AIBU to think that even the good ones are a bit shit?

[Dontasksillyquestions]

Are there any men out there who actually do 50/50 when it comes to childcare, housework, and the mental load?

My husband is a good guy - he’s respectful, spends time with us, helps with cleaning, is great with the kids, and provides for the family. But when it comes to the mental load, it's mostly on me. I handle the kids' appointments, school stuff, making sure they have clean clothes, and I do all the cooking, grocery shopping, and laundry.

He’s not great at DIY and needs constant reminding to do anything. If something breaks, I fix it or it stays broken. I also deal with all the tradesmen and house stuff. He handles the car and the dog.

On paper he’s a good partner, but lately, I’ve been thinking life would be simpler without him - smaller house, no dog, fewer chores. It’s so frustrating having to constantly remind him to do things. I don’t want to be his manager; he should just get things done. And when he complains about how tough life is and how we never get time to ourselves, it really gets to me. He doesn’t have as much time for his hobby as he used to, but I don’t have any time for myself at all. I always prioritise his free time and well-being because he complains.

If our marriage ended for any reason (just to be clear, I’m not thinking of separating, it’s all hypothetical), I wouldn’t be with another man. At this point, even the “good” ones seem pretty useless. My friends’ husbands are the same - generally nice, helpful guys, but still not really 50/50 partners. Then there are the absolutely vile men you read about on here - the cocklodgers, gaslighters and cheaters.

AIBU to think that they’re all a bit shit actually? 😄

If you are both working full time, the housework & childcare should be split more evenly.

This is an important question - do you work as well OP? I couldn’t tell from your posts and it really makes a significant difference .

If you work full time and things are not 50/50 at home there’s a massive inequality there but if you don’t work outside the home it’s a totally different ball game! I’d say if it’s the latter you should be doing more of the domestic stuff as a SAHP and would BU to think otherwise.

As a ND woman who struggles to keep on top of life admin and domestic stuff alone I hope my future partner will be ok with doing more of certain things - eg housework and I’d compensate by doing more in what I was better at such as cooking or organising social events. And we could split childcare.

If I was a SAHM that would be different, I’d expect to be able to shoulder most of the responsibility myself. I just find it challenging to work AND do all the house stuff. But assuming I’m also working full time I just wouldn’t be able to deal with a partner not doing 50/50.

We share things and I’m very happy. I do diary management and logistics (it’s my job so I find it easy) he does insurances organising practical repairs

We both do cleaning and share it equitably.

For example, I had a lie in at the weekend. I came down and dishwasher, cat litter, and general downstairs tidying were done. For other weekend jobs we wrote a list (well he started already, I added some bits) and we worked through it together)

He does most diy and maintenance. Although I also get stuck in and share that load.

I promise they exist.

I am not that poster but my reading of it is her husband has stepped up and does what he is supposed to do mostly without being asked . Hence she says “trained” him as a past tense thing.

OP, if you’re having to repeatedly “train” your husband to do the same things on an ongoing basis and he isn’t showing that initiative he’s not really trainable then is he!

Sometimes adults don’t know what they don’t know, we were all were raised differently. But once you’ve shown him how to do certain things, the point is he’s supposed to be able to identify what needs done and participate fully off his own bat since he’s an adult and not a teen!

But he hardly shows any initiative. Won’t clean anything extra unless told to, wouldn’t think to book a holiday or a day out, will go shopping, but only with an explicit list, will only cook dinner if he’s told what to do and the ingredients are readily available. At some point it’s not worth the effort of micromanaging and it’s easier to just do things myself

I don’t know I feel this sounds like what they call “weaponised incompetence”.

There are but they convince themselves there aren’t to justify the way they live and what they put up with.

I have a friend with a partner like this and eventually I’ve told her to stop complaining to me if she’s not going to take it up with him.

She knew what he was like when she got with him over 15 years ago and she chose to stay and have two kids with him.

She has tolerated and enabled his laziness, so she can either accept it or challenge him. No point in talking to me about it all the time but then letting him get away with it.

Generally, yes, he does most things automatically, now. He sorts out everything to do with the cars (insurance, servicing etc) and the household utilities, insurance renewals, Sky renewals, etc., without me being involved at all. He leaves the shopping and cleaning and ironing to me, which is fine, but will step up and do things when I ask him to. But he'll automatically hang out/bring in the washing, empty the dishwasher etc, put the bins out/bring them in, etc when appropriate without me asking. If he says things on the floor, he'll get the vacuum out. He'll make the bed in the morning, put his used clothes in the basket/washer, etc. When I gave up work to have DS, I started doing more in the house (as I was in most of the time with him) but it was more a matter of me doing things before he got home rather than him stopping doing things! If he notices something like us running out of bread/milk, he'll mention it and offer to pick some up. Likewise, will check dates on milk, cheese, yoghurts etc to remind me if things are getting short to sell by dates. I normally do the main food shops, but on the few times I've been unable to and asked him to do it, he's done a pretty good job at following my list and making sensible substitutions and adding things he thought of that may not have been on the list.

So yes, it really has been "training" in the nicest possible way. From the outset, I made it clear what I expected of him, (almost literally from our first date!) and except the odd hiccup along the way when he's genuinely forgotten something, he's effectively "trained" to be self sufficient, clearing up after himself, and I've no doubt I could go away for a week, and come back to a generally clean/tidy house, food in the cupboards, no piles of dirty laundry, and the bin back in it's place! In fact, when we had our DS I was in hospital for 10 days with an emergency c-section and he pre-emptedly brought me most of what I needed without asking, and the house was just as I'd left it, he'd done a good job of visiting/supporting me at the hospital AND keeping the house clean and tidy, he'd even found time to mow the lawns, wash, iron and put away all his used clothes (and whatever I'd given him of mine from the hospital etc).

But as I think I'd said in my earlier post, if he hadn't done what I consider pretty basic things of being an adult when we first started dated, I'd have thrown him back, like I did with the guy before him who clearly just expected me to pander to him like his mother did with a side serving of sex on request! (He didn't last long at all!).

Very true point about military. My father was in the RAF and was VERY particular about everything, i.e. clean freshly ironed clothes, house tidy, everything in it's place etc., and did his own ironing etc. My mother got off lightly as father (when he was home) virtually took over the house as it was what he was used to when working away for long periods of time. My mother didn't pander to him as she didn't need to.

I grew up in that environment so to my mind a "tidy/organised" man of the house was normal and I didn't know any different, which is probably why I had high standards for my early boyfriends! Without realising it, I probably wanted a partner to be like my father, as it's literally all I knew. I never really realised that some men didn't look after themselves, didn't clean, didn't tidy, etc., until I started dating really and was quite shocked at the behaviour of some!

You’re not shit on purpose though. Like a lot of men.

Mine is fairly good as they go; he does about a third of the cooking but most of the washing up. Does half of the laundry and the bins/garden. We split the cleaning half half and he does all the shopping.

He’s pretty good at mental load (very good at managing the family calendar, much better than me). Good at anticipation of stuff that needs doing. Doesn’t do pickups because DD is a teenager.

Bur I agree that even with a “good” one there are still irritations. He had a tendency to ask me if I have done something pretty non-critical late at night when I have a ton of other things on my plate and sometimes lacks the ability to read the room on my workload.

And if we split up I don’t think I would bother again.

Show me a human being who’s perfect.

Another day on MN, another man bashing thread 😄

Totally agree with this!

My DH is “good” - he does his share of parenting, jobs around the house but can’t seem to see I do these things day in, day out without any recognition! He will announce “I’ve done the ironing FOR YOU,” and it enrages me!

I saw a post the other day asking if FWB’s are ever a good idea. If DH and I ever split up I would love a friend who just came over for sex now and again and never expected me to wash his socks or clean the bathroom sink when he’s left little beard hairs speckled around it and “didn’t notice”

My STBxH does his fair share of childcare, but he doesn't do any of the hard stuff ie. the discipline, he also interfers when i am taking responsibility for DD. This just adds massively to my mental load, as DD has learnt to 'play him' which just makes everything infinitly harder work. On the rare occasions I get to to the bedtime routine on my own (he WFH and is a bit of a recluse so is always around) it is so much calmer smoother running and takes a fraction of the time.

It's quite an achievement that his active contribution to the family load can actually make things harder on me!!

No, it's not. My husband is 74 and an immigrant from a very traditional, patriarchal society. We've been together 40 years. He's always done cleaning, shopping, cooking and childcare.
It's the person. Mine is a properly decent man.
I think some people's bar is set very low.

I am currently divorcing and so have been mulling over the prospects of future relationship, inbetween the time spent wallowing in self pity about being single FOREVER!

I have read that relationships where the couple continue to own and live in seperate properties but are commited/ monogamous and 'date' long term can be one of the happiest options, just, sadly, it is not financially realistic for many people.

My own dh is actually very good in terms of practical stuff round the house, but the mental load still falls to me. Also there are certain jobs that are mine no matter what, like wrapping Christmas presents (once actively vomiting with norovirus whilst he was well).

What I notice as well is that, even if they are trying, there is often a vague sexism that pervades. My piano teacher is a good example of this - he’s a great guy, I really like him, but there is always the hint of a sneer about female composers.

My DH does half.

Actually he does more than half of the parenting and house stuff because I’m doing a 3 year professional qualification on top of my full time job at the moment. So he does more of the other stuff than I do, in order for me to have time to study.

And a couple of years ago before I started the qualification, he already did half.

I think it’s probably to do with his family - I’m not sure of the exact set up when he was growing up, but certainly now when we go over to PILs’ house, it’s just as likely to be my FIL cooking dinner as it is my MIL. My in-laws also do a couple of days of childcare for us, and when they send us pictures or DD2 tells us what she did, it’s just as likely to have been FIL who took her to the playground, or did jigsaws with her, or read books with her etc. So DH doesn’t have a dad who leaves all that to his wife.

My husband is absolutely amazing. He wfh and does all our cooking, shopping, laundry and takes most of the mental load with house things. He does the bins and the gardening too. He’s the sort to notice tooth paste etc is running low and just replace it. He’s thoughtful and caring and just the best life partner I could ever ask for. I work long hours out of the house, he does a lot more than me! I’m the crap one

You are so lucky. My dh and I both do hybrid working. But god forbid I ask him to quickly hoover or put the washing in the dryer on his lunch break . He gets stressed and says he can’t work properly if he has to do housework on his break. It’s fine when I do it though because I’ve been blessed with the gift of multitasking 🙄

Gets stressed with a bit of housework?
How pathetic. Mine has had a hip replacement and I heard the hoover going this morning, he was doing the stairs.
Has this attitude of his been there throughout your marriage?

He was awarded “Man of the Year” (ironic title) by my former firm after dropping DS off at the wrong school and then driving 100 miles for work with his phone switched off.

@Vinvertebrate that's quite something .....

My DH dropped our kitten off at the wrong vets when she was due to be spayed/neutered, but I can't compete with your experience!!!

It's so bizarre how these threads extrapolate from some shit, sexist men that cleanliness and tidiness are somehow gendered characteristics.

DP is easily tidier and more domestically inclined than I am. I'm the one who'd happily live in chaos and who had to up my game domestically when I moved in with him, and I doubt I do anywhere near 50% even now.

This is far from the only messy woman/neat man dynamic I know of.

Maybe it's easier to tell yourself every aspect of your lives is determined by your genitalia? It seems hard of thinking to me.

Yes, I work too in an equally demanding career. He earns more because salaries in his industry are higher.

I've been thinking about this, and looking back I think every boyfriend I've ever had was cleaner and tidier than I am.

DH is definitely tidier than me. So we do tend to divide and conquer a lot - he will tidy up while I'm doing actual cleaning. if I leave him to clean the kitchen it will either take him 2 hours or it will be done badly. Or both.

But if he leavs me to tidy the lounge, it will take me an hour and still be messy after.

So pre cleaner he was usually in charge of vacuuming and tidying while I was whizzing around actually cleaning things!

My dad was definitely 50/50 so I think that did inform my expectations which meant when DH was a bit shit in thebeginning, I didn't just roll my eyes. I remember sitting on the end ofour bed in our first flat after we moved in together and crying that we were plannign this lovely holiday together and I'd had to do all the work and then on top of that, when I'd pointed out that he hadn't done any laundry even though he'd been off from work he'd said, "but you didn't ask me to". We had no children, we'd only just moved in together but I had already on some level clocked this wasn't okay and just didn't have the background to slip into this mindset. That's when the "training" started!

Db, dbil, other dbil, but they’re all very by the book and ‘let’s get this done’ (sink once blocked at Christmas time, db was only here for a few minutes but went out to get drain unblocker, came back and fixed it!! Dbil and dsil used to have huge conversations about their week ahead and how to navigate everything, it seemed extreme but I don’t know now …

I used to like that that dh was more relaxed whilst simultaneously wishing most of the home stuff didn’t have to come down to me!

eta dh is the cook and actually is a much better cleaner but doesn’t clean unless it’s an occasion

Don't know where you are finding your men, but my DH of 37 years and I both do our share of whatever jobs need doing. It has never been an issue which I am very glad about.

Although I don't think I could have put up with anything else tbh.