To now be increasingly concerned about illegal boat arrivals

[CalmShaker]

I've kept a level head with boat crossing arrivals but recently I've become concerned that there are some really unpleasant people being let in. This story was hard to watch on the news this evening;

Asylum seeker 'murdered hotel worker Rhiannon Whyte in frenzied attack' - BBC News https://share.google/qxzed2MD19TYPKasQ

I welcome genuine asylum but I don't believe that is what is happening anymore.
The story immediately before the above on national news this evening was the migrant who had threatened Nigel Farrage. I know Nigel is not the most popular of people but the migrant was horrid, clearly dangerous and not safe to be on our streets.
Financial cost and all other factors aside, it's the safety aspect that worry me most.

Why aren't more asylum seeker women travelling to the UK this way? Why are the camps in Europe full of men?

A local politician in my area, who is very pro-open borders, remarked a while ago that 'nearly every female asylum seeker I speak to has been raped' - well, go figure.

If you took a bunch of middle class English people, cut them off from their families, stripped them of all money and resources, crammed them six to a filthy hotel room with little monitoring, in a place where the locals hate them and regularly gather in drunken mobs 'protesting', abusing and occasionally trying to set them on fire, fed them slop, provided them with nothing to do and no indication of how long this would last...half of them would be committing crimes in very short order.

I agree that a secure location would solve a lot of issues, but it's not as simple as just clicking our fingers and making it so.

It's easy to point to different countries with different laws, international obligations etc and say "Well look at them", but it's not a valid comparison. The issue is here and there's no simple way to unring the bell, despite what people keen to milk the situation for political capital would have you believe.

Which half would be raping “in very short order”?

It was such a heinous crime, thus will prompt revulsion in any decent person; the poor woman was just making her way home from work.
We've lost control of our borders. I don't think it's remotely alarmist to say so, and I think it's something that, yes, should absolutely worry us (and the volume of pointlessly detractory debate around the subject has become very tiresome).

The answer isn't really difficult. In countries where certain minorities in danger, it's generally the men who are in most danger for fairly obvious reasons. In other cases, the family decides that it's best to get the young men into the new country first because they stand the best chance of getting jobs, making a living and being able to establish a home that the rest of the family can escape to when necessary.

Because they are often inaccessible and would put them and their family at serious risk to utilise them. Those routes are not in place in many countries. People often can't afford the process. Situations change quickly and people need to get out rapidly. Not all people in certain parts of the world have the documentation required and may not have the information about themselves to be able to get it easily.

But irregardless of the many, many reasons - there's an issue with your terminology "legal routes". It's legal to seek asylum in any route even by small boat. The people who are arriving are not doing ANYTHING illegal by coming here unless they fail to make an application for asylum at the earliest opportunity upon arrival. Trafficking people is illegal but the people who have been trafficked are victims of trafficking and therefore have not done anything illegal.

Economic migrants are those who come here legally and work/study. If you have permission to work/study here you're not illegal.

Why should an economic migrant not go home on holiday?

I think you're confusing economic migrants with asylum seekers/refugees.

Asylum seekers didn't bring climate change to our shores. 😂
I've seen immigration blamed for a lot of spurious things, but this is a new level of madness.

this!! We will become minority in our own country.

Exactly. So many of the young men I've worked with have been abused/ sexually assaulted/ used for forced labour etc on their way here - can you imagine that journey for a young woman when it's so bad for the young men? Let alone as in any other part of the world, women are usually tied into caretaking with elderly relatives or children they can't as easily leave. There may be issues around access to education and therefore access to employment for women eventually. It's really no surprise that it's predominantly young men making the journey when you actually think about it for a minute.

Were you concerned last year before the change of government when there were a lot more arrivals? Or just now that there's a Labour government for some reason?

So this is just racism if your concern is just being a minority group. Plenty of others are living that discomfort every single day here. It's also just such utter bollocks when you consider that we take in one of the smallest percentages of asylum seekers globally. This is where reading from other sources, applying critical thinking and actually understanding the stats is very important.

Who are they being raped and assaulted by? Is it perhaps other men who are making the same journey?

Has anyone mentioned the men who claimed they didn't know they weren't allowed to rape women and children? The one I'm thinking of (though there are more) got off with it, poor bloke just didn't know! Seems it's allowed and fine and dandy in their culture/motherland/whatever... They don't suddenly learn and respect our laws as they leave France to get here.

Or maybe it's just the few who don't understand not to rape, if so, how can they claim that and get away with it? Like everyone knows in (insert civilised country) that rape is illegal and disgusting and all the bad stuff... So only degenerates do it, how can one guy in a boat full of the same culture/country guys claim ignorance? Is it possible for just the one or two to think it's ok to rape a school girl? Is it different from where they came from? Are they bringing that sick behaviour from their country or are they using ignorance to UK law as an excuse to rape?

Not all with be deviants, but there sure is a fair few who are and they're the ones who we should be worried about... But how to determine the safe from the unsafe? Better to err on the side of caution than to believe they're all innocent, just like us, escaping war and wanting peace and safety.

No, funnily enough by the traffickers and criminal gang members and the people profiting off exploiting them in the first place funnily enough. Although I think it says a lot that your first assumption is that it must be the other vulnerable people inflicting their own harm as opposed to the people trafficking them. And you're likely not the only one which is the really sad thing. I've no doubt that there are small numbers of men and women coming through who are capable of harm, just as any man or women born here is capable of harm under the right circumstances but for me that's simply not a good reason to deny safety to vulnerable people in crisis just incase. And I sincerely hope that if our circumstances ever change and we find ourselves the ones in need, that we're treated with more empathy and compassion than some of us are willing to extend from our place of privilege.

I'm certain that the 55% of people housed at the Barbican who have been charged with a crime haven't all been charged with rape, so that's a silly and pointless comparison to make.

I've just had a look and PP's numbers seem to be off. The story comes from a DM report that states 41 people charged with around 90 offences over three years. This doesn't take into account anyone not convicted of a crime. DM reports a couple of 'allegations' of rape, and a small number of sexual assault charges, but no corroboration or conviction info. FWIW.

It’s other MEN. And it’s not funny.

We don’t know who these men are. We don’t know their criminal background. The traffickers come over with them. Even one rapist being added to our streets is too many.

We need to stop allowing men in and make safe routes for women and children.

You think they’re fake allegations of rape? Based on what?

Do you know how poor our rape conviction rates are?

This reply has actually made my blood boil.

Absolutely shameful

Men here use that defence ALL the time. Didn't know it was rape. Didn't know it was sexual assault. Didn't know she wasn't in to it. Didn't know she was too drunk. Didn't notice she was asleep. Didn't know she'd changed her mind etc etc etc should we lock up all local men just incase? No because that would obviously be a breach of human rights (as is denying someone the right to seek asylum through any means).

Good point.

Men already rape so what’s a few more?

Excellent reason to allow thousands of undocumented men into our communities.

These cases make the news because they're incredibly rare. Most people are good, remember.

“an increase of nearly 13 percent in sexual assault and rape cases in 2016 compared to the previous year – with 9.2 percent of the overall number of assailants reported as Syrian nationals and 8.6 percent as Afghan nationals. In total, 38.8 percent of those convicted of sexual assault and rape were reported as non-German nationals. This means that roughly 4 out of 10 sexual assaults and rape cases each year are committed by foreigners in Germany. Before the refugee crisis, that ratio was 3 out of 10.”

https://www.infomigrants.net/en/post/5309/migrants-and-rape-unveiling-myths-and-facts-about-the-dark-side-of-the-refugee-crisis

Sadly, the UK don’t record crimes in this way to be able to analyse the impact here. I can’t see why it’d be any different though.

Ok so UK men are lying too... What's your point? Which 12 year old girl are you going to pick out of school for the next man to have at? I mean, white man/black man... Rape is rape so what's a few more doing it? Difference is UK men get likely will get sentences, the unknown men get away with it.

So this is just racism if your concern is just being a minority group. Plenty of others are living that discomfort every single day here

It is NOT racist to be concerned that you could end up the minority in your own country. Those who “live that discomfort” do not have to be here. Tell me would you be ok if you did become the minority group in the UK? Would you be accepting of that? Genuine question.

I am baffled by the trenchant support for illegal migration shown so often on MN. At what point should it be stopped do you think? Do we leave it to those coming to decide? Do you imagine that at a certain point they’ll Do The Right Thing, see that we are overwhelmed and decide to stop? If we do need to put restrictions in place when should that be? Or do we just keep letting all those poor, oppressed, escaping peoples who need to be anywhere but in their own very large countries, keep coming to this comparatively tiny land mass forever?

@Lavender14 if you have a young daughter, walking home from school and recording these men following her, obviously following her, not just one either, say two of them. She rings you and tells you to come pick her up as they're making her nervous, what would your response be? BuT tHeRe'S wHitE mEn Who MiGhT rApE yOu tOo? Genuine question though, would you believe your daughter if she'd experienced what others here have? Would you write her off too?