To be saddened that anyone would want to take away a woman’s right to safe abortion?

[Balayagequeen]

It makes me sad and angry that there are so many people who believe that a woman’s right to a termination is up for debate/political football.

It’s always privileged men too.

No woman should be forced to continue with a pregnancy that she doesn’t want.

An abortion is a very safe, simple procedure, it’s a personal and private choice, it’s discreet, no one is ramming it down anyone else’s throat or trying to persuade others to do it. The vast majority of the time is done very early on in the pregnancy. Evidence shows that there are no long term negative physical or mental effects on the woman.

As someone who works for children’s services, there are already far too many children in the care system and they can end up deeply traumatised, and having poor outcomes in life, adoptions often don’t work out and even when they do can be extremely traumatic for both the mother and child. That is not to take away from all of the wonderful adoptive parents and foster carers, but please let’s not romanticise it.

Most adoptions are because the birth parents are unable to care for the child, not because the mother willingly gave the baby up. Therefore to force a woman to give birth would potentially be the worse option for the woman, the child and any existing siblings. It isn’t a fairytale ending where a woman willingly gives up her baby to a loving couple to live happily ever after.

There are babies conceived in poverty, domestic abuse, rape, teenage pregnancies, older age pregnancies. These women should not be forced to give birth, it is not the better option for anyone.

If abortion was ever restricted in the western world then I have no doubt that it would result in unsafe illegal abortions, risking the woman’s life.

Women take all the risk with pregnancy and childbirth. They take an enormous toll on a woman body, her mental health, her life outcomes. We are not living in the dark ages, women deserve the choice.

What right does any privileged male who has probably never experienced any of these things and has probably done very little child rearing, who can never conceive or give birth, have to try to restrict a women’s access to abortion?

Are they themselves going to care for the babies born? Or will they expect that someone else will do it?

This is a good point. Woman’s life must take precedence over foetus when woman’s health at risk .

When did I imply I agree with them?

Im arguing against the misogyny it’s with their dramatic language but refusal to actually answer questions? I’ve asked a few and tried to engage in debate but they just waffle on about baby killing then leave.

when have I implied I think all restrictions should be lifted? Can you show me the post?

Being pregnant almost exclusively impacts the woman only and therefore should be decided by the woman and not men in high powers (yes some knock on impact to DH if they have a partner but immaterial enough that men should not get a say). It’s their body, their impact on their career, ability to work whilst pregnant, pay, quality of life, difficulties in birth, pnd. The list is endless . America terrifies me and its on the list of countries I will never visit for this reason.

@ProfessionalPirate you called women seeking 38 week abortions “baby killers for sure” - so sensitive of you given that literally the only reason this can and does happen is because her life is at risk and she has to save her life over a WANTED baby. what a nasty and putrid person you are to call a woman in that HORRIFIC situation a baby killer. Does it make you proud? Do you feel good saying that?

How do you know every single woman looking for a late term abortion is doing it to ‘save their life’?

This is the bit where you don’t understand the law.
Women can only get late term abortions for life saving reasons. That’s how I know. If you knew the law you’d understand it also

@TeaForTheTillermanSteakForTheSun
A wide choice of easily accessible birth control is available to most women. Why don't the majority try using that, rather than using abortion as a form of contraception? Use birth control and they can happily "live the life they want".

To be fair, I haven’t noticed anyone saying they want to restrict abortions. Maybe I missed it. I think most people on here are saying they are pro-choice, rather than pro-abortion.

Even in countries with limits of 14 weeks, abortions to save the mother's life or because the foetus will not survive birth are available.

The morning after pill doesn't always work.

If legal and safe abortions are banned, it will not stop abortions. It will lead to illegal and unsafe abortions, with women dying as a result.

Abortion is a women's health issue and should be treated as such.

I don't recall expressing such a thing as my ultimate goal.

You’re the one not fully aware, as at 38 weeks gestation the foetus would almost certainly be delivered alive in the event of the mother’s life being at risk, not aborted.

I haven’t read all of your posts but in your replies to me you stated that a 38 week gestation foetus ‘wasn’t alive’ and were pretty militant about the woman’s life and body being the only thing that matters. You must be pretty new to mumsnet abortion threads if you don’t realise there are plenty people out there who think all abortion restrictions should be lifted.

Anyway, i don’t know whether it’s tiredness or drink but your posts seem to be getting increasingly incoherent so i think its time I called it a night 👍

You or anyone can think what they like, but it's absolutely none of your/their business what other women decide to do with their bodies. I always think it's astonishing how the anti-abortion brigade are only ever interested in the baby while it's safely in utero - once it's out their interest always seems to vanish pretty quickly!

Contraception would not even be expected to be needed by, never mind available to, a 12 year old who is raped by a male relative or a predator.
No child should be forced to give birth to a child. No rape victim should be forced to go through pregnancy and bear her assailant's child. No victim of incest should be obliged to bear a child under those circumstances.

And that is my own moral position.

Yes, they also don't give a shit about the woman. She is a literal vessel to them.

You really don’t understand the concept of a hypothetical situation do you? 🤦🏻‍♀️ We are DEBATING what would happen if the law changed one way or the other.

A 38 weeks pregnant woman whose life was at risk would seek an urgent delivery, not an abortion. Do you not understand the difference or something?

I would go one step further and say it is evil to force a woman to propagate the bloodline of her rapist. Continuing a legacy should be a gift never forced nor an expectation.

Because birth control never fails does it? Smi h more interesting question is why don't more men have vasectomies instead of expecting women to spend half their lives on hormonal contraception?

Agree completely with you. Growing up in poverty can be miserable. I really question the intentions of those that would change policies to bring more children into poverty. However I do not believe that life is the ultimate gift. I think it is kinder not to bring children into bad situations and kinder still to assist the children we have already in poverty.

Just don't have sex if you don't want children

Because of abortions.

If you remove that men will be getting the snip

I hope this is satire.

Ahahahahaha! That’s a good one. Are you here all week?

Men get their dick wet consequence free. You must see that right

So what if they do.

The alternative is punishing women for a mistake - either intentional or unintentional - not to mention punching a child by bringing them into a world where they aren’t wanted.

I haven’t seen it either.

Im pro-abortion as in pro abortion being safe legal and available. Not sure of any other definition!

I think everyone on both sides probably want fewer abortions because for pro-choice people it means women aren’t getting into situations where they have to make that unpleasant choices, and for pro life, fewer babies are “killed”

Children are a consequence

Ah So you’re pro choice? I misunderstood and thought you were anti choice