Differences (rep Ireland) Irish V UK

[Sillysandy]

I am Irish living in Ireland. My DH is British, he is an immigrant who grew up in London but had lived for 20 years in Ireland when I met him.

I discovered mumsnet about 8 years ago when I took on a sort of stepmum role and was flabbergasted at some of the stories, attitudes and opinions.

I still found the site extremely helpful, often giving me clarity on situations which would cause me a lot of angst.

However when I talk to friends and family members living in the UK I realise that a lot is to do with cultural differences.

It's amazing given how close geographically we are.

Attitudes to money, marriage, divorce, wedding gifts, abortion, house purchases, communication with friends are so far from anything I've seen in my circles.

To give my pov; (these are all generalisations) we get married later, we stay married, we don't consider abortion unless it's very particular circumstances, we are indirect about money "I'll get this one, you can get the next one (but it is LAW you only accept if you are buying back)" and sending bank details for a small amount would be horrifyingly rude, you only attend a wedding with a card containing at least 100 euro pp, you usually get married in your mid thirties, your kids are mainly all with the one father, we hide behind humour until we know a person very well, we don't report benefit fraud, we laugh a lot more... That's just off the top of my head.

The other thing is that most Irish people know all about English Irish historical tensions but many English people are utterly oblivious.

YABU You're talking out of your ass
YANBU The differences are enormous

I'd love to hear some thoughts on this. In my line of work now I do a weekly call with my UK based team and I always notice subtle differences in attitude.

But what if money is an issue for person B but they still want to spend some time chatting with their friends? Where I’m from it would be perfectly acceptable to say ‘money’s a bit tight so I’ll just stick to getting my own thanks’ or ‘I’m on the lime and soda tonight so I’ll get mine separately etc’ and you’d just bypass the rounds. It wouldn’t signify anything about how long you’re planning on staying for.

Same as what happens if you can’t afford 100 euros as a wedding gift (that’s more than I’ve spent on any wedding present ever including close family/friends) - is it best just to rsvp no to avoid the etiquette fail? If so that seems really sad to me.

I was wondering if you are in Dublin , OP . I am and abortion is certainly considered here . Very much so , by most people I know.
The biggest differences I see are

• class - Irish people really never refer to class at all . It's not really a 'thing'. And if you did , people would think you were an idiot . Or had 'notions'. You'd be laughed out of it .
• how loud people speak - we Irish tend not to be very loud , certainly not to the extent that everyone in the environs can hear the minutiae of what we say . However , if a group of people , English mainly as have limited experiece of Scotland and Wales , are talking - everyone can hear their conversation !

As a fellow Irish person OP, I find your post stupid, reductive and offensive. Of course there's going to be some differences, we have a very different history. But there's a barely veiled superiority complex in your description of Irish people v English people that is complete bollocks. Also, how dre you generalise on people's views on such a sensitive topic as abortion? Or do you just live in one of those rural socially conservative hamlets where everyone holds the same views and talks about GAA 99% of the time and compete with each other over who has the most expensive bbq / equivalent bullshit because something has to fill the cultural vacuum

Those of us who travelled for terminations in the eighties and nineties, or sat with a friend bleeding into pads on the ferry home, or who remember the abortion information at the back of Cosmopolitan being blacked out, or who spent our time stickering public toilets with the abortion information helpline phone number, are very keen on legal, safe abortion as easily and locally as possible.

I have relatives in Ireland and in my experience people hang out primarily with family members - and since they come from such big families, they have loads to choose from, as second cousins twice removed or whatever are still considered family.

But I really don't understand your thoughts on rounds. I live in London and it would be social suicide not to get a round in. Imo English people are absolutely sticklers for order - queuing at bus stops and like you say, reporting benefit cheats - and that includes getting rounds in.

how on earth do you think you get to know people if not by seeing and chatting to them regularly?

seriously, how did you make friends/meet romantic partners?

This does match up with what a few people said upthread about Irish people being superficially friendly but ultimately focussed on their small communities and not willing to welcome outsiders/make new friends.

Poor woman though! She was only inviting you for a quick coffee, not to move in with her.

Respectfully, while your relatives may hang out with their family, I don’t think that’s anything like a general rule. For a start, emigration is far more culturally normal in Ireland, so many of us have immediate family scattered anywhere from Tokyo to Guatemala. At one point, my siblings and I were in Lodz, Athens, Beijing, Tokyo and Calgary. Three of DH’s siblings are in NY, Berlin and Lincolnshire.

Well i wasn't affronted, or rude to her, just really surprised, we talked abut meeting up but never did in the end. If i was looking to make friends I suppose I would have gone but I wasn't particularly, and she wasn't an outsider, she was local, she had been to that school herself as a child as it happens.

Well if they're paying for their own drink they clearly do want one, they just can't/don't want to get a round in.

Don’t override their wishes so.

class - Irish people really never refer to class at all . It's not really a 'thing'.

Is the Ross O'Carroll-Kelly column still a thing? According to wikipedia there are 24 novels and 4 plays in the series. Somebody must be buying them over the past 30 years.

Well, I don’t think British people talk about it a lot, either. It’s still operative in both countries, though differently, for obvious reasons. Yes, Ross O’Carroll Kelly is still going — newspaper column, books, plays. And Reggie from the Blackrock Road has made an entire comic persona from snobbery in Cork.

My nieces is Irish and she has loads of local relatives. Some moved to England for a while but they all moved back. Her mum for example - she moved here, married my English brother in law, then they moved to Ireland to raise their family. Her sister did the same.

100%. As (another) fellow Irish person I find it really cringey, especially the blatant sense of superiority about our supposed generosity and social skills. it smacks of small rural village life, and I was really surprised to hear that the OP lives in South Dublin (which is a microcosm in itself, but usually a more outward-looking one). The attitude to wedding presents and rounds etc is so transactional, it’s embarrassing. And don’t get me started on the “You have to refuse the first offer of a hot drink” nonsense…

I spent several years living in the South West of England after having my first child; I made friends easily and definitely felt there were far more similarities than differences between me and other women my age. Our sense of humour and general outlook on life is very close (you only have to look at that Twitter account Very British Problems, every single thing that’s posted about resonates with me as an Irish person).

No, declining the round is fine. You can give any reason. But accepting the drink but not entering the round is a major fail.

You sound nice.

I'm from South county Dublin but I've lived all over the country (and multiple other countries). My DH is British and lots of my family live in the UK. I have cousins and friends who live in the sort of GAA type places you so nastily sneered at.

I've had an abortion and many of my friends have too. However back then we had to leave the country so maybe that coloured our views. It was an extremely painful experience for me. I hope it it now easier.

How bizarre you would refer to my superiority complex and then speak about rural Ireland like that.

So your sample size is one.

Interesting!

I wonder then is it that we are indirect "what are you having... I'm going up there anyway... Sit down, I'll get it..." And it looks like a gift when the expectation is that you will be bought one back.

I have noticed that the automatic round culture seems to be dying out but I don't know if that's because my peers and I got older and are more careful with our disposable income now we have dependents.

It's quite normal for us to now say "are we doing rounds or getting our own?"

To be fair I'm rarely in the pub these days so I don't know why I even have an opinion on all this!

I've loved the replies, I think they are so interesting especially the pp who described the superficial friendliness of Irish people striking up conversations with strangers.

Also, lots of comparisons with Northern English people where I have NO family members.

I personally think they are really funny but we grew up in those schools and circles; his insights are bang on about how ludicrous it all is. I'm surprised though that they got translated and sold so widely, it's such a tiny proportion of society he's describing.

What's the hot drink thing? I said nothing about this.

As for you making friends easily in the UK and supposed superior social skills; you are making the SAME point if you read the posts properly..

South County people by and large are not outward thinking, you are wrong wrong wrong about that. Luckily I have moved around but many of them never look outside their own postcode or neighbouring fee paying school for friends, colleagues or partners.

Of course there are more similarities than differences between Ireland and the uk. How ridiculous. I'm talking about the seeming similarities but subtle differences.

A lot of this thread is making me wish I lived in Ireland!
This is why I love reading irish fiction.

@AppropriateAdult

I would hotly dispute that those of a certain subset in SoCo Dublin are more “outward” looking. Perhaps that mid Atlantic , Americanised accent is giving this impression.

You are completely correct that there more similarities than differences. Differences are fairly subtle.

😁 Ah, they’re a law unto themselves (I have many friends in this demographic!) but at least tend to be well travelled and less tied to tired old stereotypes. The ‘Irish exceptionalism’ being displayed on this thread, and the examples given, all seem very specific to rural communities.

Same. And I grew up right in the centre of it.

No. I just mentioned one niece and her situation as an example. I can run through all the Irish families i know if you want. None of them have this diaspora you have in your sample of one.