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Starmer thinks I am an enemy of the state

1000 replies

Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 10:14

So we have it Starmer has declared at conference because I support Reform I am now an enemy of his Government.

Who would have thought it, a middle class British worker, now an enemy in the country I was born. And they say Reform is the party of Fascists. Yet we also now have the Home Secretary saying "In solving this crisis, you may not always like what I do. We will have to question some of the assumptions and legal constraints that have lasted for a generation and more". Maybe the Home Secretary too will be deemed an enemy of the state.

Am I being unreasonable to think this should be seen as a rallying cry to get this Government out at the first opportunity.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
28
Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 14:08

randomchap · 01/10/2025 14:06

Yet more deflection, how tedious

Apologies if it was AI. I just assumed no in real life would be rude to demand a response on chat forum.

OP posts:
StaroftheKentishTown · 01/10/2025 14:09

TwistyTales · 01/10/2025 10:24

He didn't call you or anyone else an enemy of the state. This is what he said:

Controlling migration is a reasonable goal.

But if you throw bricks and smash up private property…

That’s not legitimate – that’s thuggery.

Free speech is a British value – and we have guarded it for centuries.

But if you incite racist violence and hatred…

That’s not expressing concern – it’s criminal.

This party, this great party, is proud of our flags…

Yet if they are painted alongside graffiti…

Telling a Chinese takeaway owner to “go home”…

That’s not pride – that’s racism.

And if you say or imply…

That people cannot be English or British…

Because of the colour of their skin…

That mixed heritage families owe you an explanation…

And that people who have lived here for generations…

Raised their children here…

Built lives in their communities…

Working in our schools, our hospitals, running businesses…

Our neighbours…

If you say they should now be deported…

Then mark my words…

We will fight you with everything we have…

Because you are an enemy of national renewal

Yes. If you heard this speech and concluded that KS was calling you a racist for voting/supporting Reform then you lack very basic critical thinking skills. On that basis

BIossomtoes · 01/10/2025 14:09

EasternStandard · 01/10/2025 14:08

I feel similarly re your posts.

Maybe you should take the trouble to read them then.

IsEveryUserNameBloodyTaken · 01/10/2025 14:11

JHound · 01/10/2025 10:31

The irony in this post.

Well the person you are replying to is correct.
Can you explain what you mean in your comment please.

EasternStandard · 01/10/2025 14:11

BIossomtoes · 01/10/2025 14:09

Maybe you should take the trouble to read them then.

Feel free to post to others instead I won’t mind.

ZlaMavka · 01/10/2025 14:11

HardyHiker · 01/10/2025 14:00

As others have said that is not what Keir Starmer said.

I truly believe you have a right to your opinions, and to vote for whomever you like, but, which of Reform's policies do you agree with apart from immigration?

It seems to me that their other polices do not add up; I can't see where they are raising the revenue for all their plans:
They want tax cuts for the richest
They want to replace the NHS with an American insurance based system.
They wants to come out of the ECHR, and cut workers hard fought for rights
Farage does not just wasnt to stop 'illegals' (btw no person is illegal), he has said he wants to stop indefinite leave to remain; this will tear families apart and decimate the NHS.

I'm in my 50s and looking forward to retirement. We need immigration to help ensure there are people to pay into our system and fund benefits and pensions. I dont want to get to retirement age to find there is no pension anymore because there ae too few younger people paying in!
To me all the parties Farage has led, UKIP, the BREXIT party, have been single issue parties like Reform, and none of his other policies stand up to scrutiny. He is a hypocrite having a German passport, so he hasn't lost his EU benefits like the rest of us, doesn't spend anytime in his constituency, or help his constituents. His rhetoric is divisive and harmful. That's not the sort of politician I want representing me.

The russians - who hate the West - seem to like him and his party, too, which is a worry.

Grammarnut · 01/10/2025 14:12

I don't agree with Reform at all. However, there is a case for looking carefully at immigration both legal and illegal (for most people I know entering the country illegally is a crime demanding deportation). One reason I don't like Reform (and never trust the Tories) is their ideas about de-regulation. De-regulation leads to Grenfell - indeed did under Cameron who would not have any new regulations so attempts to stop the use of the cladding used on Grenfell were blocked.
If there is a fence, check why it's there.

EasternStandard · 01/10/2025 14:12

Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 14:08

Apologies if it was AI. I just assumed no in real life would be rude to demand a response on chat forum.

Yep. I wondered if they were a ‘chap’.

HedwigEliza · 01/10/2025 14:13

StaroftheKentishTown · 01/10/2025 14:09

Yes. If you heard this speech and concluded that KS was calling you a racist for voting/supporting Reform then you lack very basic critical thinking skills. On that basis

No, he’s made it clear we’re his enemies for differing politically. We’re not on board with him, so we’re now enemies. Good to know that’s what he thinks of us.

TwistyTales · 01/10/2025 14:13

Violinist64 · 01/10/2025 13:39

If they fell on hard times, of course they should be heped but not necessarily by a blanket increase in the number of children eligible for child benefit. It could be via universal credit or other benefits. As for your disingenuous comment about "fecless women," yes, of course we should support each other but it is a fact that a small group of women and men are feckless. Most people do the best they can under the circumstances.

but it is a fact that a small group of women and men are feckless

Yes, but we should never punish the majority for what a minority of people do. And we shouldn't leave children in poverty.

I noticed you didn't directly answer my question.

DuncinToffee · 01/10/2025 14:14

Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 13:35

They have got three years to build the team. Labour could do with some stronger candidates in office right now. After 12 years of planning most of their ministers didn't see out a year in role.

How long has Reform been planning? Farage had plenty of time, UKIP, Brexit Party.

How are his newly selected councillors faring?

randomchap · 01/10/2025 14:14

Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 14:08

Apologies if it was AI. I just assumed no in real life would be rude to demand a response on chat forum.

And I thought no one would be so rude as to just indulge in pointless whataboutery.

Underthinker · 01/10/2025 14:14

persephonia · 01/10/2025 14:02

Well, other people on this thread (friendly ginger cat) seem to think it is and that this is a good thing. So at least some Reform supporters seem to think this is what will be happening.

His promise to end permanent residency is not only for new applications but also for people who have already applied under the existing rules and been approved. So that would mean deporting masses of people many of whom have lived and contributed in this country legally for years. I don't know how that isn't mass deportations. It's certainly getting some of his supporters excited. Although Farage himself said in 2024 he thought such a thing was impossible so who knows what he really thinks.

You must see how that's different to a rule change for new applications. It just feels inherently unfair and is pandering to ideas of "remigration"/Net zero immigration isn't enough, we need to send back the people already here sort of thing. It's an escalation of his own rhetoric and more extreme even than some of the people on SYLs march said they wanted.

You must agree that "rounding up and deporting en masse people who are non white.." is a deliberate and alarmist mischaracterisation. Labour's policy would also cause some non white people to lose the ability to stay in the UK, but I wouldn't describe it as rounding up non white people.

BIossomtoes · 01/10/2025 14:15

HedwigEliza · 01/10/2025 14:13

No, he’s made it clear we’re his enemies for differing politically. We’re not on board with him, so we’re now enemies. Good to know that’s what he thinks of us.

If that’s really your sincere and genuine interpretation there’s no hope for you.

EasternStandard · 01/10/2025 14:15

randomchap · 01/10/2025 14:14

And I thought no one would be so rude as to just indulge in pointless whataboutery.

The current gov isn’t that pointless. I mean a bit but they still have an impact.

Bloozie · 01/10/2025 14:17

I'm very interested in learning which of Reform's non-immgration-centric policies people are interested in. Without mentioning the Labour Party once.

Locutus2000 · 01/10/2025 14:17

Bumblebee72 · 01/10/2025 11:43

If you want threads without debate head over to Style and Beaty or TV addicts. Robust views is what AIBU is famous for.

We all see you.

HedwigEliza · 01/10/2025 14:18

BIossomtoes · 01/10/2025 14:15

If that’s really your sincere and genuine interpretation there’s no hope for you.

He’d have been well-advised to use another word. But he chose not to.

randomchap · 01/10/2025 14:19

EasternStandard · 01/10/2025 14:15

The current gov isn’t that pointless. I mean a bit but they still have an impact.

Deliberately misunderstanding my post now? Lol

Somuchfakeinfo · 01/10/2025 14:19

All political parties are in it for what they can make out of it once in power.

None of them give a shit about the regular people who vote them in; they only care about doing things that improve their lives or the lives of their mates/sponsors.

Also, they're generally all rich enough to be able to avoid any tax rises they make; it's just the rest of us that have to suffer.

I don't believe a word any of them say. They offer the world to get into office, but once they have the power, they simply do what benefits them, regardless of their promises.

Unfortunately, I don't know what the solution is.

I'd get rid of all of them...make it a voluntary job with very limited expenses paid (& a maximum of say £12,000 in any one year), and I bet there'd be no one left who wants to do it because they aren't doing it for the good of others as it should be done.

TwistyTales · 01/10/2025 14:19

HedwigEliza · 01/10/2025 14:13

No, he’s made it clear we’re his enemies for differing politically. We’re not on board with him, so we’re now enemies. Good to know that’s what he thinks of us.

Which part of this calls Reform voters enemies?

Controlling migration is a reasonable goal.

But if you throw bricks and smash up private property…

That’s not legitimate – that’s thuggery.

Free speech is a British value – and we have guarded it for centuries.

But if you incite racist violence and hatred…

That’s not expressing concern – it’s criminal.

This party, this great party, is proud of our flags…

Yet if they are painted alongside graffiti…

Telling a Chinese takeaway owner to “go home”…

That’s not pride – that’s racism.

And if you say or imply…

That people cannot be English or British…

Because of the colour of their skin…

That mixed heritage families owe you an explanation…

And that people who have lived here for generations…

Raised their children here…

Built lives in their communities…

Working in our schools, our hospitals, running businesses…

Our neighbours…

If you say they should now be deported…

Then mark my words…

We will fight you with everything we have…

Because you are an enemy of national renewal

SirBobblysock · 01/10/2025 14:19

"So we have it Starmer has declared at conference because I support Reform I am now an enemy of his Government."
You feel free to believe it if it makes you feel important.

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 01/10/2025 14:19

TwistyTales · 01/10/2025 10:24

He didn't call you or anyone else an enemy of the state. This is what he said:

Controlling migration is a reasonable goal.

But if you throw bricks and smash up private property…

That’s not legitimate – that’s thuggery.

Free speech is a British value – and we have guarded it for centuries.

But if you incite racist violence and hatred…

That’s not expressing concern – it’s criminal.

This party, this great party, is proud of our flags…

Yet if they are painted alongside graffiti…

Telling a Chinese takeaway owner to “go home”…

That’s not pride – that’s racism.

And if you say or imply…

That people cannot be English or British…

Because of the colour of their skin…

That mixed heritage families owe you an explanation…

And that people who have lived here for generations…

Raised their children here…

Built lives in their communities…

Working in our schools, our hospitals, running businesses…

Our neighbours…

If you say they should now be deported…

Then mark my words…

We will fight you with everything we have…

Because you are an enemy of national renewal

I find this pretty powerful - unlike almost everything else KS says

HardyHiker · 01/10/2025 14:20

HedwigEliza · 01/10/2025 14:08

‘I'm in my 50s and looking forward to retirement. We need immigration to help ensure there are people to pay into our system and fund benefits and pensions. I dont want to get to retirement age to find there is no pension anymore because there ae too few younger people paying in!’

What a totally self-centred attitude. Yep, let’s bring in endless immigrants instead of galvanising the large number of young citizens of this country and getting them into work - who cares that their lives are made infinitely more difficult, their wages undercut? As long as your pension’s paid, eh? You’ve had your life, want to retire and you’re happy to screw over the youth of this country to enable it. What sort of country are you creating for those who come after you? Who cares, as long as you’re comfortable...

This was not about me, that was supposed to be a light hearted way of looking at it, but sorry if you thought I was being selfish. The fact is there are not enough of our own young people to support the welfare state for all. I am in favour of supporting all ages, particularly young familes with children. I want to see the 2 child benefit cap lifted and supprt for all workers. Reform is proposing cutting workers rights and scrapping the NHS. They will defund Universities. None of that will help young people. I want to see well funded public services like the NHS, and education, early years funding and support for all ages. I work in the NHS and have seen the problems 14 years of Tory underfunding have caused. I also know that without the support of my colleagues from overseas, it would not survive.

I have children, and hopefully will have grandchildren at some point, I want them to thrive too. I want a fair society for all.

DingDongJingle · 01/10/2025 14:20

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 01/10/2025 14:19

I find this pretty powerful - unlike almost everything else KS says

Yes. I can’t stand Starmer, think he’s an ineffectual weakling, but this is the most powerful thing he’s said.

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