Differences (rep Ireland) Irish V UK

[Sillysandy]

I am Irish living in Ireland. My DH is British, he is an immigrant who grew up in London but had lived for 20 years in Ireland when I met him.

I discovered mumsnet about 8 years ago when I took on a sort of stepmum role and was flabbergasted at some of the stories, attitudes and opinions.

I still found the site extremely helpful, often giving me clarity on situations which would cause me a lot of angst.

However when I talk to friends and family members living in the UK I realise that a lot is to do with cultural differences.

It's amazing given how close geographically we are.

Attitudes to money, marriage, divorce, wedding gifts, abortion, house purchases, communication with friends are so far from anything I've seen in my circles.

To give my pov; (these are all generalisations) we get married later, we stay married, we don't consider abortion unless it's very particular circumstances, we are indirect about money "I'll get this one, you can get the next one (but it is LAW you only accept if you are buying back)" and sending bank details for a small amount would be horrifyingly rude, you only attend a wedding with a card containing at least 100 euro pp, you usually get married in your mid thirties, your kids are mainly all with the one father, we hide behind humour until we know a person very well, we don't report benefit fraud, we laugh a lot more... That's just off the top of my head.

The other thing is that most Irish people know all about English Irish historical tensions but many English people are utterly oblivious.

YABU You're talking out of your ass
YANBU The differences are enormous

I'd love to hear some thoughts on this. In my line of work now I do a weekly call with my UK based team and I always notice subtle differences in attitude.

I’m an Irish person living in Ireland, having lived abroad for over two decades. I can assure you my sample size is not one.

Excuse me!😅

As we’re speaking of stereotypes, some posters on this thread seem to have very strange and negative views of those who live rurally. Just because you don’t live in SoCo Dublin that doesn’t make you an old-fashioned stick-in-the-mud. Come on!

Ross O Carroll Kelly ' legend of Leinster schools rugby ' . That's him wrapped isn't it. A small but disproportionately influential milieu even within South Dublin. I know I'm repeating myself but this is about money , not class in the English sense of that word. Our native middle class is still in its infancy really. Of course he's a snob and despises the ' boggers'. Where would you locate Ross in the English class system , with his bizarre Valley Girl mash up of an accent ?

I was simply commenting that your example is one, just like mine is. We both have plenty of other examples.

But my understanding is that people no longer need to leave. There are many more opportunities in Ireland these days. Another niece has just moved back with her English partner.

Yes. Ignorant, obnoxious and small-minded.

I totally agree the 'class' thing in Ireland is different. It is money. You can move 'class' in one generation if you go to a fee paying and have wealthy parents. It doesn't matter if your grandparents were farmers (as mine were).

I hope I explained that correctly.

No, of course it doesn’t, I was unfairly generalising a bit. But the specific examples that were being touted here as being an ‘Irish thing’ - I’m thinking mainly about enormous weddings where people are expected to ‘cover their plate’ and anyone who doesn’t is talked about afterwards - are something that I’ve only ever seen outside Dublin, and even then I think it’s a tradition that is (thankfully) dying out.

The expression 'cover your plate' isn't used really in my Dublin circles but giving money does still seem to be standard.

I had a big birthday party a couple of years back and some of my rural relative gave me cash or sent via revolut. I was very surprised.

Somebody mentioned up thread about the shoving notes into children's hands. I had completely forgotten about that until a few years ago I took DC to meet some older relatives on my estranged parent's side. Everyone of them thrust 20 or even 50 euro notes at DC. I was horrified! These people are all on their pensions. Then my (same age as me) cousin did the same and I wanted the ground to swallow me up; their DC were also present and I had no cash on me.

Many Irish people are well traveled. The Irish travel a lot. The fact that you think that an insular bunch from south county Dublin who are all interconnected and go to a small number of schools and often characterise everyone from outside Dublin as “from the country” are outward looking because they go skiing is bit mind blowing.

There is no exceptionalism (except for the funerals) Having a biscuit with your tea is nice, giving 100 euro at weddings is nothing to write home about.

Being elderly we were the recipients of towel sets and fondue sets. I blame Eddie Hobbes who did a telly programme on how to afford a wedding for the big cash gifts. And Franc for the fabulous wedding industry.
Mil bought us a spin dryer!

That’s made me howl! Spot on!

Again - that’s just standard rounds that you’d find in UK pubs too. Although I’m happy to include friends in my round who I know aren’t really in the position to get one themselves - hate seeing someone nurse a soda water all night when everyone else is having wine (obviously if they don’t want one I’m not going to force it on them!). It doesn’t need to be tit for tat, they’re my friends so even if it doesn’t financially even out over time I’m sure they ‘pay me back’ in other ways.

Eddie Hobbs is definitely to blame. "Invite as many guests as possible and TELL THEM you want cash"

Whilst all that sounds great I’m always surprised that people speak about Ireland in such fond terms but ignore that absolutely disgraceful way it has treated women, in recent living memory, compared to the UK. Aside from Magdalene laundries being prevelant and not being abolished until the late 90’s, as well as the horrific misogyny around abortion laws only recently repealed, the rate of domestic violence and sexual violence women experience is terrifying.

I haven’t even got started about the pedophile priest scandal which the Irish Catholic Church really is not sorry for and continues to cover up

Not to mention legislation passed in Irish Parliament last year which entitles charged sex offenders to anonymity. So men who have harmed women and children may get away with it - such as Jon Worboys who, if he was Irish today, would still be raping women in his taxi. And it’s a shame this law means the many victims of George Gibney won’t be able to follow his trial unless he’s actually convicted

So it’s really great that you put €100 in a wedding card I guess, but I’d rather stay on this little island than be somewhere that only recently saw me as worthy of having rights to my body, only recently stopped enslavement of promiscuous women, only recently stopped stealing babies and who protect sex offenders before they protect victims. UK isn’t perfect but it’s a damn sight more progressive and safe for women in 2025.

I was nodding along enthusiastically with your post agreeing with every word you said until your weirdly confrontational closing paragraph.

Why are people here so defensive?

"Oh my god, how dare you start a conversation about differences, you must think ireland is better than the UK"

It's pretty sad.

The magdalene laundries were indeed horrendous, but they actually originated in the U.K. and were initially protestant run. Did the Catholic Church run them for many years in Ireland, yes they did, to Ireland's eternal shame. And while the last one closed in Ireland in the 1990s, at that time pregnant women hadn't been sent there for decades, institutionalised women were still being housed there, some of whom had dementia and other health/mental health issues. The Catholic Church has a history of abuse throughout the world, and are ruled from Rome, again shameful for Irish society but not actually an exclusively Irish problem. I can't comment on the recent changes in anonymity of sex offenders becausei haven't heard about it but generally, I can only say that anonymity is usually to protect the victims, if they are under age or if they would be identified by the perpetrator being named.

I didn’t mean to be confrontational.

But your OP seems to centre around “We do this better” - you don’t say it is better but it’s implied you think so, which is fine BTW (The money in restaurants thing in the UK gets on my tits and I cringe at the cheapness of it all) or that the culture is better. Well actually I don’t think the culture IS better, and I’d rather focus on, in my view, issues that matter. I don’t think I see the romantic view of Ireland many others do because of these issues.

No, that is your interpretation.

I’m aware laundries were also in the UK but they close around 30 years earlier than the last one in Ireland. Similarly, abortion rights were 50 years later.

Magdalene laundries may well have continued had the uncovering of a mass grave not happened in 1993. I don’t think the Catholic Church had a sudden moral epiphany.

In the case of anonymity, so many adults have come out about the abuse at the hands of George Gibney. Before they’d be anonymised in court but now he will be too.

Yes it is. I don’t think it sounds better because the fundamental core important things about life that go behind the doors of a restaurant, such as women’s rights, are really poor in Ireland compared to the U.K.

Just my opinion.

Maybe because people were keeping it light - hearted and humorous!

Irish women certainly don’t ignore the way women have been treated in Ireland. But thanks so much for your lovely show of solidarity.

Violence against women today in both the UK and Ireland is too high. You’re a bit confused about the legislation that was passed last year, it about all about protecting victims identity.

The laundries, the church scandals, the abuse in Catholic schools - yes external shame but I don't think we are learning from them as I think the Direct Provision Centres are the current scandal we all politely ignore. Also the acceptable racism towards the Traveller community.

I don't know how true this is but my dad once commented to me that there are so many more people with Down Syndrome now than when he was growing up because if a baby was born the nuns would just let them die. Barbaric if it's true.

We did however give women the vote before the UK which surprised me when I heard it first.

This is really the point I was trying to make. Irish and English people are very similar but there are differing attitudes under the surface due to the church and our history of being colonised (like the not reporting to the authorities).

Indeed and I think they are still refusing to release the files.

I think @LayerCakeOfStrangers put €20 in a card when she was at her nieces wedding in Kerry last year and now she has the sinking realisation that she has made a social faux pas and is feeling defensive.

How can Ireland have given the vote to women when women had the vote in 1918 and ROI didn’t become independent until 4 years later? Not being facetious BTW!