To be a bit stunned by Lily Allen’s new album

[AngeloMysterioso]

Oooofff. I mean it might as well be called Fuck You David Harbour, You Cheating Bastard. Safe to say she’s set a new bar for diaristic songwriting. I feel so sad for her, I know she’s not everyone’s favourite person but it’s always been clear that all she wanted was to love and be loved and she seemed so happy with him- he popped up on her podcast with Miquita Oliver a few times and seemed so genuine in the way he spoke about her… for it to all collapse in such spectacularly public and hideous fashion must have been awful to endure, so I don’t blame her for working through it by going back to what she does best but still… blimey. I feel like I’ve been spying in their bedroom or something after listening to it!

It doesn’t excuse but I also have a lot of compassion for a lot of people who have committed crimes.

And I wouldn’t necessarily want them in my life or even on the streets but I don’t automatically hate or disrespect everyone who has done something bad.
one of the components of the justice system is that criminals need to show genuine remorse and a desire to change, be culpable, and own their actions.

things go wrong on release when they don’t stick with the changes and go back to their previous habits and lifestyles
those for whom prison or rehab or hospital sections etc work are those who do the work to keep maintaining or improving their life and rehabilitation becomes a tangible outcome .

blatantly Lily has done things many of us might not do or would not do, some of us definitely have.
she has talked at length about trauma and rehab and therapy and sobriety etc and has been very open about the things she has done and how they affected others.

i don’t necessarily agree that the candidness is ideal for the children to hear but that’s her choice as a parent.
in discussion with my children I am very open on the whole but as they get older they ask more pertinent and mature questions and i sometimes dread what they might ask me because im not ready to share some of it yet, mainly because of their emotional maturity and because I grew up very damaged and undiagnosed neurodivergent.

lots of my life ‘choices’ are not things i am proud of and to explain nuances and trauma and substance misuse and vulnerability is difficult because of their age but here we are adults with all kinds of lives experience

Everyone has their story.
we are all human and none of us completely without blame.
some people are in circumstances which drive horrible behaviour

13/14 year old girls climbing through windows/air conditioning vents to line up and perform sex acts with the members of Led Zepplin (plural) is well documented. Similar for the Stones, Bowie, Beatles and others ‘of that era’
Later the Chilli Peppers as recent as the 90s where Matey is on record stating that one he realised his girl friend at the time and daughter of local sherrif or such like, was actually only 14 and dad was out looking for him - he’s better get his end away quick before they found her
etc
etc
well documented not hard to find that info

Absolute cunt- fuckers vile men.
disgusting

Wonderful, wonderful music tho
listen to them all
the time

Why are you so against prostitution?

Sheezus this thread went a bit bonkers.

I loathed her music when I was younger and didn't rate her much as a person until I read her autobiography.

I think the album is decent. I agree with PP that male musicians with very questionable (often illegal) actions don't receive quite the same level of vitriol about their personal life when releasing new music.

This articulates it perfectly for me!

That has to be a joke, right?

i don't like what he done but she's done similar so not much sympathy

Why would it be? Take me seriously a minute and let me know what you think about it

Why would someone be for prostitution?

At the time of the Saville, Haris, et al arrests and subsequent allegations against the 70’s DJ’s as part of the Operation Yewtree Enquiry -DH and I commented at whether or not that level of scrutiny would later be directed towards the aging rockers still banging about or posthumously.
Bear in mind they and their victims in autobiographies/accounts at the time clearly document underage ‘ groupie’ sexual activity/ ‘relationships’

AKA now and then by most - as abuse /rape/ exploitation.

I think that some people need money and some people need sex and when you put those things together people get what they need. And if you make it legal and safe then everyone can do the thing they’ve been doing since the beginning of time and sex workers are less likely to get hurt or killed. So yeah, I’m in favour of prostitution. But you clearly aren’t, so why not? I’m very curious.

If anything it’s hushed unless it’s something particularly heinous but most of the big guns have never lost any popularity.
apart from on today’s discussions about lily, I’ve rarely seen anyone cite led zep and Bowie as problematic due to their history with underage girls

Nice.

Prostitution is driven by economic disadvantage and involves women who are some of the most vulnerable in society. It goes hand in hand with violence and exploitation and drug abuse. 70% of the UK’s prostitutes were from the care system. 75% of female prostitutes in the UK entered prostitution before they were 18. How is this a positive thing? And how would making it legal change the situation for these women driven into selling their bodies?

You could say the same if you replaced sex with selling your organs, it wouldn't make it right.

Prostitution exploits vulnerable women and is wrong.

It is the cause for 1000's of women being forced into human trafficking across the world, it is degrading for the workers, often dangerous, where they need security, another man, it is a business run by men for men.
One particular culture bring the girls in and move them to different cities every few months so they don't make close bonds, ask for help, a lot of the girls believe they're coming for cleaning jobs, they don't speak much English.
Why wouldn't you be against prostitution?

I do like their username though so it removes the sting for me .

Four? That's insane

No I’m totally with you that no one should be trafficked or forced into it, and that also people who are vulnerable get into it, but I just don’t always think it’s that straightforward that that’s the only times that it happens. I just think that life is very complex and sometimes people (men included), find that it’s something they decide to do to get money. And the reasons they do that can be as simple as addiction, or more complex. Lily herself sold pictures of her feet to people who were clearly going to wank over them for her own reasons. Life is just so many shades of grey that prostitution isn’t just always about men taking advantage of women. But it’s totally fine to have different opinions about it! 😊

I don’t know, they’re your organs 🤷‍♀️ and it’s your body. I don’t think prostitution is ideal for most people, but I do feel like if people stopped moralising about it and recognised that it actually happens and regulated it, sec workers would be lots less likely to get trafficked, hurt, abused or killed.

Hi again. I can assure you that I am entirely genuine 👋I am not for prostitution, why on earth is it a contradiction that I agreed with a Bindel article?

Is it me or are quite a few people on this site really quite odd and extreme?

In an ideal world or civilised society or by a simple view, but no.
You're either for it or against it.
It has been tried and tested, it didn't change anything, it's probably worse than ever, a human commodity that pays men well.

Always. 😆

well you seem pretty convinced anout it and I’m pretty happy with my take on it so I guess thats that! We can just agree to disagree. Have a good night 😴