Why do Labour not get it?

[Dacatspjs]

It's being reported today that Labour want to stop using hotels and move migrants into barracks. Fine. But when quizzed on it Luke Pollard has suggested this will be more expensive, but the public want the hotels to close at all costs so it will be worth it.

This to me just seems like another step forward for Reform. The public who care about this, care about how much the government is spending on migrant housing. A new policy that costs more isn't going to go anyway towards solving this problem.

I don't know what the solution is, but spending more money getting mothballed barracks up to spec seems ludicrous.

"Asked about whether it would cost more to house migrants at military bases than in hotels, Mr Pollard insisted that 'the public want to see those hotels close'.

But he added: 'We're looking at what's possible and, in some cases, those bases may be a different cost to hotels, but I think we need to reflect the public mood on this asylum hotels need to close.'"

Well English is the most spoken language in the world so some come to the UK because they can speak a little English, and not any French for example. I agree some do come for the benefits.

FWIW I walk down the street and get leered at by men of all colours / cultures. When I lived in London just off Brick Lane, I was followed home late at night by a white British man, and rescued by a group of Pakistani men, who then walked me home, made sure I was OK, and checked up on me the next day.

It is not a "one size fits all" situation. It is not a time to place a stereotype on every asylum seeker because you've had a bad experience.

I imagine most of the issues we have talked about on here are cultural issues by men who are not new asylum seekers, and are living here perfectly legally and have been for many decades. You need to decide if you're against asylum seekers or people from different cultures, because IMO there is a big difference.

I don’t think the government release statistics on that so it’s impossible to say.

Ok, so if we don't know that they do, why would we treat them any differently than every other group?

This is exactly what I was referring to earlier…there is no point, we are not going to win this argument while everyone keeps using whataboutery and minimising.

Yes agree.

How do you know?

How can you tell which are and which aren’t?

How do you propose we ascertain this going forward to keep women and girls safe?

and if you can’t, what then?

One thing I will say before I bow out is that I think this government is going to have a real problem on its hands if it doesn’t sort out the elephant in the room.

And no, I am not talking about the much maligned Farage, but about ordinary citizens (gammons as the left call them) who are sick to the back teeth of it all.

Because for all the shit that’s been going on in Germany for the past decade there has been very little dissent, probably due to our history.

But I think it’s different over here. And this is by no means meant as a criticism on my part.

How do you know?
That all asylum seekers aren't a risk to women? Partly because I've met plenty, and they weren't, partly because we have no evidence to suggest that they are.
How can you tell which are and which aren’t?
By processing their claims asap, though of course you can never be sure, just as you can't tell which men are a risk to women.
How do you propose we ascertain this going forward to keep women and girls safe?
By processing their claims as fast and thoroughly as possible, tightening up our whole immigration system, and getting better at deporting any who commit crime or have their claims refused.
and if you can’t, what then?
What do you mean?

This is my issue with such divisive topics - It's not about winning the argument.
Why can't we just agree to disagree? Why can nobody debate healthily anymore? Why do people stick so rigidly to their beliefs instead of being more open minded.

I don't think I'm trying to 'minimise' anything, if you look back I actually do agree with a lot of what's being said, I am just trying to offer an alternative view. I could also argue the "whataboutery" on your side of the discussion too, as it keeps coming back to a "women's safety" issue, when lets be honest the patriarchy is still very prevalent in societies all over the world (and I am not saying that this is OK, just to be clear).

@sunflower1022I’m so pleased you’re posting about Germany. We get a lot of deflection on this and much of it is domestic politics (Brexit etc) when this is happening in a fair few EU countries.

Countries that do release the stats (like the Nordics) show that crime rates are higher for migrants. Broken down by country of origin, men from certain countries commit sexual crimes for example at several times the rate of those without a migrant background. Have a guess which countries? And another guess at why our Government refuse to collect similar stats even though the Casey review recommended it?

Have a look at the Denmark stats if you are interested.

I keep saying I’ll bow out and then I get a notification and I come back 🥲

Yes, that’s a whole load of bollocks (sorry, but I’ve had some wine).

It has nothing to do with Brexit.

Thanks I will. So far a I can only find info on non Western immigrants and their descendants, not asylum seekers, but I'll keep looking.

Look, I don’t want to argue and if I have come across as rude then I apologise.

Its just that I feel very strongly about this.

And while I agree that it’s MEN that are the problem (and believe me I know that as my husband’s brother is an abusive piece of shit and he’s all British) I am not comfortable with people advocating for unchecked immigration.

it has caused no ends of harm and misery in my country and I will not be told to keep quiet anymore.

Have a humanitarian scheme such as the Ukraine one and vet everyone first.

As Australia does. Ik you don’t like their system but you do want the same outcome and have indicated you would be ok with deporting people who arrive at the coast.

In Denmark, the Social Democrats realised that concerns about immigration were attracting people to the far right, so they deliberately decided to restrict immigration to try to stop it happening, while still keeping left wing policies on all the other issues. It seems to have worked pretty well for them.

And also, people always think it’s ‘just’ women and girls that are in danger.

That’s not the case. There have been so many men and male teenagers killed by asylum seekers in Germany too.

One of the latest cases the 16 year old whose crime was to be at a supermarket at the wrong time.

So by all means complain about the patriarchy (which everyone knows is a problem, wherever in the world you may be) but let’s not ignore the bigger issue here.

Denmark is such a beautiful country! My parents went there on holiday a few times when I was growing up and I have nothing but fond memories.

And as much as we may disagree on this topic, great username @ReginaPhalange1989

(From a fellow Friends lover)

Why do we need anymore

there is a shortage of jobs

we need to train or persuade people here to do the jobs

Labour don’t want to publish crime stats as they bear out what we are all saying …I think Afghans top the list of crimes per capita in U.K..

Labour are hiding it …utter shame on them.

These countries I listed earlier where they come from are all third world countries life is cheap and they see public hangings all sorts of stuff we simply can’t comprehend. They live by different rules and very different societies especially around women very very alien to our ways. Like the dog Walker stabbed mutliple times by an afghan just no….tell his wife and family oh let’s open our arms to these poor souls ..,no thanks our cravenness and kindness has destroyed us. It’s a mess. Someone has to do something.

Also, you haven't done something special to earn your spot in the UK, it is literally luck of the draw. Just because you were fortunate enough to be born in a safe country it doesn't make you any more entitled to a safe life. We are all humans at the end of the day, sharing a rock floating through space

Of course it’s luck, but it’s the same in any country. It’s own citizens have rights that don’t extend to the rest of the word!! That’s how it works.

I dont think youve been rude at all, you're just passionate and that's great 👍🏻

Your points are completely valid and I've enjoyed debating this with you without it turning into a "lefty looser, right wing fascist" type argument.. it's rather refreshing.

I also physically cannot dislike someone who loves friends too 🤣

I appreciate that, cheers

😁

I don’t agree and I don’t think putting men from other countries first is my priority.
That’s all that’s there to it really. I’ll vote for a party that agrees.