Had you heard of Charlie Kirk before yesterday?

[Havetoagree]

Just that really? I hadn’t and wondering if I’m the only one. And why is it such a big story? I guess the association with trump. What would be the equivalent level of fame over here?

No, but I think for people like him the best solution is to ignore them. What they want is attention.

He also didn’t like the concept of empathy so there’s no need to extend any to him. Hopefully his children will grow up to want to leave a better legacy than he did.

I wasn't aware of that but yes absolutely.

I don't understand how normal people who would ordinarily condemn such extreme views, including on here, be falling over themselves on to elevate him to hero like status.

Next up Hitler was a jolly nice chap.

He also didn’t like the concept of empathy

I’ve seen this misquoted soooo many times today.

He didn’t say that.

He said that he preferred the word sympathy to empathy.

So it’s fine for a 10 year old to be ripped apart physically to give birth. To be utterly traumatised by the experience of pregnancy and birth in a body too young and under developed to deal with either. To possibly never be able to have any more children due to the physical damage. To be so psychologically scarred by the experience that she will likely never have a normal relationship or sex life ever.
To not have autonomy over her own body. All for some man’s beliefs.

Sickening.

Can you please quote the posters who justified his murder? I can't see any.

I'm confused why you think its okay to spread vitriol and then wonder why people aren't upset about the consequences of actions?

Was his skirt too short?

Did he having it coming?

The consequence of having a different opinion are never death.

You are so lost.

I think a big part of this is that Kirk was able to come across as quite reasonable and compassionate even in a lot of debates. So people's impression from clips is more like that and they might not be aware of his extreme views.

Plus he got radicalised fairly recently. He started off moderate on gay rights and supporting church state separation, then more recently fell under the spell of Christian nationalist pastor Rob McCoy and went rapidly downhill.

@Justagirl95is quoting things that Kirk said.

There have been many threads, with many deletions since this happened.

Just because you haven’t had the displeasure of seeing those posts, doesn’t mean they didn’t exist.

Presumably in that situation a 10yo would have a casarean though.

I agree it's still sickening.

I'm glad we don't have many people in the UK w the character that mean they think 10yo rape victims should not be allowed an abortion and gay men being stoned to death for sex is 'God's perfect law for sexual matters'

Full quote being: I can't stand the word empathy, actually. I think empathy is a made-up, new age term that — it does a lot of damage. But, it is very effective when it comes to politics. Sympathy, I prefer more than empathy. That's a separate topic for a different time.

He still said it though. Just like many other questionable, even vile things.

His last IG caption was play certain games, win certain prizes. A fitting last post for a tragedy that will unfortunately just inflame US politics even further. There will be a new Charlie in no time.

Thank you for that info. I'll look into McCoy.
.

Oooh you were so close to understanding.

I'm sure Charlie is looking up at you smiling.

You're distorting his comments on black people.

No one has justified anything, people are just not crying buckets over a hateful man who defended guns with all his might.

Yes, didnt always agree with what he had to say, well a lot of what he had to say, but respected his ability to hold a respectful discussion/debate.

I think anyone being assassinated on a stage in front of a huge crowd in any capacity would be a huge story.

I'm gen X - I couldn't have put a name to him before his death but realized I had seen clips from some of his videos previously. Listening and reading about his views now, there is practically nothing I agreed with him on other than the harms of Gender Ideology - and my opposition to that comes from a feminist perspective not a religious, conservative one.

I think, if we take his words on a variety of topics at face value, it's difficult to argue that he wasn't racist, sexist and homophobic and as far as I can tell, he used his platform, not to bring people together in genuine debate, learn about other views points and find common values, but as a vehicle for propaganda and as a way to play to his own supporters by hammering his often unwitting/naive/ young/stupid/idealistic/take your pic opponents into the ground.

Having said all that - I still support his right to speak freely without threat of violence and I think his murder - like the left wing Democrats shot and killed previously - is absolutely abhorrent and these kinds of political assassinations should be anathema to any decent thinking person who understands the value of free speech, democracy and the rule of law. Anyone who is dismissive of, or worse gleefully celebrating this type of brutal, shocking and very public execution, loses all moral credibility as far as I'm concerned - whether they're on the left or the right.

So, none on this thread? Why do you keep dragging it into your conversations with posters on this thread if they're not the ones doing it?

How can you possibly say that when it's only what you've "read"?

A lot of his words have been taken out of context, if you watched full videos you'd know that,

A lot of people have been sharing quotes and headlines, that affirm their bias.

It's incredibly easy to find headlines and quotes, without context, and frame someone in a particular light.

I didn't agree with most of what he said, but the world is a bloody much worse place because of his murder, Not because his words were meaningful, but because it's ended free speech . No one will be brave enough to debate, when doing so can get you killed - and people fall over themselves trying to justify it.* *

The Iman at one of the mosques in my town has said some incredibly offensive things about women, saying they shouldn't work, that Western girls lask to be rated...should he be silenced? No, of course not,

Charlie was obviously very religious (like the Iman I mentioned), he held views that would obviously enrage. But to be slaughtered forhis views , in front of his wife, toddlers and the audience, that's not just abhorrent, but extremely worrying.

The day before he died he posted a video of Iryna Zarutska, a considered piece ( I didn't watch it all though). Another senseless killing.

I just wish words were used against words, not fists, not shouting, certainly not guns.

I’m a decade older and I knew about him. You might need to follow US politics but he was a very skilled orator and debated well. His whole thesis was to talk about topics that people felt strongly about on all sides of the political divide. It’s a terrible loss.

It’s interesting how people are saying he didn’t deserve this violence just because he had a different opinion, when Charlie Kirk made a living of finding academics who had different opinions to him, gay or black or female usually, and then added their names to his
list that was effectively a hit list. Within days of one academic being added to this list she was having hundreds of phone calls and messages calling her an N-word and a whore people threatening her life. All set on her by Charlie Kirk for daring to have a difference of opinion.
so if you object to people disliking him for his opinion…then you should give him the same energy.
if you use violence and nastiness and cruelty as your platform, then you can’t be that shocked when it catches up to you.

Did I say there were none on this thread.

Look, if you can’t see it, I can’t help you.

Seriously.

Yeah you can help me, you can quote the ones you're talking about.

Plenty of people are trying to justify his murder.

Apparently death is a consequence of the opinion you hold. Did you miss that?