To refuse to ask son to leave?

[Dishwater]

Please don’t post on social media as it is too outing.

Ok, this is long - sorry.

I am really struggling with this and would like to see how other people would deal with this situation.

i have a 19 year old son. I will give some background to try and be fair to all the people involved because it isn’t as straightforward (I think) because of some of these details. My son isn’t my partners but he hasn’t seen his own Dad in a number of years. My son has been difficult. He is exceptionally messy and selfish. In our previous home he completely hoarded rubbish in his room to the point it attracted bugs and furniture and walls were damaged which I know is really bad( this happened several times despite my please to improve / going in and helping / getting cross etc). Since we moved house I go into his room daily and he has improved some but likewise I take out any rubbish and grab his washing and generally tidy around. My partner hasn’t really gotten over my son having some friends around when we were away for 2 nights a year ago because some of partners things were damaged - sporting equipment. Son denied this initially, I asked him to leave temporarily because it wasn’t pleasant and he stayed at a friends but his birthday was coming up and I felt awful that he wasn’t at home so agreed that he could come back. My partner really just gets annoyed by everything my son does so I have spent years cleaning up after him before my partner sees any mess and it’s really taken its toll. Please don’t think I haven’t asked son to be more careful when doing certain things - wipe up after cooking, don’t use metal utensils on non scratch pans etc etc. but it does feel like I’m constantly moaning at him and I’m not sure if some of the smaller things would bother me quite as much as it bothers my partner, I know teenagers are messy etc. my son is also quite disrespectful at times, he will not answer me if he doesn’t like something I say but he has never sworn at me or said he hates me or anything like I sometimes see others say about their teenagers.

When we moved house I sat down and asked my partner what we needed to do to improve things so that he felt better about things, he said we should ask for a financial contribution and ask son to be tidier. My son wasn’t working FT so didn’t really have money at all, a very small amount. Son has now got a FT jobs so I approached the subject with him a few days ago (did post for advice on here) and son was receptive but we haven’t set an amount yet because h wasn’t home for 7 weeks.

Fast forward to last night, son went out with friends and came home around 9.30pm, partner went into the kitchen and came back agitated and said ‘there might be bugs in the kitchen, I’ve had to open the window, he is cooking and all the windows are steamed up, I see we’re back to being a free hotel again.’ And then he said he was going for a walk, no shouting but clearly very upset. I asked him what he wants me to do? Do you want a curfew for cooking? Do you want me to insist that I do the cooking for son? I told him he was going to contribute financially and he just said ‘I just want peace and stability, this isn’t for me.’ I think he’s referring to the fact that just doesn’t want him here to be honest. My son has a GF that he spent 7 weeks with without coming home. Before that he was spending 3-4 nights at home and the rest at his GF’s so I think that’s stopped this problem arising again because it’s just been short stints of having him. I have also told my son that it is difficult when we don’t know when he’s coming and going and I would be happy to say that he has to give us his schedule. (This is true but I think maybe it’s because I’m so anxious that my partner will be pissed off that’s I’m not even actually sure how I feel about it anymore) I am upset and a little angry that my partner is barely speaking to me because I haven’t actually done anything wrong! It doesn’t feel like much of a team if I have to shoulder the burden and blame. I’ve told him numerous times to just say to son ‘please put the extractor on.’ Or appropriate things as and when he sees something that is bothering him but he doesn’t.

I have two younger children with my partner, one is disabled, I do completely understand why my partner finds this situation difficult. But at 19 I can’t just ask my son to leave home can I? What can I actually do? Other than ask for a contribution and continually remind son to be tidier. I don’t think my partner will be happy while we he’s here to be honest (he is self aware enough to know he can’t outwardly say make he wants me to ask him to leave.)

I should add that I do a lot for my partner, I think that’s relevant because it’s not like he’s got all his life together if you know what I mean. I cook every meal, wash every pot, I don’t get on at him when he’s messy etc. But then I should also add that my partner gave my son his first car and could have sold it so I feel so conflicted about it all. I’m also not really happy with son coming and going but I can definitely put my foot down but I haven’t because I think I know deep down that my partner still wouldn’t be happy.

It’s my house btw but there’s no way my partner could afford to leave, he has a lot of debt.

I really don’t know what to do here. Partner and I get along well when son isn’t here but he’s my child at the end of the day.

Any words of wisdom?

Oh dear. Everyone's a mess.

Your DP is top of the list. He's being a manipulative child. He can't push your DS out of the house (YOUR house!) and you shouldn't even entertain that thought. Never put a man ahead of your children.

However your DS is being entitled. He may not have to move out, but it's not wrong to tell a 19yo that there are rules for living at home, he's expected to follow them, and if he doesn't like those rules, he can choose to leave. That's not forcing him out. That's clear expectations and boundaries. I think you've gone easy on him and he's learnt that he can treat you poorly, and that's done him no favours in the long term.

As well as laying out expectations for your DS, I would sit the pair of them down and tell them you're done playing referee and go-between. You cannot be responsible for everyone else's happiness. That's the most important lesson. You can and should have rules for your DS, not just the mess but the disrespect, because your tolerance for misbehaviour is teaching him that that is ok.

Let your partner leave. He's an arse. So is your son however.

But yes, let your partner go (his debt isn't your problem). And don't let him come back when your son isn't there. He has to know it's all or nothing. And that one day HIS children will be teenage arses too.

But also, give your son a time limit to move out. 6 months or so, to save up. He can rent a room somewhere (house share thing, check on Spare Room.com).

Your life is being controlled by 2 selfish men. Get 'em out and take some time to see what YOU want.

reading your updates OP I think seeing as your partner has said he would move out you should agree and use it as an opportunity to have a trial break in the relationship.

He sounds like he is 100% trying to manipulate you to 'pick him' and that needs dealing with. he knows you have the power in the situation so is doing everything he can to keep control, if you beg him to stay he will not change and may even get worse in relation to your son, OH is very much part of the problem and calling his bluff is the only option you have there imo.

But saying that if your son can't show you respect and do basic things you are asking of him, he should find his own place! Get him paying you OP, you can save the money for him if needs be, but he should be contributing to the household, money wise and chores/responsibility wise, while you continue to make endless excuses for him he will never bother to improve.

Your son sound dirty and selfish and your partner sounds a miserable sod.

but hoarding and attracting bugs and ruining furniture means it’s time to go.

"My house, no mortgage and I pay most bills like council tax, water, utilities but OH does pay for appliances, things in the house, all our phone bills (including sons) Netflix, broadband and he paid the finance on my car for 3 years until I got a new one so there’s lots of things that are his"

"My house, no mortgage", partner with loads of debts and laying down the law about stuff like what time your son is allowed to make hot food.

I think there are two separate issues here. Your son is 19 and doesn't contribute financially (yet) despite working ft and he doesn't keep his room tidy and he is lacking in independence.

Then there's your "DP". He's a waste of space. It's ridiculous the way he's going on about your DS cooking "late at night". 9.30 pm is not late at night. According to you he makes enough mess himself.

I would kick the partner out.
And once the partner was gone I'd be drawing up rules with the son, including a financial contribution and if he doesn't want to stick to those rules and pay a reasonable amount then he can look for alternative accommodation.

What's the plan for your son's future? You gonna be his carer until you die?

Your son is likely to move out without an ultimatum seeing as he apparently doesn't spend much time there anyway. And is likely to grow up and sort himself out as he's 19.

Your partner, on the other hand, is likely to be a neurotic, intolerant and unforgiving sponger for the rest of his life.

This ☝️

Maybe it would work better if DP moved out and son pays room and board. You can be together and live apart.

because from your updates DP doesn’t lift a finger but is always running his mouth about other people. cheeky sod

Get rid of the partner.

His debt isn’t your problem.

This is really difficult. It is hard enough living with stepchildren when they are small and the normal behaviour of a child is just more intolerable because they are not yours — that's the truth of it, and it is exacerbated here by your son being an adult. You unfortunately need to choose between husband and son. One has to move out, I don't think the situation is otherwise salvageable. And if DH can't afford his own place - oh well. He should have been more tolerant of your son.

I’m sorry but I’d never put my partner before my child. Yes your DS sounds a pain in the backside and could do with some boundaries but your OH is now being unreasonable. He’s living in YOUR house. I would never ask my child to leave to please a man. Please don’t do that

It sounds like you do all the picking up after your son and your partner and then have to listen to your partner moaning about your son being useless when he is useless himself?

I'm not sure what the answer is here, but things can't continue this way. Can you talk to your son like he is an adult? Tell him all the good things about him that you love but some things need to change and he has to take responsibility. I wouldn't list every little thing but major stuff that you think is crossing hygiene lines etc. I would also ask your son if there are things that he would like to change in the house dynamic and try to instil a sense of agency in him so he feels less like a child and more like someone who has control over the situation.

It sounds like you can never relax in your own home. That's not ok. Good luck with it all

Situations do evolve you know? You are being harsh, if you knew me you wouldn’t think this about me I can assure you. Of course my partner didn’t treat my son badly when he moved in, their relationship was fine and it was over time that this happened. I have already said I accept blame here.

Im harsh? Your the one who kicked their 17 year old out of the house. Over a boyfriend.

This is exactly what I fear will happen if I let my partner move in FT - DD is quite messy/selfish and it drives him up the wall. However generally they get along very well.

Looking from the outside it sounds like your DP frankly has grown to dislike your son and his mere existence is enough to annoy him. While this is probably due to all the mess etc, I would bet there’s nothing your son can do right now that would please him. He just doesn’t like him.

Personally I wouldn’t ask a 19 year old to move out just to please your partner, but there needs to be a middle ground where everyone is happy (you included).

Maybe start pointing out every time your DP also leaves something untidy so that he knows he’s not perfect either.

Of course he didn't treat your son badly at first ..why would he when he's trying to get his feet under the table , because he had nothing to bring but his debt to your relationship..
Once you had his kid ,he knows he's home and dry and he can treat your son badly, knowing you won't kick him out .. because you don't want your kids going through their parents splitting up .
So he gets away with it .....and you make excuses

I wouldn't be choosing a debt-ridden, lazy assed partner over my child. I'd be asking him to leave.

I tell you something else as well
Kids remember..I remember things from being 5 ..I remember how shit my mum was ..and I remember her putting up with the abuse from my dad ...she didn't even leave him ,to put me first ...he left her
I was kicked out at 14 and sent to live with my dad till 17 ,when she took me back .
I left home as soon as I could ,she had no relationship with her grandchildren
I don't see her now ..
I despise her for how badly she treated me , putting my step dad first every single time .
Don't make the same mistakes..you have time to put this right ..you clearly know it's wrong or you would not of posted

@Dishwater stop accepting the blame.
Your ds is a normal 19year old.
My ds at that age was probably worse but I wouldn't have dreamt of kicking him out.
The reason your dp is annoyed is because he's forgotten what he was like as a teen and also because you keep apologising unnecessarily for you ds.
I guarantee that if this was your dp's teen ds he wouldn't be making such a fuss.
Tell your dp your ds will not be asked to leave and your dp needs to stop constantly making digs and accept the status quo or leave.

I have decided to set some rules. I don’t think my OH will sit with me to talk to my son tbh which I do know is ridiculous. I am going to set the rules and see what happens. Along the lines of wanting a schedule of when he’s here, financial contribution, being tidy, hot food stopping at a certain time etc. If my partner goes then of course he goes (I doubt he will) and I’m not asking my son to leave at the moment. If he doesn’t stick to the rules then I will reevaluate. I have tried some of these ground rules before however, I don’t want people to think I haven’t spoken to him previously. I feel like I can’t win! Some people think that my son is completely out of line and that I’m treating my partner poorly and others think that I’m the world’s worst mother allowing my child to be abused.

You need to take back control of the house - you should absolutely not be walking round on egg shells trying to make the house tidy enough just so your partner won't kick off.

I'd sit both of them down and lay it out.

Your son needs to start treating you and your home with respect. Tell him :

• He needs to start picking up after himself - stop redoing his washing if he has done it poorly - if there are consequences he'll soon learn how to do it properly and stop cleaning his room - make it clear that if it is not kept in an acceptable state you will be asking him to move out.

• He needs to be telling you his plans - although everyone in the house should be doing this though, we use a combination of a wipeable fridge calendar and the family WhatsApp group to know when people are working / have events / staying out / going to be late home.

• Start paying rent and contributing to the overall upkeep of the house e.g. cooking tea for everyone one or two nights a week and helping to clean communal areas

• He should apologies to your DP for the damage caused to his things (if he hasn't already) and pay to replace it if necessary

• If he doesn't want to adhere to this then he is welcome to move out

Tell your DP:

• He is to stop treating you with disdain and acting like a sullen child just because he has a problem with your son. Make it very clear to him, that as long as your son abides by the agreement above, you will not be asking him to move out. Tell him you refuse to be a victim of his manipulative, moody behaviour.

• If he does have an issue with something your son has done, then he needs to have a conversation with him like an adult - it is not his place to be shouting at him given his lack of contribution.

• Going round in a huff, opening windows and ranting about bugs over steam from a couple of boiled eggs is childish in the extreme, when he could have just said "Hey son, could you just switch the extractor fan on" - 9:30 is not too late to be making some food - its not like your son was stinking up the house making smoked haddock at 2am! - rescind that offer of a concession about a food curfew!

• Your DP needs to start paying half towards the household bills - he's getting to live there rent free and barely contributing which makes him more of a sponger than your son.

• If he doesn't do his fair share of housework / looking after the younger kids, then he needs to start - if you expect it of your 19 year old, it should be a given that your partner does the same.

• Like your son, if he is not happy with that, then he can also move out.

If they try to interrupt you while you are laying all this out, tell them to be quiet and they can have their say when you are done.

Yup!

His own Dad takes no interest in him, his Mum brings a new man into the house and his Mum skivvies, cooks, cleans for him, brings up his babies, he probably feels de-prioritised and as such “Mum doesn’t make her partner clean up… so why is she always on at me, because he is making a fuss?”

I’m not saying this is reasonable, but emotional reactions are usually not reasonable.

Especially in less mature young adults, who may feel abandoned by their Dad while watching younger half siblings get attention from a resident Dad. And Mum.

I asked him to stay with a friend for a few nights while everyone calmed down. he was back within a week and I checked in with him. My ‘boyfriend’ at this point was a man I had two children with and has been in a relationship with for over 10 years. I’m not saying it was right but people said he had no consequences for his actions which wasn’t true. You can’t simplify it as much as you have. Well you can, you can do whatever you like but it doesn’t mean I have to accept it.

He just sounds like a19 year old to me. Some are worse, some are better.

I cannot ever ever imagine telling a 17 year old to go elsewhere whilst a situation calms down. They need a safe place. How can his home feel safe with a dick of a DP and a dm who asked him to go elsewhere?

No wonder he’s got hoarding problems. Hes trying to make himself safe.

l think both you and your DP are to blame. You should prioritise your ds over your DP