Thread 18: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

[DisappointedReader]

Hello all. I've simplified the opening post as I don't think we need to keep reposting all the links, timelines and so on at this stage of proceedings.

The Observer's original exposé: The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...
First thread: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film? | Mumsnet
Links to threads 2-16, the other 20 Observer articles and videos to date, Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement, our timeline and sources can all be accessed in the OP and first few posts of Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5403285-thread-17-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

New posters joining us in the genuine spirit of our civil discourse are welcome. It would be helpful to get the background from at least some of the Observer exposé items before posting.
To all - Please be extremely cautious when it comes to naming or implicating people and addresses not in the public eye or with no direct connection to the story, and around the understandable health speculations, especially where details are unclear or still emerging. Remember, even Hollywood rabbits attract the odd flea. Please do not engage with drive-by scolders who seem to have their own agenda and seek to derail. Avoid @'ing and quoting them as - from experience - this will only encourage them back to the threads. We have done amazingly well together for 17 very interesting, very serious and very silly threads so far. I can't be here as much as I'd like so all help with keeping our discussion walking along in our usual reasonable and respectful fashion is very welcome.

Now three months in, if these threads could wear slogan t-shirts they would be Mark Twain's often misquoted 'The report of my death was an exaggeration'. Applications in writing from correspondents seeking supply parcels of fudge and cider will be tolerated.

Here we are again
Disappointed as can be
All good pals and jolly good company
Strolling round the path
Happy on a spree
All good pals and jolly good company

Never mind the weather, never mind the rain
Now that we're together, whoops we go again!
Whoops, we go again
La-di-da-di-da, la-di-da-di-dee
All good pals and jolly good company

Keep to the path. No saltiness. May the fudge and cider be with you.

I completely agree about the resentment of shelf space for them. The more I think about it, the more not less cross I get, because all the airyfairy self interested claims that strenuous walking can cure or control terrible neurological conditions was criminally irresponsible to my mind, all the other egregious nonsense and the fraud aside.

My viewpoint isn't sweetened by the fact that I now seem to have some cardiac issues, possibly as a result of the sepsis and an ECG has shown something concerning, so back to the bosom of the NHS for further tests.

If anyone suggests a long walk I will not be responsible for my actions (not that I think anyone on this thread will 😁)

@Uricon2 Hey! I was able to send you flowers ... take care

Thanks @BeguiledBrandy !

It is criminally irresponsible! I totally agree!
Im so sorry to hear that you’re having ongoing health problems and wish you all the best to get better.

Thanks @HatStickBoots . I'm looking it as I'm in my 'Indestructible Era' (sorry Taylor) and it will be OK, better to know than not.

The Salt Path ......... poverty and illness can be ameliorated by the right mindset and beautiful scenery—the will triumphs, love triumphs, and there is always a cure if you walk far enough.

On the misery of others: the salt path scandal – Allyson Shaw, Author of Ashes and Stones

Really sorry to hear that. Wishing you a speedy recovery.

I hope you are ok @Uricon2 I found that I could send you flowers too, here's some more 💐 :)
Really interested piece @BeguiledBrandy thank you.

Take care @Uricon2 we're thinking of you 💐

[NB. SA content warning for Youtube video right from the start]

I'm not sure if this link has been mentioned here already - I couldn't see it - but Channel 4's recent video piece about Mike Thompson/Tom Michell's book The Penguin Lessons and his (alleged) SA of his pupils also mentions the (alleged) scandals surrounding The Salt Path (13:16 onwards). C4 make the connection that Penguin Books were the publishers of both works. They also talk about the responsibility of the film company and the producers. There's a suggestion that the profits of the hit film of The Penguin Lessons which came out last year should be given to relevant charities.

So sorry, @Uricon2 🌺 🌺 sending you lots and lots of good vibes and some un-Mumsnetty hugs.

An interesting article in October 2024 from a PSPA support group in Truro with some more detail given by SW about Moth's illness and the impact of long distance walking on its progression.

PSP understood — not too much to ask | Voice

If anybody is interested in travelogues about long distance walking I can recommend One Woman Walks Europe by Ursula Martin. She suffered from ovarian cancer, walked 3,700 miles across Wales, 5,500 miles across Europe and has just walked from Lands End to John O'Groats. She writes a daily blog and FB page so all of her activity can be fact checked....

NB It isn't published by Penguin and doesn't have a cover by AH.

@izzywizzyletsgetbizzywynthomas bet the Walkers are not turning up at that support group anymore!

Thanks for sharing this. I really don’t want to make light of such a serious subject but - such is my immersion in these threads that I read this as a “Simon Armitage warning”.
I even had a dream about SalRay the other week 😱

How interesting that RW says

"It’s not an illness that goes away. The walks seem to control some of the symptoms, but they come back when we stop. Moth gets very tired, and that exhaustion feeds into every part of life"

In contrast to the 'walking has healed him' message which intensifies as the book series goes on. Her comments here seem much more like the reality of living with chronic illness.

It seems that these conditions are so rare that - fortunately - few people will have experience of them, but then also there isn't the support for research. They are very honest that the research participants may well not get any personal benefit out of the Exeter study. I don't imagine TW is taking part.

@WyldMountainThyme I did not know about this - thank you - how very upsetting.

It was interesting to hear Penguin and the producers of the film making the same statements as they did over TSP. The producers went on to say that it was because the author, of TPL, had not been on the set - but we know that SalRay was credited with her involvement on her film.

I am increasingly finding that I think PRH, editor and SW's agent should be in for more of the blame than they are getting. Everything is being very 'glossed over' in their direction, almost as though they are unwilling participants. But following the total shock popularity of TSP (where we don't know how much involvement they had in manipulating the narrative and persuading SW to 'talk up' Tim's illness etc) they will have thrown in the "Right, now you've got produce more of the same," when she only ever expected to have to come up with one book's worth of content.

I'd also like to know how much of the following two books was 'suggested' to her. Don't get me wrong, SW is totally to blame for the lying and obfuscation of facts that run through all three books, but I can't help the feeling that she wrote one book thinking that she could get away with a bit of fudging of issues, but with its success and the insistence of PRH that she 'do it again', she found herself thrust into HAVING to broaden and deepen the lie.

@Uricon2 - sending you all best wishes for a speedy recovery. I hope the generalised ire of this thread is spurring you on!

I agree with this - thank you for putting it all so well. The writer, I shared last night, Allyson Shaw also set out her experience of being 'encouraged' to emphasise aspects of her story.

I write fiction only, but my editor and publishing house would very very much like me to write books that are very similar in content, over and over again. I don't, because my mind doesn't work that way, but if I could continually produce books about a little cottage in the countryside being moved into by a lonely and traumatised woman they would be absolutely delighted. They don't overtly try to steer me towards writing this, but there's an undercurrent of 'oh no, she's done a timeslip book, can we try to get her to write that award winner again with different names and a hero with blond hair?'

So would SW have initially approached an agent with a first draft of TSP and the agent then have suggested changes and drawn up a marketing strategy before approaching PRH?

Each agent has different requirement for submissions — three chapters and a synopsis is quite usual. An interested agent then asks to see the full MS and offers representation if they like it. Typically then they would do some work on it with the author to give it a better chance of being bought by an editor, and yes, put together a pitch letter to send out with the MS.

To add to @KettleSmocks post, I suspect that SW got sucked into the whirlwind of publication and editing very fast. Once PRH accepted the manuscript for TSP, they will have had editorial meetings and likely decided on the trajectory for the book - and probably also discussed sequels and the direction they could take. SW won't have been in these meetings or, very likely, told what was discussed, this would have been gently fed to her by her agent or editor. Very much along the lines of 'we've so much loved what you did in TSP, we think you could extend the storyline. How about a few more walks? Oh, and if you could lean more heavily into Tim's illness - the public do love a recovery story - and also put a lot of nature into it; oh, and we'd love to sign you for three more books if you think you can do this.'

At that point, all the author is hearing is 'sign you. Three more books,' and possibly being blinded by the sales figures for the first book and the marketing plans. It's only when she came to actually write them that the dearth of ideas and not-great writing skills will have come to attention and she might well have been heavily coaxed and coached by the professionals. Publishing is a business after all, and they wanted to get their money's worth.

NONE of this takes away from SW's duplicitousness, the facts of the embezzlement and the manipulation of Tim's symptoms for story effect, of course. But I do feel that SW, as an inexperienced writer never before published (apart from self published, of course), might have got tied to a juggernaut and dragged along.

Thank you all so much for your good wishes, you're all so lovely Have just learned that they are going to do the tests as an outpatient, which is great news after the grim mumblings about admission yesterday. I've had to promise to Be Good and call 999 if any concern at all etc but happy to free for now!

@BeguiledBrandy thank you, the Allyson Shaw piece is very interesting on the subject of the knock on effect of the success TSP on other authors in the genre and the expectations from publishers.

@WildMountainThyme the C4 piece about the Penguin Lessons is shocking. I can't see much about it elsewhere so perhaps these men have now gone to the police and there won't be until after investigation.

I'm so glad that you now have the outpatient option. Can I add my positive energy to everyone else's? I hope your health improves quickly and that the results of the tests are happy ones.

Re Penguin Lessons, I very much hope any of the men affected are getting good support and that, assuming they've gone to the police, they are believed.

I don't want to derail the thread from the main topic but, as was the case with Jason Isaacs and Gillian Anderson, there's been no comment yet that I can find from Steve Coogan although the story has only recently broken. He played Jimmy Savile for TV so he's already had lots of publicity about thinking through the decision to take that role on.

Like TSP, I read Penguin Lessons via library audio books. I'm glad I hadn't bought that book either.