Anyone like to reconsider what they posted about the train attack on Saturday night?

[margegunderson]

There were (to my mind) some horrific posts claiming that it MUST be a terrorist attack, demanding information on the attacker’s race and motivations NOW, shouting about Starmer censorship and picking fights with anyone suggesting it might not be cut and dried and to wait for more information. Hideously racist as well.
If that was you - any reflections today? What will you do if there’s a next time?

I didnt post and I didnt jump to the conclusion it wasa terrorist attack.

Maybe a few years ago I would have but stabbings and attacks have become so common.

I jumped to 'Mental Health issues'
Ive not follows the story closely but it reminded me of the Ukraine woman who was stabbed on a train in North Carolina in August.

Just because its not terrorism on this occasion doesn't mean terrorism isnt an issue.

@Bagsintheboot I think looking down on people and telling them off causes more division. Listening to people and factually discussing their fears and setting them straight is what actually changes things and improves community cohesion.

• conspiracy theories about the govt and police suppressing information
• conspiracy theories about Muslims plotting to take over the govt
• saying "it's just part of their culture, black men smoke weed and they get paranoid"
• talking about deporting "the usual third world suspects"

These are fairly easily disproved and a calm discussion where people can say what is scaring them and look at the facts is urgently needed.

We have so many issues at play and understandably those with less access to information are very confused. People on all sides are vulnerable to manipulation by social media :

Immigration as a whole
Immigrant hotels and perceived risk
Grooming scandal and inquiry
Palestine protests

We need to be able to discuss these issues and how they play our in our communities, and have everyones voices heard. I am sure your stance makes you feel great about yourself as you look down on those nasty little racists but you are doing nothing to help the communities where they like side by side with ethnic minorities who are terrified of Reform gaining power.

The fact that you've said 'next time' means that it's not a case of if, but rather when. And there absolutely will be more of these events and everyone with opinions that don't sit well with you personally should just be quiet, turn the other cheek and not pay any notice of WHY these events happen and WHY they're becoming more frequent.

I think it's safe to say that I feel like there are 3-4 Lee Rigby-style events per week now. That's an opinion I have held for years, but it's considered 'far-right' and 'bigoted' to air it. We don't dare destroy the narrative.

There’s been no outrage about the white guy who has been jailed for his extremism and racist hatred towards Muslims - he build a bomb factory with illegal explosives like white phosphorus that can’t even be used in war… WHERE IS THE OUTRAGE PEOPLE

Also, loads were saying the two men were shouting Allah but…not one single credible source. Turns out they’re Russian bots. Embarrassing.

absolutely this. I’ve seen so many posts recently calling those worried about mass immigration and asylum hotels flag shaggers and similar.
It’s an important conversation to be had and it’s not racist, bigoted, xenophobic, intolerant, islamophobic or any other type of phobia to want to talk about it.

Terrorism has a political motive.

Being crazy or obsessed with violence eg Nicholas Prosper, Axel Rudakubana doesn't equal terrorism.

Ah, I had been following the shooting of Charlie Kirk in the US, in which at least one innocent person was arrested and then released before the killer's family dobbed him in to the police.

So I didn't assume two arrests meant two perpetrators.

Whenever there's a big emerging news story, we know there will be more information available in the following days.

I'm not emergency services or so or otherwise involved, so don't have to rush to do anything. I can hold on a day or two.

Of course I too have a mental list of "Well it could be X, it could be Y, it could be Z." But I know that I don't know, and prefer to wait for the fuller information.

(In other areas I'm definitely a "fools rush in where angels fear to tread" personality, so I've had to teach myself to do this.)

i agree how is this not a terror attack??

What is the motive? Who is he trying to influence to advance what cause?

Yes OP, you are so much better than those awful people. This post has definitely put them all in their place. Well done.

This has been explained multiple times. For it to be an act of terror there has to be some political motivation, a cause behind it.

Because there was no political or religious motive. Or at least we can assume that or they would be saying it was a terrorist attack.

Those threads were dreadful in parts, but accusing people who assumed that it was a terrorist attack based on the initial reports of racism is also ridiculous.

Of course an attack on multiple people on a transport system brings to mind terrorist attacks. We've had them before haven't we? Someone I was at university with was killed on 7/7.

There are enough crazy white people out there (I’m white, but not crazy) for me to never assume anything.

@Glistening

Just saw one of the survivors saying she doubts she will ever be able to get on a train again. No-one has died (so far) but lives have been destroyed for sure.

I'm sure sadly that's the case...we seem to have ended up with people terrorised but because of the tight definition of terrorism in UK law this is not (so far at least) deemed to be a terrorist attack....

I'm not sure a lot of the victims will appreciate the distinction....

I’m sure a delve into his internet history would likely find him with radicalization of some sort. You don’t just randomly attack people and this should be a terror attack. He literally brought terror down on unlinked people to him. TBH other details are off like who was the person he was with?

I’m sorry, you ‘feel’ like there are around 200 terrorist attacks in the UK per year, and that’s been your opinion for years?!?

I didn't post but did assume it was a terrorist, I won't apologise for my thoughts as I still consider it an act of terror, a terrorist attack fueled my racism.
The incident in Dublin 2 years ago, when the 5 year old children x 3 and the after school assistant was slashed and stabbed used the same narrative, that attacker hasn't had a trial yet, am I surprised. NO.
Thankfully a man intervened with a motorbike helmet to disarm the scumbag.

I don't think it was unreasonable for people to assume based on what was reported at the time (two non white men, multiple random people attacked) that it was terrorists. Even the police at first thought it might be terrorism.

I think people got riled up on that thread by people saying that they hoped it was a white attacker or that it was probably Newcastle supporters - I'm not sure what makes it acceptable to accuse Newcastle supporters abut not terrorists?

Even on this thread people are saying it is mental health issues but I can't find that on the BBC, the DM has something in quotes but I can't see who exactly is supposed to have said it.

I think it's just better not to speculate at all, but I also understand people want answers and until then they are going to speculate. It never goes well though.

I hope the ignoramus suggesting it was 'shitty Newcastle' football fans has had a word with herself!

I thought it was quite mild on here compared to the Mail online comments. One of the Mail comments stuck in my mind was along these lines "wait til he is charged and his name is released, that will tell us all we need to know" well they have released his name he is called Anthony Williams. They must be gutted but of course he has another characteristic they can focus on which in their eyes is proof of inherent criminality. As I said on another thread, if when you hear of a horrific violent crime and the first thing that goes though your head is " I bet it was an immigant" rather than empathy for the victims and respect for the emergency services then you really do have a problem.

You think it’s racist to assume that a knife attack on public transport is terrorism? Eh?

Once again it was another man. Perhaps Rwanda or someone will take all our violent men? Just suggesting an alternative narrative rather than the colour of their skin.

I am happy to say that I missed those threads. I have only seen threads about them so far and they sound awful.

I am sadly not surprised tbh