Anyone like to reconsider what they posted about the train attack on Saturday night?

[margegunderson]

There were (to my mind) some horrific posts claiming that it MUST be a terrorist attack, demanding information on the attacker’s race and motivations NOW, shouting about Starmer censorship and picking fights with anyone suggesting it might not be cut and dried and to wait for more information. Hideously racist as well.
If that was you - any reflections today? What will you do if there’s a next time?

I agree with this.

These threads are interesting. I now feel quite desensitised to being called a racist now. These people have no idea who I am.

I can see that some people on these threads are just agitating and desperate to yell at others in self righteous fury. It’s a shame that such division is being created.

Crime stats are not racist, yet I’m called racist for sharing them.

I would like to live in a peaceful country that doesn’t welcome people who want to kill me because of who I am.

I would like us to be prosperous and generous to those in need but not at the cost of the safety and security of all of us.

From the content of many posts, it seems that many of the purported ‘anti racists’ are just anti British. That is disappointing.

I've wondered that since the adding right wing or left wing to any posts that the poster doesn't agree with has become more common.

I discount the views of anyone who adds 'xxx wing' to their posts now as I assume bot!

He is on record as saying that he was doing what he was trained to do and praising his colleagues. I do hope they all get recognition.

Oh it's very much weirder than that. I've been following a little of this and it's proper through-the-looking-glass stuff.

Russia has been targeting people among the marginalised, disaffected or poor to recruit for real-life attacks in the UK and other western countries. The internet makes it extremely easy to identify and approach people – and if necessary to hide who the recruiter is.

A conviction in the UK in July this year:

Why small-time criminals burned a London warehouse for Russia's mercenary group Wagner
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czjkke22gv9o

Germany in March this year (can't remember what happened next with this specific case, but it's a good description of the general situation):

Russia could be behind migrant terror attacks, German investigators fear
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/03/23/germany-fears-russia-behind-asylum-seeker-terror-attacks/
German sources said there have been cases where petty criminals, such as drug dealers, suspected of being part of Russia’s wider shadow war on the West have “broken down and admitted” in interrogations that they were recruited by Moscow.
...
German officials have previously said the Russian practice of recruiting criminals or other outcasts within Germany is so widespread that they have compared it to a “gig economy” for “sabotage and terror”.

And two articles on the convictions in France a few days ago:

Hand of Moscow? The men jailed for vandalism in French hybrid warfare case
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c891d43l8pyo

France’s ‘red hands’ trial highlights alleged Russian disruption operations
https://theweek.com/world-news/france-russia-bloody-hands-trial-ukraine?

I know about this stuff because I follow the Ukraine threads, which discuss Russian activity.

If you don't, then the sheer breadth of what Russia has been up to may come as a shock.

They have. And their efforts to disrupt don't stop at the internet.

he was indeed - A white ex-navy man, with a photo used of him wearing his medals collection for the Royal British Legion. The right wing folks lapped it up and plastered his photo all over their social media. Less so with Samir.

If you feel that Samir Zitouni the guard who took serious knife wounds to protect passengers deserves an award and official recognition please follow this
https://www.gov.uk/honours

Yes that doesn’t surprise me. Diversity has only made this nation more prosperous,
more creative, more safe, more functional, and we aren’t even all the way there yet. Russia must be utterly terrified of what a 100% diverse Britain is capable of, thus they are sending their agents out on the internet to sow division and invent false narratives like so called ‘grooming’ gangs in order to scare naive citizens into acting against the interests of the nation.

Thankfully many capable and vigilant Samaritans are onto the case and can make people aware of what their game is.

Not today Ivan! ❌

Fairly sure the victims felt some terror, so for them his skin colour, religion, motive were irrelevant.

There’s a huge difference between referring to someone’s religion or background in a negative way to push prejudice, and mentioning it in a positive context to challenge that prejudice.

My comment was clearly the latter. I pointed out that the train worker had a Muslim-sounding name because it completely undercuts the usual bigoted narratives that surface after incidents like this (and yes, I did initially assume he’s Muslim but I changed that thinking soon after as realised his name alone does not make him a Muslim. I actually challenged my own assumption). That’s not sowing division. That’s exposing it.

It’s strange that acknowledging a person’s courage, in a way that challenges stereotypes, is somehow being twisted into a bad thing. But I can see how highlighting positive qualities in someone who sounds like they could be a Muslim makes some people uncomfortable, but that discomfort says more about them than about my comment.

Terror is not terrorism

I felt the same as you OP. I dont think there would be anything racist about hearing the original news wondering if it was a terrorist attack and being concerned about safety in a world where we are despised by many countries and cultures. Back in the 80s we would have immediately thought of an IRA attack for example
But many comments on here and on social media were utterly vile, divisive and racist. There is a clear chasm between those views.

Yep. Quite obvious really

Not sure what you're up to @Swiftasthewind , but you seem to be inventing stuff now. It is not a "false narrative" to state that grooming gangs exist.

The answer to people attempting to spread misinformation is not to spread more misinformation but in an opposite direction.

AhWeNoss ·
"My comment was clearly the latter. I pointed out that the train worker had a Muslim-sounding name because it completely undercuts the usual bigoted narratives that surface after incidents like this (and yes, I did initially assume he’s Muslim but I changed that thinking soon after as realised his name alone does not make him a Muslim. I actually challenged my own assumption). That’s not sowing division. That’s exposing it."

Absolutely agree. No Samir's name did not automatically make him a Muslim as that particular first name is used by Arab Christians as well. In fact my Egyptian Muslim husband's closest friend is a Palestinian Christian named Samir.

I know the definition of terrorism, but the experience for the victims would have been exactly the same regardless of his motivation.

I didn't post anything but I hope all the injured people make swift recoveries & are not mentally scarred. Horrible incident.

Of course
it must be the most intense terror when you are trapped. Run to the front of the train then there is nowhere else to go

I may have missed something, but it seems like the Go Fund Me for the footballer who got his leg slashed, is doing about 7 times better than the one for the Train Crew guy Samir.

What a pathetic country we live in.

And who probably earns about 7 times as much from his day job too 🙄.

Thanks @Cleikumstovies , I took a look at the criteria on that form, and it seems only someone directly involved in the incident can make the nomination.

So I hope his colleagues or the police or someone thinks of this.

It’s strange that acknowledging a person’s courage, in a way that challenges stereotypes, is somehow being twisted into a bad thing.

What ‘stereotypes’ would those be then?

The stereotyping I see is from the ‘liberal left’ (for want of a better label) accusing others of slating ALL Muslims/black people/immigrants etc when that is absolutely not the case. I don’t actually see any one saying ALL members of a particular group do bad things, I certainly don’t.

I have taken particular pains to repeatedly spell out the fact that Not All Muslims/black peoples/brown people etc do <insert topic> Because there are many people on these threads who seem deafened by their own self righteousness and always manage to miss that bit.

like they could be a Muslim makes some people uncomfortable, but that discomfort says more about them than about my comment.

You are writing in response to my post so it sounds like you are implying that I might feel uncomfortable about that. Except you have literally no idea who I am, my family background or feelings on the heroism of the people fighting back against the knife man. Talk about lazy and negative stereotypes. 🙄