To be annoyed that my employer won’t let me go part time?

[Topoftheroof]

I currently work full time 5 days a week. I made a flexible working request to go part time to 2 days a week because of personal circumstances (family circumstances) but it was declined. I’m annoyed though because there are other people (2 other people) working in the company only 2 days a week so it’s not unheard of. But they won’t consider it because I’m a head of department (not in a school and nothing to do with education or academics) and they also won’t give me another role in the company either which can be 2 days a week. I feel like I could cry with stress, I can’t afford to not work at all but can’t work 5 days a week at the moment either due to circumstances. I explained on my request that part time 2 days a week might not be permanent but they still declined the request. Both my boss and the managing director are always moaning that they “dread the day” I leave because “there’s no one in the business as good as” me so it’s baffling to me that they wouldn’t approve the 2 days a week knowing that I can’t work full time 5 days a week at the moment but then at the same time always say that they don’t want me to leave the company and would do anything to stop me leaving. I haven’t decided if I should appeal it yet or not, I don’t know what to do. I’m just really upset and have been crying about it because I can’t afford not to work at all and can’t do full time at the moment either. I’m also very annoyed with my employer too for rejecting the request. AIBU to be annoyed with my employer about this?

But the family members who would fall out with you are not taking this on either. If they can say no to it then why can't you?

No that’s not correct. A potential fall out with family has got nothing to do with it and nothing to do with the reason why it’s not a simple situation.

Are you Staff @Topoftheroof or freelance / ftc? Would they have to pay double NI etc if you job shared? If you’re staff, could you suggest job-sharing with a freelance HoD to reduce the prod co’s costs? Is there a Line Producer they could extend / take on who would stay at their LP weekly rate (so no tax etc liability for the company) but get the title to add to their CV? Sweeten the deal for the MD!

I’m confused - are you asking to work 2 days a week but get paid the same amount as you are now?
or get paid for just the two days?

Oo that’s a good idea actually. I didn’t think of that. Thank you so much. I’ll have a think about that and possibly suggest it to the MD, I’m not sure if he would agree though but it could be worth a try. Thank you so much

Oh great. Your request for flexible working was declined, so you go off sick. "Lack of flexibility" and "trying to get rid of you" are inflammatory and unhelpful. The reason for the request will have been considered, but how on earth can you say that your 5-day week can be done in 2 days? If the work will be going to others, will they need to be paid more for acting up to your role for 3 days? And what about continuity for internal/external customers? I don't understand how this would work.

I have been careful with how I put it across to them.

Have that extra meeting but I would go off sick if possible until you can manage 5 days or find another job.

It's an odd decision. If the children are not siblings, why would there be a family fallout? Do you actually want to take on this child? Nobody should take on a child out of obligation - it will not be good for the child.

I have two children and a full time job. I won't have a third because I don't have that time or bandwidth, financial or emotional. So I don't.

I cannot comprehend why you would tell your employer that you can do your full time job in 2 days (but then reserve the right to increase back to 5 days). You do see how ridiculous that is?

There won’t be a family fallout so I’m not worried about that at all. That’s what I was trying to say when I responded to the other poster who asked about the possibility of a family fallout.

Please can you tell us the reason you're doing this?
I can't imagine feeling that much obligation to raise 4 children that aren't my own.
Is it purely obligation? Does having 4 Foster children make you fulfilled with life or is this destroying the life you wanted?
No hate, I'm intrigued and feel sorry for the position you are in x

No worries @Topoftheroof !

You want a freelance LP who’s ready to step up so will take the credit without the uplifted rate. They should already be at the company or a prior (loved) employee - they need to know the systems and have relationships with the channels so they can hit the ground running and you can seamlessly job share.

If they won’t go for that, no dice… (only other add-on to a No would be to go back with a final suggestion of the above but instead of 50/50 job share, offer 75/25 with you doing the 3 day week obviously!).

Can you have an ‘off record’ conversation with them both? Explain your personal circumstances, also offer a trial where by you complete your work in the proposed 2 days and be on call/contactable the remaining days for a trial period of 2/3 months where it’s reviewed?
can you split the time ie 4 1/2 days? So your present 4 out of 5 days but less hours?
I wouldn’t loose hope, maybe be a bit more flexible with your request and keep them happy with an almost daily presence

Just spotted this organisation - Time off work for kinship carers - Kinship https://share.google/A870mIiYfEjv4TYCv
You may know about them but they could possibly be helpful.

I understand why you are trying to be lean with the details, but that is making people think you are a bit crazy. I think I see what is going on.

You are the stable person in your family and there are multiple family members having children that have been taken into care. So they aren’t siblings, but they are all related. There won’t be fallout if you don’t save the day because the greater family is a bit of a mess, but you still want to give these children a better chance.

am I close?

for what it’s worth, if I’m close, I think j you are doing the right thing, but I do think j you need to consider your limits. If you stretch yourself too thin you won’t actually be able to provide the children in your care. My real worry would be that the 4th child won’t be the last. If there is anyone else in a position to help, I would start the conversation now that they may want to consider being the foster parent for the 5th child.

as for work, flexible working requests in theory should happen just on capability to provide them, but the reality is that it is about retention. If they know you can’t get what you want elsewhere, they have little incentive to provide that work schedule. If you don’t want to change employers, ask for a schedule that you could realistically get somewhere else. They will know that you could leave at that point if they don’t comply.

Go off sick then discuss it as part of your return to work.

Dropping from 5 days to 2 as head of department would never work. You cannot be head of department and only work 2 days a week. Who do people go to for guidance the 3 days you are not working? You say you can do your job in 2 days but your company say you can't as they are looking at it from a different perspective. Sometimes I can easily cover my workload in less than 5 days but in my position the team fall apart when I am on leave. Its not just about your workload, its about your department and company needs.

The fact that there are others doing 2 days, does not mean that it's possible for your role. They do however need to be able to justify why your proposals are not possible "we don't want to" are not justifications. I see you have suggested a job share. Rejecting this on the basis of no applicants is only justified if they have in fact advertised a job share and been unsuccessful. That said, you do need to think about the implications of such a share, like handovers and covering each other's holiday etc. which are generally requirements of this arrangement.

The employment rights act stipulates the reasons that rejection can be given, these being:-

• the burden of additional costs
• an inability to reorganise work amongst existing staff
• an inability to recruit additional staff
• a detrimental impact on quality
• a detrimental impact on performance
• a detrimental effect on ability to meet customer demand
• insufficient work available for the periods the employee proposes to work
• planned structural changes to the employer's business

Being 2 days a week as a boss isn't practical. I worked 2 day week non management role and it was really difficult. By the time you catch up what's happened the other days you've lost a morning already.

I don’t think your life is compatible with taking on another child. You are a single parent already and stretched way too thin. Without knowing why you think this baby is only your responsibility, it’s hard to give specific advice on that, but you can and need to say no. It won’t help anyone is you are unemployed and raising 4 children on your own - you need to focus on the 3 you already have.

You sound like a hard worker - single parenting 3 foster children ‘and’ working a full time and demanding role is already much more than more could handle. I’m a bit surprised that they’ll actually let you take on more than this as it doesn’t seem sustainable

Back to the job though - they can’t stop you from applying for anything you want to and asking for part time hours. I just don’t think it’s feasible to expect a management level role with that level of responsibilities and pay for 40% of a week. It will create so much extra work for others - even just having an additional person on staff for know everything you do for HR and decision making etc etc etc. I think denying it is fair enough and you need to really think about the whole picture here.

IF you could do your job in 2 days a week, and they could pay you 40% of your current wage to do it, they’d be nuts not to. So I suspect you can’t.

IF you could do your job in two days why are you so stressed about working for 5 days. You can’t be working hard.

YABU.

If I was your manager and you armed me with all this info, I’d be looking at reorganising the other two days work and making an “efficiency saving” by losing your role.

I don’t understand if yiy can go your job in 2 days why are you stressed or is it just you need to be physically away from the office for time to care for relatives ? Maybe you could ask to work more flexible hours ? Or reduce to 4 days ?

I hope you didn’t tell them this!!

You are not a ‘general’ member of staff though OP. You are a head of department. I work somewhere where our head of department has gradually reduced her hours and quite honestly it’s a shambles. Anyone who needs something important has to wait until she’s in which creates a lot of challenges. As a head you have more responsibilities so I understand why they might be inclined to say no. I wouldn’t go around saying that in your opinion your job could be done over 2 days if you work 5. That could create problems for you.