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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is not giving a child any presents for their birthday a as punishment fair?

163 replies

ambergot · 10/10/2025 13:46

I met a mum friend for a play date in the park after school last night and her dd was quite mean to my son, calling him fat which he is not, stupid and and idiot and swearing at him.
I ended up taking him home and this mum was hugely apologetic.
I was talking to the mum in the school playground this morning and she explained her daughter has been quite challenging lately, she’s in the process of having her assessed for ADHD and odd and as a consequence for the way she was with my son and the fact she refused to apologise she has said she won’t be getting any birthday presents next week.
I thought this was a bit harsh but didn’t want to get involved.
It’s not a punishment I would implement but then I don’t have a child with adhd and odd so I don’t know if she’s being unfair or does that sound reasonable in those circumstances?

OP posts:
Beaniebobbins · 10/10/2025 16:56

BertieBotts · 10/10/2025 16:40

Yeah it is - that's why barely anybody actually uses that as a threat any more, it's an outdated relic.

And even when people do (or did) use it as a threat very few people would actually follow through with it.

I have never seen a Santa that didn’t refer to a good list or ask if the child had been good. So not sure why you think this is outdated. Lots of people have Santa cams, the elves watching etc. this is very much still the norm.

TimeforAH · 10/10/2025 16:58

No, it isn't fair. The child (many children) will not make the link between the action and the punishment. They two are not linked and are too far apart in time.

My DS (age 10) was punished by his before school provider for refusing to put his coat on to walk to school. They punished him by putting a young child’s wrist strap on him and walking him to school.
He couldn't make the link between the two.

(actually neither could I - if he had been messing and unsafe on the road, yes, but not as a punishment about his coat).

CharlieKirkRIP · 10/10/2025 16:59

A nasty and mean punishment.

Daygloboo · 10/10/2025 17:02

ambergot · 10/10/2025 13:46

I met a mum friend for a play date in the park after school last night and her dd was quite mean to my son, calling him fat which he is not, stupid and and idiot and swearing at him.
I ended up taking him home and this mum was hugely apologetic.
I was talking to the mum in the school playground this morning and she explained her daughter has been quite challenging lately, she’s in the process of having her assessed for ADHD and odd and as a consequence for the way she was with my son and the fact she refused to apologise she has said she won’t be getting any birthday presents next week.
I thought this was a bit harsh but didn’t want to get involved.
It’s not a punishment I would implement but then I don’t have a child with adhd and odd so I don’t know if she’s being unfair or does that sound reasonable in those circumstances?

I think it is bad anyway, but is slso a stupid tactic because Christmas is too far away from the action that is getting punished. Suppose she behaves better now and then gets nothing for Xmas. By then it will just feel to her as if she's a horrible person who doesn't deserve love or nice things. With action and consequence situations, it had to be close together do the person understands.

MyLittleNest · 10/10/2025 17:04

The mother is right to have consequences for her child but she is taking it way too far with the birthday gifts. I grew up with a mother who was cold and cruel and seemed to thrive off punishing me. (I was a really, really good kid. I had to be.) For no reason other than making it clear that she didn't want to me to "spoiled" she announced that I wouldn't be receiving any birthday gifts one year and then gave all of my presents to my sibling on my birthday. We have photos of that day and I looked so confused, while my sibling was joyfully unwrapping my gifts beside me. There were many other instances, different, but similar, in following years. I am in my 40s and to this day, I struggle to ever celebrate my birthday. It makes me feel like a burden to people and I'd rather it just not exist. What this mother is doing will have long-lasting damage. It's not about the gifts, it's about how it erodes a child's worth.

I have to wonder what is going on in that house and if the child has ODD, there is a trauma/attachment reason for it.

This mother just seems to have an abusive mentality.

Luna6 · 10/10/2025 17:07

A woman at my daughter's school complained a lot that her daughter was struggling to find friends and fit in. I persuaded my daughter to invite her to her birthday party although they weren't really friends. On the day the mum phoned and said her daughter had done something wrong and as a punishment she wasn't coming to the party. I pleaded with her to find a different punishment for the (in my eyes) minor misdemeanour but she was adamant. No wonder the poor girl had few friends.

Daygloboo · 10/10/2025 17:09

Sorry you went through that. I would say your mother sounds like she had quite severe psychological priobems.

Grammarnut · 10/10/2025 17:14

Oppositional defiance disorder (?odd) seems to me to be children who won't do as they are told. We have spent decades telling children they should not obey adults without question, so we should not be surprised that we now have children who won't obey adults full stop. Better to explain why some adults should not be obeyed and the signs that they should not be obeyed - e.g. they will tell the child this thing is a secret between them, that inappropriate touching takes place (and this one is not helped by Sexuality Education which tells children they should not do anything they do not find pleasurable, rather than telling them that some actions by adults, even if they feel nice, are not to be agreed to!).
But not giving birthday presents next week for wrong-doing last week is ineffective - it's not attached to the incident. Also, one should never threaten a punishment that will cause you difficulty to carry out. I.e. don't hit your sister or you won't come to Alton Towers, is never a good idea.

allmymonkeys · 10/10/2025 17:23

Reasonable? It sounds completely idiotic.

When you say this woman is a "mum friend" does that mean you have to spend any further time around her? I really hope not.

If challenging behaviour flares up you deal with it firmly and immediately. You do not inflict prolonged, unrelated punishment days after the event and expect the child to learn from that - and that's even before you take the suspected learning difficulties into account.

Good grief.

drspouse · 10/10/2025 18:10

Beaniebobbins · 10/10/2025 16:09

A lot of people on here saying this is awful, but isn't the concept of Santa basically the same thing? Being good to get presents is a concept kids are very familiar with. I'm not sure that what this woman has done is any different to telling a kid they need to be on the good list for Christmas.

We don't tell our DCs that, though. Father Christmas brings some of the presents but not because you are good. He brings them to all the children.

BertieBotts · 10/10/2025 18:46

Engineeringdevelopment · 10/10/2025 16:29

On the other hand, at least part of the child’s behaviour problems could be because she uses extreme punishments that are unfair and too disconnected from the poor behaviour in substance and timing to make sense to the child and be effective.

Parents who threaten these extreme punishments often don’t actually follow through so the child learns not to take any notice of her anyway. Then she thinks the problem is all in the child and puts all her energy into chasing a diagnosis rather than looking at how to improve her parenting of a child who may or may not need ‘special’ techniques for a ‘special’ need.

Maybe she was just having a bad day and maybe she’s usually a brilliant parent with well-considered behaviour management with a child who is substantially harder than average to parent. Or maybe I’m just a former primary and special school teacher who’s is a bit frustrated with the zeitgeist of so much time and money being spent labelling kids rather than spending it on supporting good parenting and kind people in classrooms to help kids.

I really want to respond to this because my instant reaction to the first two paragraphs was to be flooded with feelings of upset and anger. (This is not an angry post).

It is very tiring to be the parent who has tried the reasonable, normal parenting techniques, which do not work, resort to something extreme in a moment of exhausted frustration and/or out of desperation for something to work, have this be the snapshot which is seen (often because it is more visible or memorable by virtue of being extreme) and/or be using more of a "strike while the iron is cool" approach so it looks like behaviour is being ignored or indulged in the moment, and have this immediately judged as "Oh right, yep, one of those parents".

I know this happens, it's happened to me on more than one occasion. There have been two instances I can recall where the person who was judgemental initially changed their tone entirely when they encountered my younger child, who responds so well to "normal" parenting I am forever surprised by him myself, or the other time when I explained that my older child attends a very demanding, academic school, and my middle child's teacher visibly readjusted her opinion immediately.

Because no, I'm not conceited enough to describe myself as brilliant, but I think I'm a good enough parent, I do think things through, I do know the basics of good parenting, I try to be reasonable, I don't generally go out for wild threats or anything like that. I actually agree that most of the time, "special" kids don't need "special" parenting, they benefit from the same principles as all children - more praise than criticism, a good relationship with parents/adults, good adult role models, clarity around communication of rules/boundaries, a consistent and calm approach from adults, unscary and predictable consequences, recognition of progress, and fair expectations according to their age/ability.

The difference is that most people aren't following good parenting principles to some gold standard degree, and most of the time that doesn't matter. "Normal" parents are mildly inconsistent almost all of the time, allow emotion to come into behaviour management e.g. in facial expression or tone of voice or amount of correction, use threat/fear (even if it's not extreme), communicate boundaries in an unclear way, notice bad behaviour more easily than good behaviour and don't always know what is an age appropriate expectation (and if your child does have some kind of issue then often a typical "age appropriate" expectation may be inappropriate for them anyway). Most of the time, for the vast majority of children, this doesn't matter - they can fill in the "gaps" in clarity and consistency because of social learning and logic, some developmentally appropriate behaviours will reduce on their own as a child grows, and because they are generally able to follow rules more of the time, the occasional mishandled bit of bad behaviour doesn't make much of an impact on their overall self-image or relationship with their parents/teachers or is fairly quickly repaired if it does.

OTOH in fact you kind of do need to work to higher standards if you have a child who finds good behaviour much more difficult to maintain. It's not that it's anything special, because the same things would help all children and most good parents probably do try to follow the aspects they are aware of. It's just that most parents don't need to be so careful about their behaviour management and it doesn't matter very much if they aren't doing it perfectly, as long as overall it's good enough. But also because if your children generally behave OK, people aren't looking askance at your parenting looking for faults.

Anyway, sorry because this has ended up very long. But I wanted to respond, despite a general policy of not responding to posts which make me feel angry or upset, (which I don't any more anyway) mainly because your third paragraph reminded me that I do feel there is a communication gap here where parents and teachers misunderstand each other. I definitely feel that there are things from the teacher's side which I'm not aware of. As far as I've got with this is: There are genuinely bad parents, not just normal parents who are being assumed to be lax. So teachers aren't always being unfairly judgemental in making these statements. The gap is that I have no idea from my side what the distribution is - I find it difficult to believe that "decent parent with a genuine concern and an unusually challenging child" is as rare as this post makes out, because the majority of SEN parents I encounter (mostly online) would fit this profile. OTOH, perhaps my perception is skewed because I'm encountering a self-selecting sample, whereas schools collect a much wider range of pupils and families. I genuinely don't know, and would be interested if you would be willing to share your experience.

The other gap is that I think I assumed that if my child had a diagnosis, that would mean that someone would know what to do to help him. I don't know why I made this assumption, since it didn't have that effect for my older child, but my older child only ever had behaviour issues with me, he has always done well at school. My middle child is very disruptive at school. My hope was that the diagnosis would make it easier to communicate, because the school would be able to say ah right, yes, ADHD, we know what to do with ADHD, or if they don't know what to do, they could look up some strategies for helping ADHD in school, and some of it would help. But that does not seem to be the case, which makes me wonder what even is the point of the diagnosis (ADHD is not exactly rare). And BTW, our school is making a lot of the same behaviour management "mistakes" that totally normal, reasonable parents do all the time. They are not following gold standards of behaviour management, including things which I do know specifically matter for my child. I can't realistically fault them on this, because their behaviour management works fine for the majority of the children, but it is frustrating to have people assume that my behaviour management is at fault and I am looking for some kind of excuse or easy way out.

I would love a kind person in his classroom. I would have happily opted for that over a diagnosis. I thought maybe the diagnosis would be the way to get understanding and communication into his classroom - the system as it is does not seem to be working well for anybody. (I am not in the UK - so I don't need UK specific advice but I would guess that the distribution of parental behaviour is likely similar.)

drspouse · 10/10/2025 19:52

@BertieBotts brilliant post as ever.
From very very similar experience except that I have knowledge of special school parents who are NOT chronically online and reading up on every new technique and mindfully parenting. I know the parents who have had this type of childhood themselves, been in children's homes, had children removed, have learning disabilities, have themselves been in specialist school, can't really read, have 6 children with absent fathers... You name it... I see that schools are not able to interpret the advice on ADHD rather than they don't know it.
So they see "behavioural techniques work" which is what the research says and read "rigid consequences and termly rewards" and don't realise kids with ADHD become punishment blind and need all rewards to be immediate.

Or they see "anxiety leads to fight or flight" and read "remove everything that makes the child anxious" (which in fact leads to increased anxiety) or try to reassure (which tends not to work either) or to suggest CBT (which isn't helpful in a child who doesn't believe it will work or doesn't have good verbal skills).

We also know that you have to REALLY believe your new method will work and stick with it - if I had a pound for every time a school said "tried it, didn't work" when they tried it ONCE, I'd have enough money to pay for the very expensive EP report we just commissioned. Schools have no idea that behaviours increase when they aren't rewarded any more (i.e. when nobody pays attention to messing about, the child tries harder to get attention) and they think if they try ignoring once and behaviour escalates then ignoring was wrong.

Wifeofazombie · 10/10/2025 20:31

Harsh punishment imo. Also a punishment a week later is not gonna make any difference child won't remeber why they not got presents.

Girliefriendlikespuppies · 10/10/2025 20:43

It’s horrible and unkind, with a mum doing that no one the little girl is bullying other kids.

intrepidgiraffe · 10/10/2025 20:45

No this is cruel. And it’s why parents shouldn’t threaten that Father Christmas won’t come if they’re naughty etc etc, even if they don’t mean it, it’s cruel.

Lavender14 · 10/10/2025 20:47

No that's totally inappropriate. They probably won't make the connection especially given its a week out, I wonder if the parents will actually follow through although talking about it to others sounds like they might, but also that child will inevitably be asked by others what they got for their birthday and will have to say - nothing.

There's so many alternative punishments.

PassOnThat · 10/10/2025 21:56

Terrible punishment. ADHD in girls especially in linked to self-esteem issues and feelings of shame, so suggesting to this girl that she is not worthy of birthday gifts seems counter-productive to me. Of course she should not have behaved towards your son how she did and some consequence should be imposed, but the mother needs to find more effective methods of discipline.

Retiredfromearlyyears · 11/10/2025 19:09

Omg! Absolutely way over the top! Especially if the child has Adhd or similar. I think if I were the parent I might have said,no more play dates for now. However I wouldn't ever deprive a child of their birthday party or gifts.

Greenshed · 11/10/2025 21:10

ambergot · 10/10/2025 13:46

I met a mum friend for a play date in the park after school last night and her dd was quite mean to my son, calling him fat which he is not, stupid and and idiot and swearing at him.
I ended up taking him home and this mum was hugely apologetic.
I was talking to the mum in the school playground this morning and she explained her daughter has been quite challenging lately, she’s in the process of having her assessed for ADHD and odd and as a consequence for the way she was with my son and the fact she refused to apologise she has said she won’t be getting any birthday presents next week.
I thought this was a bit harsh but didn’t want to get involved.
It’s not a punishment I would implement but then I don’t have a child with adhd and odd so I don’t know if she’s being unfair or does that sound reasonable in those circumstances?

The problem with this punishment that the mother wants to implement is that it’s not immediate. It’s a good week after the event, so it’s very likely that the child won’t relate getting no presents to the fact that she was unkind to your son. The punishment (whatever that might have been) , and a discussion with her about the inappropriateness of her behaviour should have happened at the time, not over a week later.

ByRealLemonFox · 11/10/2025 21:13

My little boy is autistic with ADHD and PDA and its his birthday next week. His behaviour is changing as he is excited and also anxious about not getting the presents he has asked for or a Lego birthday theme. No way would I take any of that away from him because his behaviour is bad. Yes, he has to learn how to behave but punishing him days after the event and using his birthday as punishment is not correct.

BlueFlowers5 · 11/10/2025 21:22

It tells the child something negative about their very existence.

Wildefish · 11/10/2025 21:45

ambergot · 10/10/2025 13:46

I met a mum friend for a play date in the park after school last night and her dd was quite mean to my son, calling him fat which he is not, stupid and and idiot and swearing at him.
I ended up taking him home and this mum was hugely apologetic.
I was talking to the mum in the school playground this morning and she explained her daughter has been quite challenging lately, she’s in the process of having her assessed for ADHD and odd and as a consequence for the way she was with my son and the fact she refused to apologise she has said she won’t be getting any birthday presents next week.
I thought this was a bit harsh but didn’t want to get involved.
It’s not a punishment I would implement but then I don’t have a child with adhd and odd so I don’t know if she’s being unfair or does that sound reasonable in those circumstances?

Poor poor child. ADHD and awful parent. Child has no chance.

catlover123456789 · 11/10/2025 22:06

Having adhd or any other condition is not an excuse for being horrible, whatever age.
I wouldn't withhold birthday presents but there would certainly be a punishment, otherwise that child will grow up thinking its OK to use adhd as a reason to be horrible.

pineapplecrushed · 11/10/2025 22:29

2 things-

not giving presents is an awful response, entirely inappropriate and cruel.

adhd or autism is not an excuse for her (or anyone's) behaviour.

Lockdownsceptic · 11/10/2025 22:36

ambergot · 10/10/2025 13:46

I met a mum friend for a play date in the park after school last night and her dd was quite mean to my son, calling him fat which he is not, stupid and and idiot and swearing at him.
I ended up taking him home and this mum was hugely apologetic.
I was talking to the mum in the school playground this morning and she explained her daughter has been quite challenging lately, she’s in the process of having her assessed for ADHD and odd and as a consequence for the way she was with my son and the fact she refused to apologise she has said she won’t be getting any birthday presents next week.
I thought this was a bit harsh but didn’t want to get involved.
It’s not a punishment I would implement but then I don’t have a child with adhd and odd so I don’t know if she’s being unfair or does that sound reasonable in those circumstances?

This is tantamount to child abuse. It would have no positive outcome for any child but for one with ADHD it is particularly inappropriate.

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