Sick of the lie 'It's just illegal immigrants people don't like.'

[Slightyamusedandsilly]

This is just not true.

Reform, the flag flyers and protesters are racists. All of this 'It's just the illegals we want gone.' is a lie to excuse their racism.

Another reflexive insult without any thought or anything to back it up with. No wonder no one pays the "anti racisim" brigade any notice. Which in itself is a terrible situation they have got themselves into as of course real racism still exists! Just not really where they seem to think.

For clarity, you have nothing against legal immigrants who apply and interview for jobs, pay all their dues/taxes/council tax/etc, rent or buy a house, etc

Correct?

I’m not the poster you asked, but at this point, we know we have serious problems. Would it not be sensible to have a moratorium on immigration for a number of years, perhaps bring the temperature down and then see where we are as a nation? We know we can’t keep immigration levels so high. These problems aren’t going to disappear, so would it not be sensible to calm things down instead of heading down this same road regardless of risk?

Do you have a problem with the illegal migrants I was referring to in my post? Because it doesn't sound like. And therein lies the problem.

1000% agree with you. Hopefully it won't be long before they start turning on one and other. They're definitely not very bright.

I love how you've worded that and then suggested people are "not very bright".

I honestly would suggest that you visit your local mosque and just sit down with some of their congregation and have a cup of tea and a chat. You seem to have picked up some misunderstandings about Islam. The vast majority of Muslims are very tolerant and respectful of other religions. Jesus Christ is also a prophet in Islam.

Our local mosque is also a community centre and it works tirelessly, holding clubs and events across all faiths. They have sports and homework clubs for kids, a scout group, they provide free cooked meals for anyone who is hungry. They have ‘Family fun days’ with games and a bouncy castle and a bbq. They feed the homeless on the streets. They do all this to reach out to the local community and to try to bring everyone together. It must be a huge slap in the face to hear people say that they refuse to integrate. They honestly couldn’t do any more, and our town is better for them being there.

They are our neighbours, friends and colleagues. They’re not Taliban, though I’m sure that some of them originally came here fleeing the Taliban. You seem to have lumped all Muslims into one enormous group and think they’re all the same.

Loads of them aren’t even particularly religious. My sister-in-law is a Muslim. She doesn’t cover her hair, she drinks alcohol, and she married my white atheist brother. She still considers herself to be a Muslim. This idea that all Muslim women are poor downtrodden victims is just wrong. All the Muslim women I know are strong, feisty, capable women.

It’s really unfair to demonise an entire faith because you’re understandably scared of a few religious maniac fundamentalists living many thousands of miles away.

Hi, is your concern more cultural rather than economic?

Hi, that is an option - I wonder if this is realistic tho. Our education (higher) system for one is reliant on fees from international students, so we need student immigrants for time being, we have also industries that even now have unsustainable vacancies and if we halted immigration we would face even more acute issues than we are already aka NhS / social care - we’d have even longer waiting lists, operations taking longer to have - impacting our health but also creating more cost for public purse as people get sicker while they wait.. there will other examples but we do have a conundrum. Last year immigration (net) fell by 50% - to 478k.or 0.6% of the population. I don’t feel that is super high tbh? But regardless, I don’t know what an acceptable figure would be for the parts of the country that are really worried about immigration. This is a bit of a tangent but also I think one thing I tend to remember is that being British is multicultural due to fact we still govern 56 other countries via commonwealth and also due to empire when we ownerd half the world, those nations became citizens of uk too. My feeling is that the root of social issues atm is down to fact we are in a recession - Brexit has truly stiffed us economically but also we have had so much of our wealth taken out of public hands - everything had been privatised - water, rail, social housing, etc. we are paying 30-60% just to shareholders on bills, for example. Wages have flatlined as profits go again back into hands of shareholders and financiers which is causing people to worry about their security and this does at times as it has before in recent history tend to stir feelings of panic about resources and who is to blame.

Quite. But also it’s a weird one when immigration seems to be shorthand for a fear of Islam. Immigrants can and do travel here from across the globe - from our 56 commomwealgh nations, our former colonies which is pretty much half the world and more. On a personal tip, I am an immigrant - I’m Irish/ Swedish. Both parents migrated here in the 60/70s and met in London. I was born in Sweden due to my mother a former nhs worker being concerned at lack of hygiene in 1970s hospitals and took me back to Sweden. I returned when I was 1. I have an Irish passport and have access to eu, freedom of travel, right to live work in eu and also free education (degree) at any age for any of my kids in europe. My kids are studying in Dublin and Berlin. My other son is working in Denmark. I know my father and his family experienced fears of Irish immigrants in the 60s - no Irish, no blacks, no dogs. The Irish were called feral, violent, stupid, lazy, to be laughed out, to be feared, to be treated as less than the English. I feel the concerns about immigration are down to fears people have about people that are different to them, just like the English feared or disliked the Irish. I worry that there isn’t an answer that will satiate those who worry about immigration and that tensions will continue to escalate.

I appreciate what you are saying here and ut saddens me to think that is his experience. But I did want to ask, in your opinion and in your partners opinion, where do you think the line should be drawn on who is entitled to come here for a better quality of life, to make more money than they could at home and send it back to their home country. Because Britain is not an economic zone to be harvested by the world en masse?

The cultural concerns are very real.

Hey. Is your concern then not about immigration but a concern about followers of Islam?

Well I don't have anything to say about most of your post but in the interests of fairness, the English haven't been that popular with the Irish either....

Hi Honish, what do you feel are parts of English identity or culture that you are worried may be lost?

Agreed

All of it.

We are already being fed halal meat without giving our consent or being informed, as many institutions only supply halal as a policy.

Rule of law - There are nearly 50 Sharia courts operating in the UK.

Free speech - people are currently in hiding for ‘insulting the Prophet’, with no arrests for this. Blasphemy laws are brewing.

The social cohesion of everyone, or the vast majority, speaking the same language and being able to understand each other in finer points of conversation.

LBTQ tolerance - mobs have formed outside of schools to demand their children are never to hear about same sex relationships even existing.

What more do you want?

Let’s also note the Irish seem to, all of a sudden, be less than happy about immigration and have been marching themselves. Ditto Scotland. Turns out it isn’t just inherently nasty English people 🧐

Not Popular vs systemic discrimination…
Ireland was colonised by England & there is as we know some quite dark and complex history there. Whilst some Irish may not have much love for the English establishment, there’s always open arms and welcome for everyone, including the English ☘️

Hi Uggbootsforever.

your worries seem focused on those that follow Islam? Would this be right?

Gosh I'd forgotten about that poor teacher from Batley. Hideous.

Some Irish, a minority. And I’d agree, there is concern about immigration across Europe from what can see and read in media.

Well obviously not, because the English invaded us!

'In the interest of fairness; you say..........and then you leave the entire context out 😂😂

Yes.

I’m not a racist.

I don’t care if one day this country ends up as Sikh, Hindu or Wiccan. Countries don’t stay the same forever. Things evolve, places change. I don’t care what skin colour people have, or what the predominant skin colour ends up being here.

But that’s because I don’t see mobs of Sikh men surrounding primary schools baying for the blood of teachers, or demanding intolerant views of gay people be taught. I don’t see Hindus insisting animals be killed in a cruel manner for consumption, and I don’t see Hindu men in other countries decreeing women are unworthy of education or even leaving the house unaccompanied.

I won’t apologise for this and it isn’t racist.

If Islam came into existence tomorrow, and was predominantly a white person thing, the views on it here would be very very different.

I think it would be helpful if you could first deal with the points actually raised. And then we can discuss whose fault it is?

Do you think any of those points listed by @Uggbootsforever are valid? Are they good things or bad things?