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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be utterly disgusted by the woman cutting down yellow ribbons commemorating the October 7th victims in Muswell Hill yesterday morning

977 replies

AngeloMysterioso · 07/10/2025 09:43

When Jewish people are being attacked and murdered on their way to synagogue on Yom Kippur

When you literally can’t move or look in any direction without Palestine Palestine Palestine in our faces

On the eve of the anniversary of the worst atrocity committed against Jewish people since the Holocaust, a small, unobtrusive memorial for the victims of that unthinkable, barbaric attack was destroyed yesterday by a despicable woman who turned up with scissors and cut the ribbons down, one by one.

Ribbons for women and girls who were raped and murdered.
Ribbons for babies ripped from their parents’ arms and slaughtered.
Ribbons for men beaten to death.
Ribbons for the hostages still suffering every moment.

And this disgusting individual took it upon herself to come along with a pair of scissors and cut each one away. Her excuse? They “condone genocide”.

Let’s not pretend for a moment that that was her true motivation. It was a revolting demonstration of the antisemitism that has become so shamefully rife in this country that it sickens me.

This woman needs to be named and shamed for the loathsome person she is.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/10/07/woman-filmed-cutting-ribbons-commemorating-israeli-hostages/

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/met-police-woman-ribbons-israel-hostages-london-manchester-synagogue-b1251594.html

https://www.lbc.co.uk/article/woman-filmed-cutting-down-ribbons-commemorating-israeli-hostages-in-north-london-5HjdF2y2/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15167737/amp/woman-cuts-yellow-ribbons-israeli-hostages-london.html

https://inews.co.uk/news/anger-woman-filmed-cutting-down-ribbons-london-memorial-israeli-hostages-3961369

OP posts:
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10
sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:42

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GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 07/10/2025 20:42

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:28

For a number of reasons.

One. Jews. Sorry, but history shows people generally can't be normal about Jews. This is on the far right and the far left who bizarrely seem to meet in the middle with antisemitism.

Two. Nice for some Muslim communities (not all but most) to have a rallying point that brings all the ummah together. Makes life seem a lot more straightforward and able to ignore all the abuses in the Muslim word. That's why they demonize Israel.

And, yes, this then gets tied up with wider current such as anti-immigrant sentiment etc

Edited

I genuinely don’t know the answer to my question!

I suspect you’re right that some people can’t be normal about Jews - even some otherwise very right on people seem to have a mental block.

But then we seem to have an increasing number of people who can’t be normal about Muslims either- probably because they are the scapegoats of the new far right.

It seems to be increasingly difficult for people to acknowledge everyone’s common humanity.

I’m massively judgmental of all of those involved in the actual killing of innocent people of course - whether it’s Netanyahu and his extremist ministers, Hamas or anyone else who thinks some people’s lives don’t matter. But I’m not going to start generalising or hating whole races, religions or nationalities.

CJsGoldfish · 07/10/2025 20:44

Nestingbirds · 07/10/2025 12:40

So you don’t want peace? Have no intention of supporting a two state solution I assume?

That's just a lazy response that proves my point. Not even worth addressing.

confusedlady10 · 07/10/2025 20:44

Livelovebehappy · 07/10/2025 20:28

Ah yes. Because Hamas are such a moral regime. Use their people as human shields. Steal and intercept aid. Fat cat leaders live thousands of miles away from their ‘people’ sat safely with their billions. Didn’t just kidnap on 7th October, but tortured and raped. I’m guessing that when the remaining hostages are released we will find out how depraved and evil they really are - most of us know, but it will maybe sink in with their apologists.

And what about the displacement, rape and murder of thousands of innocent Palestinians by the Israeli government before Hamas came into power?

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:45

Lifecanbebeautiful12 · 07/10/2025 20:41

‘Every accusation by Israel is a confession’. Israel have done all of that and more. ‘Using their people as human shields’ is a lie to justify bombing hospitals and schools and killing civilians BTW. Which I’m sure you very well know.

I am not at all saying Hamas is a moral anything, but Israel and the IDF are a damn sight worse.

Oh here we go with the tiktok slogans
"Every accusation is a confession"
Yeah, of course it is.

Nestingbirds · 07/10/2025 20:46

CJsGoldfish · 07/10/2025 20:44

That's just a lazy response that proves my point. Not even worth addressing.

You can’t address it - because then you would have to admit that you have no interest in peace at all. You answered with a lack of an answer. Thanks

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:47

confusedlady10 · 07/10/2025 20:44

And what about the displacement, rape and murder of thousands of innocent Palestinians by the Israeli government before Hamas came into power?

Hamas was blowing up buses in the 1990s to derail the peace process which would have led to a Palestinian state and an end to the conflict whjch has led to displacement and muder on both sides.

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:49

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 07/10/2025 20:42

I genuinely don’t know the answer to my question!

I suspect you’re right that some people can’t be normal about Jews - even some otherwise very right on people seem to have a mental block.

But then we seem to have an increasing number of people who can’t be normal about Muslims either- probably because they are the scapegoats of the new far right.

It seems to be increasingly difficult for people to acknowledge everyone’s common humanity.

I’m massively judgmental of all of those involved in the actual killing of innocent people of course - whether it’s Netanyahu and his extremist ministers, Hamas or anyone else who thinks some people’s lives don’t matter. But I’m not going to start generalising or hating whole races, religions or nationalities.

Definitely would be easier without generalizing about calling all Palestinians terrorists or describing Israeli society as depraved.
Civilians should never be targets. Full stop.

Keepingthingsinteresting · 07/10/2025 20:51

AngeloMysterioso · 07/10/2025 10:54

My language is designed to express my deep disgust at the actions of Hamas and of this woman. Nothing more, nothing less.

If you’ve interpreted it differently, well, that’s a you problem.

But where is your disgust for the Israeli government, who are trying to commit genocide and would cheerfully se Gaza and the Gazan people eliminated?

Skodacool · 07/10/2025 20:52

sabababa · 07/10/2025 19:45

What "the Jews" have inflicted.

Interesting turn of phrase and now we understand the Manchester synagogue attack a bit more.

It’s the same turn of phrase that you used so it must be ok.

Nestingbirds · 07/10/2025 20:53

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:47

Hamas was blowing up buses in the 1990s to derail the peace process which would have led to a Palestinian state and an end to the conflict whjch has led to displacement and muder on both sides.

I remember that too. The offer has been on the table for 30 plus years. They don’t want peace, never did, they want to rid the world of an entire race. I feel like people either are totally uneducated on this or choose to ‘forget’

Israel isn’t going anywhere - the quicker they learn to accept it the better.

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:54

CJsGoldfish · 07/10/2025 20:44

That's just a lazy response that proves my point. Not even worth addressing.

I was reading the memoirs of one of the chief negotiatiors at camp david with Barak and Arafat. He said one of the reasons Arafat and other high level palestinians wouldn't sign was that they were so enamoured of their romantic role in the West as fighting oppression and colonialism and imperialism. They knew if they actually got their own state, given the divisions and corruption in their society, there likely would be civil war and they would end up just another failed Arab state. I think the pp's post just highlights how right he was.

Nestingbirds · 07/10/2025 20:55

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:54

I was reading the memoirs of one of the chief negotiatiors at camp david with Barak and Arafat. He said one of the reasons Arafat and other high level palestinians wouldn't sign was that they were so enamoured of their romantic role in the West as fighting oppression and colonialism and imperialism. They knew if they actually got their own state, given the divisions and corruption in their society, there likely would be civil war and they would end up just another failed Arab state. I think the pp's post just highlights how right he was.

That’s insightful, it wouldn’t surprise me.

CleverButScatty · 07/10/2025 20:56

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:41

Britain isn't responsible for the conflcit between Palestine and Israel. They did their best when given the mandate. You may as well blame the Turks. The Brits wanted out and left in 1948.
Britain is just as responsible by this logic for Sudan.

But good you recognise that Israel is a democratic rights respecting country .In other words, you feel that you can actually effect some change in Israel rather than because what's happening in Gaza is the worst thing that is happening in the world. So protesting the UAE's role in Sudan is meaningless since you kow the UAE doens't give a shit what you think. Fair enough.

However, this makes absolutely no sense and sounds very conspiracy theory /corbynite like:
b) Israel seeks a high level of visibility on the international stage and has extensive lobbying activities in the UK which has contributed to the sense of outrage that for a very long time opposing the actions of Israel left to accusations of anti-Semitism that could seriously affect people's live

That is absolutely untrue. Many people can oppose the actions of israel and are not accused of anti semitism. indeed, many Israelis oppose the actions of Israel

Your opinions are just that.
I, and many others, do not agree with them. Something which has nothing to do with anti-Semitism.

Twisting my words is pointless.

It is openly known that many of Starmer's current cabinet have received high levels of funding from pro Israel groups.

Barnbrack · 07/10/2025 20:57

AngeloMysterioso · 07/10/2025 10:12

But surely there is a distinction between “Pro-Israeli” - which is to say, in support of Israel’s actions post- 10/23 - and memorialising the victims of the attack? Everyone was shocked and disgusted by the 9/11 and 7/7 attacks but still did not support the following invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, and there is no suggestion that the memorials for those attacks mean anything else other than what they are- a tribute to the victims.

Yeah, but you definitely seem pro Israeli and pro netanyahus, is that a fair assessment?

BoxesOnTheWardrobe · 07/10/2025 20:58

Livelovebehappy · 07/10/2025 20:05

I think the masks are slipping on a few posting on here. They like to bleat about of course they can dislike Hamas but still be pro Palestinian. The reality is they can only keep up the pretence for a short while before they show us who they really are.

At first I gave people benefit of the doubt and hoped they would educate themselves. But it turned out they were just anti semites all along. Didn’t take much for the veil to slip.

sabababa · 07/10/2025 20:58

Skodacool · 07/10/2025 20:52

It’s the same turn of phrase that you used so it must be ok.

"What the Jews are inflicting on the Palestinians" was your antisemitic comment. which you thought must be OK.

I had written about Jewish intergenerational trauma from the holocaust to explain why a Jewish British person is so unnerved by the increase in antisemitism that they would consider moving to israel despite the conflict.

And you then wrote

"This is why what the Jews are inflicting on the Palestinians is so incomprehensible"

Please do enlighten further what the Jews are inflicting on the Palestinians.

sabababa · 07/10/2025 21:04

Nestingbirds · 07/10/2025 20:55

That’s insightful, it wouldn’t surprise me.

Edited

I know, it really resonated with what I have seen.
But when you read how close they actually came to securing a deal, it makes you want to cry. It could have all been so different.

User37482 · 07/10/2025 21:05

Lifecanbebeautiful12 · 07/10/2025 20:41

‘Every accusation by Israel is a confession’. Israel have done all of that and more. ‘Using their people as human shields’ is a lie to justify bombing hospitals and schools and killing civilians BTW. Which I’m sure you very well know.

I am not at all saying Hamas is a moral anything, but Israel and the IDF are a damn sight worse.

No it’s not am esty international have reports on militants using hospitals. It’s a fact. If you build miles of tunnel and yet won’t shelter a single civilian you are using them as shields. Israel has bunkers for it’s people, why did Hamas not build a single one for the civilians?

Twitter is awash with Palestinians bemoaning attacks by hamas on Palestinians. They are a stain on the face of humanity. Supporting them is pro terrorism and anti-Palestinian.

User37482 · 07/10/2025 21:07

I don’t understand people who claim to be pro-Palestinian but seem keen for a forever war. Israel is not going to be wiped out yet people crow for more Palestinian blood, more Israeli blood? How much blood do you want. Hand the hostages over and surrender. Thats it.

WeeGeeBored · 07/10/2025 21:09

Linzloopy · 07/10/2025 16:43

You use the words "massacre" and "genocide" very freely. They should be reserved for their true meaning or they become meaningless.

We are not the ones who declared a genocide. Many organisations who are qualified to do so and who undertook enquiries into the whole affair are the ones who have declared what is going on in Gaza a genocide. Who are we to disagree with that?

SouthernFashionista · 07/10/2025 21:12

Ablondiebutagoody · 07/10/2025 09:51

I'm pleased that the real motives of the pro Palestine movement are becoming obvious to everyone

I agree. This woman is a disgrace.

I will forever stand beside my Jewish friends and colleagues.

BoxesOnTheWardrobe · 07/10/2025 21:12

User37482 · 07/10/2025 21:07

I don’t understand people who claim to be pro-Palestinian but seem keen for a forever war. Israel is not going to be wiped out yet people crow for more Palestinian blood, more Israeli blood? How much blood do you want. Hand the hostages over and surrender. Thats it.

But they can march and shout from a safe country. Not their blood that is being spilled. Palestine is a useful proxy for their anti semitism.

YellowDaze · 07/10/2025 21:18

nomas · 07/10/2025 19:40

I don’t know what she was feeling, I’m not a mind reader. But she didn’t respond to repeatedly being called disgusting, so I don’t think she was smug.

You don't know what she was feeling but you absolutely, categorically, definitely know that it wasn't ' smug'? so convinced of this you've repeated it three times. Righto.

BloominNora · 07/10/2025 21:21

sabababa · 07/10/2025 19:58

You are cherry picking. Always like this. Going to the few cases of Jewish terrorism.

Haganah didn't use terrorism and condemned the King David bombing.

God, the lack of historical knowledge by people setting themselves up here as somehow being knowledgable is astounding.

Go educate yourself about the Haganah and role of the Yishuv during the British mandate and come back.

I wasn't cherry picking, I just chose three of the most high profile acts of terrorism - there were many more.

Even Israeli sources recognise that Haganah were a paramilitary group that committed violent acts, so it isn't even something that can be argued as in contention. They may have helped the British capture Irgun and Lehi members for a few months after Moyne was assassinated but through Palmach, they were involved of plenty of acts of terrorism.

Here are just two Israeli based sources that provide examples of Haganah's participation and complicity

From Jewish Virtual Library.org:

"At the end of the war, when it became clear that the British government had no intention of altering its anti-Zionist policy, the Haganah began an open, organized struggle against British Mandatory rule in the framework of a unified Jewish Resistance Movement, consisting of the Haganah, Irgun Zevai Le’umi - Etzel, and Lohamei Herut Yisrael — Lehi. In its most spectacular operation, the combined forces sabotaged British railways throughout Palestine on the “Night Of The Railways.”

and here in respect of the Palmach

For seven months after the assassination of Lord Moyne, members of the Palmach under the command of Shimon Avidan were involved in the “Hunting Season,” in which they cooperated with the British in an attempt to crush the Irgun (Etzel) and Stern Gang (Lehi). Later, however, David Ben-Gurion decided on October 1, 1945, the Jewish fighting forces should unite against the British in what became the Jewish Resistance Movement. On October 10, 1945, the first operation, a raid on the Atlit internment camp that freed 208 “illegal” immigrants held there, was carried out under the leadership of Yitzhak Rabin In November 1945, the movement launching a major attack on railroads across the country and sank several British ships. In the following months, the Movement carried out attacks upon British police posts, coast guard stations, radar installations and air-fields. In June 1946, the Palmach blew up ten of the eleven bridges connecting Palestine to its neighbouring countries.

and from the Jerusalem post:

Many people are convinced that the British might have remained here indefinitely - were it not for violent actions by the underground (Etzel, Lehi, and the Hagana)...

Although the Hagana had sanctioned the King David bombing, world-wide condemnation caused the organization to distance itself from the attack. As a result, the blast signified the end of a period known as the United Resistance, in which the Hagana, Etzel and Lehi more or less worked together in an attempt to oust the British.

Haganah were also aware and in support of Irgun's plans to attack Deir Yassin in the massacre which killed 100+, including women and children, and expelled over 700 people from their homes.

Again from the Jewish Virtual Library:

On April 6, Operation Nachshon was launched to open the road to Jerusalem. The village of Deir Yassin was included on the list of Arab villages to be occupied as part of the operation. The following day Haganah commander David Shaltiel wrote to the leaders of the Lehi and Irgun:
I learn that you plan an attack on Deir Yassin. I wish to point out that the capture of Deir Yassin and its holding are one stage in our general plan. I have no objection to your carrying out the operation provided you are able to hold the village. If you are unable to do so I warn you against blowing up the village which will result in its inhabitants abandoning it and its ruins and deserted houses being occupied by foreign forces....Furthermore, if foreign forces took over, this would upset our general plan for establishing an airfield.2
The Irgun decided to attack Deir Yassin on April 9, while the Haganah was still engaged in the battle for Kastel. This was the first major Irgun attack against the Arabs. Previously, the Irgun and Lehi had concentrated their attacks against the British.

So unless you are going to suggest that blowing up railway infrastructure, sanctioning bombings and massacres, sabotaging and raiding army bases and other violent attacks aren't terrorism, just because of who it was then you are just being disingenuous.

Planning and sanctioning acts of violence and destruction, even if the intent was to only damage infrastructure and not kill people, is still terrorism. Saying, "Ooops, didn't mean to kill anyone" and condemning it after the fact does not, give people a pass, no matter how much you might want it to.

“Night Of The Railways”

Encyclopedia of Jewish and Israeli history, politics and culture, with biographies, statistics, articles and documents on topics from anti-Semitism to Zionism.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/night-of-the-railways