and the tutor said that the subject knowledge is a key area of weakness, and DS apparently said to him that he doesn't make notes in the lessons because his teacher isn't good. I said to the tutor that I think DS just needs to be taught how to create his own quizzes, and how to create flashcards and mindmaps. The tutor said that with mocks coming up those "knowledge gaps" need to be filled in. But I'd prefer him to prioritise teaching DS how to revise history, and if I'm asking for a particular service surely I should receive it?

So, AIBU to think this tutor has a bit of an attitude and is overstepping the mark a bit? I don’t need him to tell us which subjects DS should or shouldn’t do at sixth form, I just want him to teach DS how to revise properly!

This! I was (back in the day) an A/A* student at GCSE level. My Year 9 History teacher even went to the head of year and specifically asked for whichever GCSE class I was going to be in so she could teach me. I got 99% on several exercises.

I was HUMBLED INTO DUST for my first A Level History essay because I really underestimated the jump in quality they were looking for. To the point where I actually asked for a redo and did the whole thing over in one night.

I have absolutely no doubt that you can find a tutor who tells you what you want to hear. That your ds is doing really well and is going to soar into Alevels.
There's plenty of them about.

You'll find them easily by looking at the last couple of GCSE years from the parents who were saying "I don't understand why he did so badly. His tutor said he was doing so well..."

You've got a good tutor here. Telling uncomfortable truths is much harder than pretending it's going swimmingly. Either listen and use him or release the spot to someone who will appreciate his ability and experience.

@SoCloseToNothing1981
Your attitude is the issue here, not the tutor’s attitude! Tutors generally see students for an hour a week, this isn’t a lot of time for year 11 students so of course they are going to do baseline tests to identify areas to focus on.
To say you don’t agree with your DC having to revise outside of the lesson is ridiculous. Tuition should supplement the student’s independent learning. You can’t seriously expect your DC to make any progress from one hour a week with no effort from themselves outside of this. It’s also worth thinking about the fact that a growing number of tutors are teachers who have left mainstream teaching due to poor parental attitudes, unless you start showing the tutor a bit more respect don’t be surprised if they ditch your DC as not having to deal with shitty parents is definitely a perk of the job!

I didn't read the whole thread before replying, so if taken it at face value...

Having now gone through it all, I'm absolutely convinced that the story is true, but OP is actually the put upon tutor letting off some steam before she gives the mum an unwanted lesson about where she should shove her mind map 🤣

Unlike all the history graduates answering here, I simply cannot 'do' subjects that require retention of precise facts. I have failed utterly spectacularly at History, Geography, Law and a subject called International Trade that was about various customs protocols and taxation (I still knew a lot more about it than all the businesses expecting Brexit to be a piece of cake, though!)

It's something to do with patterning, but impossible to explain what the problem is. I'm intelligent. I'm good at maths, very good at language and great at the big picture. I scored 93% in my Economics final and 26% in Law. I'm actually very engaged by history and geography, but I'll never be 'good at' them because certain kinds of data refuse to be trapped by my mind.

It's just the way it is - give me a big picture issue, like how Britain responded to the Roman occupation and its aftermath, and I could probably keep you interested over dinner and through drinks afterwards. Just don't expect me to know the years these things happened, where battles were fought or the names of the key players.

I reckon you and DS need to work out where his strengths are and play to those. Since you like systems, do a SWOT analysis. Put in the requirements of any subject he's considering, relegate the ones with high weakness/threat scores to personal interests, and develop studies that match well with his strengths & opportunities.

Oh, and I think you owe the tutor an apology.

If he can’t hack history, he’ll struggle with philosophy and ethics. It’s a tough subject which requires a lot of abstract analytical and critical thinking. Just don’t go there.

Perfect answer here !!

OP - some kids want to be the next Jo Jo siwa - but it ain’t gonna happen !
your DS is not a good history student, it’s a good lesson to recognise what we want is not the same as what we can actually do -
stop blaming the tutors !!!

ps I hate all the you can achieve anything (if I keep saying you can) bollocks !!

That might not be the issue. Not assuming OP's son is the same as me but, for illustration, abstract analytical and critical thinking suit me down to the ground. It's the philosophers' dates and exact quotes that would screw me over. I expect you have to learn a lot of those in preliminary studies.

Good grief. So you aren't a teacher but have the audacity to think you should tell this guy how to do his job?! I've been a teacher since 1989. I fully agree with the tutor that he needs to teach your child the actual History. He can't revise what he's learnt until he's learnt something!! Starting with a baseline test to find out where the gaps are is completely correct. Your child sounds very weak and definitely not suitable to take History at A level! He "thought' he'd been studying The Cold War?! He doesn't even know what he's been studying and can't do the gcse without a tutor and you think he'll be able to do it at A level?! Stop making excuses for him. And stop trying to tell a teacher how to do their job. Why haven't you taught your child how to revise if you're such an expert?! Thank you, though, for reminding everyone why teachers are at their wit's end most of the time.

This cannon be real, surely?

You're sending the tutor mind maps and revision techniques and telling him how to do his job?

He needs to drop you as a client and you need to stop trying to make your DS do History because he's not going to do well

You've got a History Tutor when you really want a Study Skills Tutor

It's like hiring a drum instructor and getting annoyed he isn't teaching music theory instead

You’re going round in circles? Not half as much as everyone else on this thread. You’re not listening at all.

I'm still trying to work our what he could possibly have confused with the Cold War. Warfare in cold weather? Is he thinking of Napoleon's long retreat from Moscow? Or the Eastern Front? The mind boggles.

Firstly, imagine you employed a coach to teach your son how to run 100m really fast. The coach will need to know how fast your son can run before they start a training plan.

That’s what baseline means.

Secondly, the tutor cannot teach your son to revise notes that haven’t been made.

OP I think part of your issue is that you seem to have a fairly fixed idea of what tutoring should be and you have a tutor with a different idea of what he’s offering.

And that with your experience of what sound like some truly awful previous tutors and your (I think admirable) desire to do everything you can to help your DS be able to do the A levels he’s most interested in have put you on edge and are making interactions you might otherwise have taken in your stride feel more personal.

Your son’s tutor might have an attitude, he might not. Sighing on your first session was unprofessional even though you were late. But that doesn’t mean his assessment of your DS’s capacity for history A level at this stage is wrong. He’s just giving you a heads up. He’d be remiss not to. You don’t have to do anything with the advice.

Have you tried talking to the tutor about all this?

Maybe see if he’d do a few extra sessions with DS where he goes over revision techniques, history essay structure, how to analyze a source, etc.? It may be that his school has terrible history teaching (I know we had a couple of dud subjects when I was in school, though we still got reasonable results over all) or a teacher he just doesn’t gel with.

HRTFT. I got to the part where you said DS is doing really well... a six in English... I am now struggling to believe the veracity of your OP. DD has just started university. She attended a non-selective bog-standard Northern comp .and waa told to hope to do well at A levels she should be looking at (minimally) 7s at GCSE in the subject, preferably 8s.
DD gained a 9 in GCSE history and still didn't take it at A level. If your DS can't even recognise what subject he learned in lesson this week and isn't working near a six, which you consider to be doing well, it seems insane he'd even consider History at A level. The tutor isn't a magician.

“DS just needs to be taught how to create his own quizzes, and how to create flashcards and mindmaps”

I am really surprised you think this is the solution. It’s unlikely he does not know how to write a flash card - he just needs to do it. Seriously, just get him to write flash cards and either test your son with the factual info yourself or hire a 6th form A level student to do it for you.

My son did GCSE history, he got a 9 but I suspect it’s because he is good at essay writing (went on to study English literature for A level) and has a good memory (was literally learning dates the night before his exams).

If your son can not get a 7 (or at least a 6 for some schools usually privates) for gcse history he will not be allowed to take it for A level.

Work out how he remembers facts and dates - I would link dates for my son to other important events in his life ie remember the second war ended in the same day of the month as your birthday etc etc

Can I just add despite getting a 9 in history and my son liking history - his career guidance suggested he did not do it at A level as it was a lot of work and unnecessary unless he wanted to study history at uni

Please do not encourage him to do philosophy and ethics - it’s a lot of essay writing and remembering which philosopher had which theory and then applying this to a question plus also remembering quotes. My daughter got a 9 for gcse English ( including 100% for paper 1) and a 8 for English literature and she struggled with P&E as she has a poor memory.
also economics - you said your son was ok at maths rather than good at maths. My son was told not to do economics unless he was also studying maths at A levels (he got an 8 for gcse maths so was capable of maths). Maybe business is a better option for your son at A level as a 6 in English should be ok

I am gobsmacked at your blinkers OP. Your DS is headed for a max grade 5 in history. You have been through 3 tutors, unashamedly turn up late for sessions, he can't even say what topic he's studying, isn't interested enough to make notes in class. Instead of blaming everyone else, stop ignoring the elephant in the room - your DS is not going to be good enough to do it for A level.

Fortunately, history is a subject that's easily accessible as an hobby for those interested in it - books, podcasts, online discussion. Encourage that for your DS.

I'm somewhat unconvinced the DS is even going to history classes. Is the teacher a timid or scatty type, visibly weary of trying to corral insubordinate teenagers and/or exclusively engaged with the keen students?

I once skived a whole term of English Lit. Our teacher was very sweet but boring as hell, and the class was a three-hour block. The term I skived was Wordsworth and his fucking daffodils. Whiny git!

OP, I would recommend you show your son how to take notes. The inability to do this will impact massively. He only needs to take down the pertinent information but if he is unable to do this he’s going to struggle.
If you hope for your son to manage A Level history he also needs to be able to debate the issues and give his own views. This requires critical thinking skills and he either has the ability or he hasn’t.
To create an essay on history or any other subject, he will need good written English skills.
As a pointer in the right direction, I would suggest he goes onto a history forum and read what people are discussing and how they express themselves.
I wish your son well, especially if he enjoys history.

I loved history as a kid, GCSE history was the highlight of my entire education. I was going through all the GCSE reading material, and whatever else I could get my hands on, as a hobby by year 8. Did zero actual revision and A* starred it with a load of 99%s.

I was buzzing to get into the A Level, but I found it much, much harder. I still enjoyed it but it was a real chore at times, and it put me off studying it at uni.

I wouldn't say it's pointless if you're not doing a degree through. I've worked on and off as a journalist over the years, it definitely gave me a good foundation for that, and a few other aspects of my professional life. Personally as well, I think it helps me look at the bigger picture and try to understand different perspectives with a lot of things.

Yabu

So we meet this tutor and he says in our initial meeting with him that tutoring is to complement ongoing revision. I don't agree with this because I view tutoring as teaching my DS how to revise. The tutor was clear that he’s there to help raise Ds’ grade on top of his personal revision. If you wanted someone to teach study skills then you needed another tutor who teaches that.

There’s lots of other problems with your expectations. For example a baseline assessment is pretty basic- a 8/9 student needs different teaching than a 4/5 student.

If your son isn’t even making notes then it sounds like he needs someone to teach the facts as it doesn’t sound like he’s turning to other sources to create usable notes. For example there are many teachers on YouTube who have uploaded GCSE revision lessons and using YT means being able to pause and rewind on demand. I can’t comment on history teachers but my kids definitely used YT for other subjects.

If there are knowledge gaps then teaching him how to revise is pointless as there's nothing to revise from. Get him on BBC bitesize to fill those gaps, but make sure he does the right syllabus.

Op revision is what you do when you've mastered the material, but are needing to keep it fresh in your memory, because the courses are two years long and exam isn't until the end.

What the tutor is telling you is your DS hasn't mastered the course content or skills. He's got big gaps in his subject knowledge and is weak in the analysis & essay writng skills. The tutor needs to teach him the content & skills before he can get to effective revision methods.

It sounds like your DS really wouldn't cope well with the a-level.

You need to get organised too, all this being late and messaging to move the time because you've got mixed up, it just sends a message you aren't prioritising this at all.