17yr old boy found guilty of child abuse

[Ikeasucks]

Aibu to be pissed at how many women here were so scathing and dismissive of those in the past who said we weren’t comfortable with our babies/toddlers/very young children having male carers in a nursery setting or as a nanny etc? We were told condescendingly how ignorant and bigoted we were - i don’t fucking care at how right in you are and superior i still feel the same way www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cze665j2y51o?at_medium=social&at_link_type=web_link&at_format=video&at_link_origin=BBC_Surrey&at_campaign=Social_Flow&at_campaign_type=owned&at_bbc_team=editorial&at_ptr_name=twitter&at_link_id=4FF97A8E-B8A8-11F0-A794-E0B1162F2AD3

That is one very sick individual who must pay for his crimes against children

the crimes of this man are sickening - but it doesn’t mean all men would do this.

individual women have also committed horrendous crimes against children.

it is over simplistic to say because one man has committed atrocities that ALL men are deemed unsuitable to work with children

where does it end if we over simplify the world like this? If one blonde women commits child assault do we then ban all blonde women from working with children? If one French childcare worker assaults a child do we ban all French people from working with kids?

Because some men do terrible things to kids - but that doesn’t mean all men are bad and shouldn’t be near kids.

This is one case. There have been cases of women abusing children in a nursery setting - should we ban all women working in nurseries?

Yes, men shouldn’t do ‘women’s’ jobs like childcare. Like women shouldn’t do ‘men’s’ jobs.

Absolutely disgusting criminal. But I’m also wondering how on earth he was able to be private 1-1 with the children in loos etc without cctv or staff realising? Massive safeguarding fail there

There’s already an interminably long thread about this.

As I pointed out on that one - a woman killed a baby at a nursery near Manchester last year and another woman at the same nursery was convicted of cruelty to children in her care.

Are you going to ban women from nursery work as well? Or is abuse of children only a concern to you when it’s sexual? Is killing and injuring children a less serious crime?

Well that’s going to be the case when it’s 99% women that work in that field. It’s like like it’s 50/50 is it

In terms of sexual abuse I'm with you OP. Almost all sexual crimes against children are committed by men.

Women can and do abuse children within nursery settings, but the vast majority of nursery workers are women. I guarantee if it was a 50-50 split of men and women, the incidences of abuse would increase and we would be hearing about things like this a lot more 🤷

What would even possess a 17/18 year old boy to want to work in a nursery. That should have been a red flag in itself. There in no way on earth I would send my child to a nursery that had male staff, not even if it was free!

As for him he needs to spend the rest of his life behind bars. If capital punishment was a thing that would be better.

@Endofyear it’s not I meant

Horrific 😢 Can't imagine what those poor children and their families are going through. Nurseries just have too many opportunities for abuse and it's too difficult to ensure adequate safeguarding. I know female staff can abuse children too but male staff are much higher risk.
But I think nurseries overall need much better safeguarding, quality of care, and more careful recruitment. When I was 16 I did a few weeks work experience at a local nursery and a lot of the staff really didn't seem to want to be there, and some seemed to actively resent the children.

Statistically speaking, males are overwhelmingly more likely to sexually abuse children. That's an undeniable fact.

Using this large study of Australian men, nearly 5.7% of surveyed men would have sexual contact with a child between 12 to 14 years if no one would find out, 4.6% would have sexual contact with a child between 10 to 12 years if no one would find out, and 4.0% would have sexual contact with a child younger than 10 years if no one would find out.

Around 1 in 10 (9.4 per cent) Australian men have sexually offended against children, and men with sexual feelings towards children are - of course - more likely to work with children.

Meanwhile, while females can and do perpetrate sexual abuse against children, the percentages are so much lower that it's been impossible for me to find any study that examines what percentage of females have sexual feelings towards children.

Female offenders also seem to target different age groups (overwhelmingly pubescent males, one large-ish study of female sex offenders appears to show), and have very different psychological profiles and motivations to male offenders. But of convicted sexual offenders (against all ages), females make up 2% on average, although it's estimated from one victimisation survey that female offenders may make up as much as 12%.

Basically, males are far, far, far more likely to present a danger to children in terms of sexual abuse. If you consider early childhood care to be a necessary, calculated risk (like driving a car is), then allowing male nursery workers is, imo, like driving with your seatbelt unbuckled, or while slightly over the limit in terms of blood alcohol levels - it's likely that nothing will happen, but you're introducing an unnecessary, major risk factor that could be avoided.

@OtterlyAstounding Fucking hell that's so much worse than I realised.

1 in 10! So many people try to say that it's a tiny number of men and you're a monster if you're suspicious of men but thats an incredibly high number!

Yes i know all that but you personally - if your baby/toddler had to be cared for by basically a stranger to you - would you prefer the person to be male or female. Lets say a 20 yr old girl versus a 20 year old boy. What’s your preference/gut instinct.

That is very sad to hear. My 18 year old absolutely loves being with young kids and was considering a career working with young children. He has always loved babies and toddlers, and has a really good way with them. DH is similar, far better than me.

I honestly would not base my decision on male / female - it’s just too arbitrary

i would make a choice based on personality, references, rapport etc…

have worked in a nursery and had a lovely young male coworker who the kids adored and was absolutely brilliant with the kids.

Also worked alongside some women that frankly you wouldn’t trust them with a goldfish let alone a child…. That dirdn’t mean that all men are good and all women bad… my sample size is small and out of all the workers only one was a male. All it means is I worked with one outstanding person who happened to be a man, many outstanding women and a few absolute numpties who happened to be women…

Our nursery employed a male and all staff were paired for nappy changes and toilet trips so no nursery worker was ever alone. Seems like common sense.

How would banning male nursery workers have stopped Vanessa George?

His crimes are absolutely horrific, but it’s one case (one too many obviously) but we can’t tar everyone by the same brush. Women have committed horrific crimes in nursery settings also.

To be honest if you willingly hand over a non verbal child to the care of an unrelated young male then that's on you.

Seems like insanity to me. Like trusting a tiger not to bite your child, because occasionally one didnt.

But you knew him and you worked there - that’s different - you are not the mother handing her child over to strangers. You never really answered- what about your own baby or toddler - to people you don’t know. I’ve used babysitting services very occasionally - i would always choose a woman over a man. Woukd you just not mind at all

Crime stats for sex offending are hugely carried out by men though and we know male pedophiles seek out such roles of power over children. What’s your gut instinct for your own young children - would you want a 20 yr old male or female

i would pick the person right for my child..

I am a survivor of sexual abuse. 30 years ago I would have said a women every time for looking after my kids because it was a man hurt me…

but after extensive counselling - I realise now that 1 very evil git did what he did to me… I used to because of that hate and fear all men…. But time and counselling has helped me to see the actions of 1 from a group- doesn’t define them all.

my experiences of 1 hideous excuse for a human being - who happens to be a male - no longer clouds my judgement of EVERY man in the world.

I judge people on how they present, how they interact - not just because they belong to a group.

to look after my kids- would hire the right person based on temperament, references, experiences etc - not what sex they are .

Hope that answers the question.

My abuser also had a red car - it doesn’t mean all men that have red cars abuse kids…

Your OP makes no sense because I imagine literally no one said that something like this would never happen. I imagine what they said was that an isolated case isn’t justification for banning them. Just like male teachers abusing students isn’t a reason to ban male teachers. And male doctors/nurses/other HCPs abusing patients isn’t a reason to ban male HCPs.

I have 2 sons whom I would trust implicitly. There should maybe a blanket tightening of safeguarding around personal care tasks carried out across all nursery and school settings. Maybe it should be 2:1 for personal care routines so no one is alone with a child. I’ve worked in a primary school enhanced provision (ASN) unit where personal care was carried out by individual staff, it puts both staff and children is a position of vulnerability.

Yeah, statistically, I'd not let my child be looked after by a man I didn't know.
Secondly, the girls working there are underpaid, look half conscious, and are simply not that bright and don't really care about your babies.

If I had to put my babies in nursery I'd not have had kids.