Charlie Kirk- and the reality

[Tandora]

So here we are- they have a suspect.
The very little we know about his politics suggests he was likely to be right wing, and came from a family/ culture that supported Trump. He also is said to be an introvert, in to video games , and possibly quite mentally unwell.

So there we have it- fancy that - when you live in a context where people have access to guns and some minority of people are not well, people get shot.

Nothing to do with the evils of the “left”. Nothing to do with trans people or “trans ideology”. Just senseless violence, because people who are not well have access to guns.

So what are we going to take/ learn from this?

AIBU?

Fascist is used as an insult to shut others down.Usually by fascists themselves.

if You read my posts (which I don’t believe you have) you will see that I mentioned “innocence” in relation to my personal feelings of empathy or sympathy for CK. i explained that I do not have strong feelings of sympathy for CK and I explained why I don’t and why it is the utmost hypocrisy to demand that I must. However, I feel empathy for his children because they are entirely innocent in all of this.

CK was a misogynist and a racist. I’m not sure whether on mumsnet we are allowed to use the “f” word- but in my mind he was this. He was instrumental in the election of Trump and Vance who are doing substantial harm in the world, destroying American democracy , and the rights of women, minority , immigrant and lgbt people, and making us all less safe. He promoted the right to own weapons, which ironically is exactly what facilitated his murder. That doesn’t mean I support his punishment by death. I don’t support punishment by death for anyone , no matter how guilty or wrong they may be.

If it turns out they have the right suspect in this murder, I will not consider him to be “innocent”- nor will I support, condone or celebrate his execution which seems to be the plan. I think that is horrific.

😂😂

I don't think he was fascist or racist. At all.

This.

Fill your boots. I'm off out. Said what I need to. Forced you to be open about your views on gender identity and all this from a person, myself, who doesn't believe that anyone can change sex - not possible.

What great revelation do you think I’ve made exactly? 🤣 I’ve never hidden my views. I don’t support gender identity ideology for reasons of women’s rights and I don’t call sons daughters. Big wow.

And most of what you said is nonsense, and you know it @placemats and the cherry on the cake is that you were wrong. Have a lovely evening.

He wasn’t. He was a moderate American conservative who was trying to have conversations - which the left constantly claim to want! - with young people. For that he was publicly executed in cold blood and millions of people were jubilant and celebratory and felt comfortable posting to the world that they felt this way.

But he was a baddie yes? A wrongun? A Nazi perhaps? Killed by his petard, yes? You’re kind of, sort of sad for his kids but probably in the grand scheme of things it wasn’t that dreadful a thing. Am I picking up the correct vibe?

That’s is exactly why he was killed.
His words were seen as violence by the left who wanted him silenced.

You are indeed picking up the correct vibe from Ms Flabbergasted here.

Yep. Pivot

If you think that decency requires a person to excuse the use of inflammatory and violent language, to glorify dangerous men like Vance and Trump, to promote extreme right wing ideology that promotes enforced pregnancy and birth , even for child rape victims, the submission of women to men, and the idea that the murder if children in schools is “worth it” to protect a man’s god given right to own a deadly weapon- if excusing this is your idea of “decency” then I am horrified. And , no, I won’t comply with your idea of “decency “ if this is it.

I think in any religion, if a man (men) have the beliefs and one of them is that women should comply with them that's harmful.

Ouch. Looks like you’ve been owned.

It’s funny how people who hate Charlie Kirk end up becoming experts on everything he said — quoting sound bites completely out of context, but with utmost confidence that they are correct.

Either you’ve been binge-watching an awful lot of Charlie Kirk over the past few days, or you’ve always been a secret fan. I’m actually guessing neither and you’re just reusing Twitter ‘gotchas’ with zero context.

Before I go is stating that a person can never change sex nonsense?

I think CK was a bad , very wrong, very stupid and dangerous person,- yes. That is my opinion of him.

He advocated for the conditions that facilitated his own murder- yes- this is fact.

Do I think he deserved to be murdered? No.

My heart goes out to his children. But I do not personally feel much sympathy/ empathy for CK; I think requiring this of people is hypocritical and dishonest,

What I find particularly irritating is that so many posters are twisting what his views are.

If you are going to post about his views, people should at least post about his views and not the twisted versions that some are happy to put forward.

Lets be honest here, its not difficult to find proof of what he actually believed on marriage, guns, politics, trans and gay matters.

So it should be very easy to post actual quotes and videos without spinning what he meant.

Jesus tandora, you're bad enough when wanging on about trans rights on the 50k sandie peggie threads but you've changed your flabbergasted focus on this thread so many times I've lost count.

It started out this morning with the 'suspect is obviously right wing', then when that is increasingly not likely it was 'he definitely isn't in a relationship with his trans pal' then 'it's all rumours unless I hear it from the horses mouth' and once all the housemate stuff was proved correct you've now moved onto slating his grieving widow.

Your flabber must be well and truly wasted by now.

Yawn.

Yes, the moral highground is all yours.

It’s funny how people who hate Charlie Kirk end up becoming experts on everything he said

why? I despise Trump but take interest in the things he says because they have influence. Do you only take intetest in things you “like” regardless of their importance in the world? odd.

“quoting sound bites completely out of context,”

I quoted what he said , entirely in its context.

Stop minimising the harmful ideologies that are creating the conditions for gun (and other) violence in the USA, these are the conditions that led to CK’s death.

i didn’t know whether it was true or not, all the articles i read which you mentioned didn’t know either

which is why in a one of my earlier posts i said ‘yet’

didn't accuse you, didn't say you’d made it up…just that there was no evidence

you are absolutely right though, the evidence is through and you should feel vindicated 💐

I do believe it absolutely is.

Yes that’s the problem.
You think you are right.