Is it right women do more?

[NurtureGrow]

Please go gently.

I’ve been asking my husband to help me with housework since we met almost 5 years ago. He does ‘help’ sometimes, but he never does it fully. Ie the area/room is partly clean, there’s always more for me to do.

For me, doing things for each other is
important. I want him to find things clean and tidy. You can imagine after 5 years, it’s disappointing me, that I never find it as clean and tidy as I left it, and he never fully cleans an area for me. It’s always me.

He says he ‘can’t see it fully.’ ‘It’s not a priority’ he’s ‘doing his best.’

He’s also now saying that as he’s starting a business soon (going full-time in a week) he can’t do the business if he has to clean. I said this isn’t about the business, you’ve always been like this in a salaried role. You leave things for me to do.

It seems I have two choices: be submissive and accept it / or keep trying to make him understand. The latter isn’t working. I haven’t got extremely high standards, I would just like it left clean and tidy for me, as I do for him.

Example, I cleaned the kitchen earlier, it took 25 minutes. I’d just like him to do that for me, like sometimes, or ever. He says he can’t, it would take him 1 hour. He’s a genuinely nice person, but I just don’t think all this is right. We have a 1 year old baby.

Id genuinely like to know, please:
**
YABU - women do have to do more, male partners aren’t good at this. You shouldn’t keep asking him and accept it.
**
YANBU - he should do it fully sometimes, it’s not for you to always do

Thank you

Ultimately he can’t see a point in putting himself out for a woman. Neither you nor his niece get any effort made, basically.

Then it sounds like you have a choice to make. Accept how it is or give him an ultimatum (and carry through with it if he fails to meet the grade).

genuinely wondering why you would have a baby with someone who has not done this stuff for 3 years. Did you think he would magically change? (They never do.)

Ok, so it sounds as though he may have been brought up in a house where cleaning was a woman’s job, and he wasn’t expected to do anything. Mothers who treat their sons like this raise men who make terrible partners. While he may not be consciously aware of it, on some level, he does appear to think that cleaning is woman’s work, and he expects you to behave like his mother.

I could deal with it more before having a baby, and also resentment compounds, so how it felt in year 1, wasn’t so bad compared to now

Stop doing things that are not a priority or necessary for you. Do laundry for you & baby. Leave his stuff. When he starts moaning he has no clean underwear, shrug your shoulders and say well it's not a priority for me. You can deal with it. When he has to face a physical inconvenience FOR HIM, it might hit home.

I don't think this is a man v woman issue - it is the type of person you are. Some people are more scatty and some are obsessively clean. I'm a woman and I'm more on the scatty side. My OH is super neat. So we have split the household stuff based on what we naturally do, but we both do our part when it comes to cleaning.

What does he mean by he cannot see it? As in the mess he is in isn't what he qualifies as messy enough to irritate him or cause him to clean? How is his eye sight? I say this as a glasses wearer who sees way more crumbs when my contacts or glasses are on and I experience 20/20 vision. When I don't have anything on, I don't see crumbs.

He’s a feminist my arse. If he says anything positive about women working outside the home, you say firmly there is nothing feminist about expecting women to work and also do all the keeping house and parenting. Men who are feminists proactively tidy and clean at home so their partner has the same chance as they do in the working world.

This is very typical of the majority of men sadly. We are meant to clean and tidy up behind them. Very patriarchal.

He can see dirr. He just cant be arsed to clean.

Google weaponised incompetance.

OP, please follow and read Zawn: https://www.zawn.net/blog/household-chore-inequity-is-abuse-a-manifesto

I think you need her.

reading this is giving me the rage!

cleaning, tidying, cooking, taking care of your family are able to be completed by both men and women.

There is not some genetic dysfunction in the male species which inhibits these skills.

I believe the saying ‘if he wanted to, he would’ applies here.

he could do all of these things as well or better than you but he doesn’t want to, because he doesn’t care.

stop making excuses for him, and start asking yourself if this is how you want to live, forever, and is this the expectation you want to show your children, for they will grow up thinking the home is women’s work.

I read a thread on here a few years ago OP from a woman who had been in a similar situation as yours for years. Her marriage had broken down and they were in counselling. That OP said it was a revelation to her that, after years of trying to find the magic formula that would get him to see what needed to be done, he admitted he didn’t clean “because he didn’t want to”. This is the truth OP, he just doesn’t want to.

I also read that a woman will walk into an untidy room and not only will she see that it’s untidy but it will be a “call to action” for her in a way it isn’t for a man. Women are judged for having an untidy home in a way that men aren’t.

You can only control your own actions however so in the first instance I agree with PP don’t do his laundry, ironing etc. I would seriously consider whether having a second child with him is a good choice, unless it’s simply because you’d like a full sibling for your existing child and you’re ok with doing it all with or without him.

Ultimately I think your choices will boil down to doing everything in the marriage or doing everything as a single parent. If he’s starting his own business he probably won’t pay proper child maintenance, he won’t do 50/50.

It’s bleak OP but I would ensure you are financially independent. Him making you do all this extra work is exploitation pure and simple. He uses the word “supportive” but what he really wants is for you to his share to free him up to do what he wants.

Look around your workplace and ask yourself why these really rather mediocre men are more senior than the women. Nine times out of ten it’s because they have a woman doing all the shit work for them so they can focus on their careers.

You sound a bit obsessed with cleaning tbh, and even more obsessed with making him do it.

You can make him have the same standards that you have when you clearly like things done a certain way. You are creating a problem where there doesn’t need to be one.

I wish women would stop marrying and having children with these incompetent manchild men.

Historically we have bren responsible for our children, homes and the care of relatives. Id say that still falls on our shoulders while mosr of us work full time too.
I do know men who do their fair share but not many.

If he refuses why not get a cleaner and get him to pay.

Well if he can't clean and tidy he takes over all the food preparation - meal planning, shopping and cooking. And say bills and other planning. Find a split that works for you both so you have about equal amount of household tasks (given you are effectively full time with a days work and 2 days childcare).

I find it insane that women marry these man children. Sorry that he thinks you are his parent OP. You aren’t.

My husband does loads round the house but genuinely just does not see things the way i do. He will just not notice that a counter top needs wiping. He really does try but nothing can make him have the standard i have.

Op can you post a pic of what the kitchen looks like after he has cleaned it, vs after you have?

OP will naturally do more of the housework due to being home more (maybe like a 60-40 split).

Two whole days at home and she should do 10% more cleaning?

You can’t.

He is refusing to listen to you because he doesn’t want to do more, and doesn’t care how you feel.

I had one like this, and wasted twenty years trying to change him. He didn’t change. He now lives like a pig in shit, and I’m happily married to someone who cares about my feelings.

End it. You’ll still be doing everything, but It’s less exhausting when you are on your own and doing everything without the weight of resentment dragging you down.

As others have said, you need to have a serious talk to him.

Don't sugar-coat the pill - he's a grown man after all - and point out that if he can't even put the recycling in the right bins/containers how does he think he will be able to run a business ?

A lot of new businesses fail, not because the trader isn't any good at what they do but because they can't structure their time effectively.

He won’t change because he doesn’t want to. He doesn’t see you as a person in the way he is a person, with choice and needs and deserving of respect. It is super common, I’d say the majority of men see women like this. While you live with him, your function will be to facilitate the life he wants- to do the boring and unpleasant parts of having a lovely home and a lovely family. His role will be to enjoy having those things, and paying towards them (which will mean he owns you and has a right to those things). He doesn’t see this marriage as an equal partnership.

Here ! Here !

All it does is perpetuate yet more idle beggars !