Do people really think PIP claimants are fraudsters?!

[Greedybilly]

As someone with a chronic illness in the middle of claiming PIP I think it's important to point out it's very stressful to go through the process and actually get the benefit.
To those who were inferring it's an easy blag - I would say yes there will always be a few scammers who claim fraudulently ( though god knows how tbh?) the majority have to struggle for years/go through appeals/give up.
Just saying this for balance as I feel MN is turning slghtly into the Daily Fail.

I think the whole benefits system is an absolute mess and people in general need to stop expecting the government (ie - everyone else) to pay for everything. If you want something, go out and work to pay for it. The link between work and money simply doesn't exist in the minds of many people, money is just something that magically appears in their bank account every month.

I worked for 35 years. Then l got Long Covid. Now l cant leave the house or even cook a meal. I worked to pay for want l wanted and paid in for a long time.

Now l want support you say l can’t have it? I probably paid towards your education, birth and any other health related issues.

Bet you took that easily enough?

My mum's step brothers next door neighbours dog walkers sister claims BENEFITS fraudulently she gers £3676446356 a week on PIP, she goes on FOREIGN HOLIDAYS every 2 days and they have a FREE COUNCIL HOUSE, she has her NAILS and HAIR done every 23 minutes, they have a free Porche on MOTABILITY, they have 54453 FLAT SCREEN TV'S and 535 SMART PHONES....oh and 1 GOAT....I think two tier Keirs Beer, Kid Starver needs to go and only our Lord and Messiah Nigel will sort this all out.

Fucking Melts 🙄

Well I have really hurt my side from my neck, into my shoulder blade and down my side and across my chest... no idea how but woke up like this. I struggled to wash and do my hair today, nearly cried a few times with how intense it all is.
My thought was ANYBODY who lives in similar pain like this / or has a disability on a daily basis, I think should be entitled to every penny without question and SHAME on people who fake being like this!

I have a taste of it and hats off to sufferers! I hope this goes away soon as I'm not coping!

Im afraid I'm not going to shout from the roof tops about my disability just so people don't think I'm a fraud for claiming pip. I am done with showing my private self to others to appease their bitchiness.

I spend a lot of time and energy preparing for when I have to go out of the house. It is exhausting and painful. Noone sees this but me and my hcps. The public sees me acting, and of course I appear healthier than I am because I don't complain.

Ironically, it is precisely because of my resilience that judgemental pricks dont think I deserve help. The same judgemental pricks who would slag me off for being attention seeking if I actually showed how disabled i was.

So anyone that thinks pip is easy to claim and that there are soooooooo many people faking it is a illogical, thoughtless, judgemental twat.
IMHO, of course.

No, I don’t agree with you. Its estimated there is £100 million lost to fraud in the PIP system, compared to £46.8 billion lost through tax fraud:

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/measuring-tax-gaps/1-tax-gaps-summary

So, imo it’s ludicrous to say the country can’t afford to lose £100 million in PIP, when nobody has the will to crack down on tax evasion of £46.8 billion! I know which one, I think the country can’t afford!

It’s just the ultra rich getting the poor to scapegoat each other, rather than the ultra rich, who are really impoverishing them!

Anyone that thinks the imf will bail out the economy by cutting disability benefits as that's the main drain on the economy is a deluded halfwit.
They may cut them a bit, but they will tax to the hilt the average Mumsnet middle class. They will hit you first. Overnight. Then they'll hit public infrastructure projects. Then social expenditure. The first thing that happens though is that taxes are raised.

Your wants are not more important than your needs.

I know three people who receive PIP. Two are absolutely genuine and deserve every penny. The third however does not. She claims for her COPD, says she needs financial help for taxis to all her appointments but she spends the whole lot on fags (!) and guilt trips family into driving her around because she has no money, or worse still begs for hospital transport. Her review is coming up soon and conveniently she is making GP appointments three times a week to build up a nice stash of ‘evidence’. She’s openly said she hopes she ends up on oxygen.

Very telling she’s only ever worked about three days in her adult life. These people ruin it for everyone else.

Well if she chain smokes on oxygen she won’t be claiming for much longer! They don’t give it to people who still smoke for good reason

I know a few people claiming it who shouldn’t be. You’d be surprised how much effort people will go to for money. I also know quite a few (via a health group) who exaggerate symptoms to qualify. But in that situation I can understand why, as they have a serious health issue so working is tough, and they could do with help such as a cleaner, use of taxi’s etc. So things like saying they need help to shower and use the toilet, they need help with medication, and they can’t go out alone, can’t walk far. None of those are necessary true (or may be on very worse day) but if they don’t say that, they don’t qualify.

Someone I know via a group is on PIP and he has said all of above but goes ski-ing every 2wks in winter (he lives in Scottish highlands). He makes sure he pays in cash for all expenses incase bank statements requested. As won’t look good getting max PIP but able to go ski-ing (and it’s a physical health issue he has). He openly tells me these things, and no I haven’t or wouldn’t report him as he does have a serious health issue, just no where near as bad as on his PIP form. I think when people talk of fraud, people are not making up the illness, but exaggerating it to qualify for PiP.

I think some are fraudsters and some aren’t.

They ask what I do. What is in place to allow me to work full time. How working full time impacts me etc.

Taxes on the super rich are a red herring that always gets brought up in these debates as though it was either or. It may very well be the case that tax fraud and taxes on the super rich could/ should increase but even if it was easy to get this money out of them (which it isn’t) it still doesn’t mean that your average tax payer consents for the benefit bill to just rise and rise as it has been doing.

However much money we had as an economy I still would not think it right that we create a lifelong dependency on state benefits in young people especially. I would rather see money being invested in schemes to help them to get employment and be productive members of society. I do realise that PIP is an in work benefit and that it ought to be used to support disabled people to work but in the majority of cases it does not.

I work with a lot of people who claim various benefits. The vast majority of them are completely genuine and indeed I help them with their claims. When people are using PIP as it should be to help them to remain in work or for those who genuinely could never work (including those with severe mental illnesses like schizophrenia) I think it’s a great thing. What I notice is that whether people work with a disability often has little to do with how severe the disability is. You can have two people with the same illness and symptoms and one is desperate to get work or stay in work because they want to whereas the other one is desperate to be signed off and claim. It’s understandable. If you are a lawyer with MS you are going to be more motivated and able to keep your career than if you are a cleaner or a shop worker.

There definitely are people who I regularly meet who, whilst their claims are within the rules, do have an attitude of trying to get whatever they can from the state and have no intention of ever working. Often this extends to the wider family and there is a whole network of people claiming carers allowance as well as disability benefits. It’s a powerful disincentive to recovery if the family finances depend on you claiming certain benefits. If you were brought up with this it’s normal to you that your whole family claims benefits and doesn’t work and it’s not surprising that you go on to do the same. Kids in this situation I feel really sorry for.

It is very clear who has only turned up for the appointment to get a letter for the benefit office as they have no interest in doing anything to improve their health. Any mention of schemes to help people back to work is met with horror and they sometimes have even got a draft letter that they want you to basically rubber stamp. Once the letter is secured you’ll not see them until the next review. It’s not a case of actual outright fraud it’s more just gaming the system but within the rules. Like rich people doing tax evasion. It’s human nature.

I don’t blame the individuals but rather the state for making bad rules.

I worked for 35 years. Then l got Long Covid. Now l cant leave the house or even cook a meal. I worked to pay for want l wanted and paid in for a long time.

How old are you? Surely if you worked for 35 years you are in a position where you've a decent pension you could draw until your state pension arrives?

I voted YABU.
It's stressful you because you are genuine.

It's probably painful to think about all the things you can't do. It's embarrassing to have to display your vulnerability to others. And it's humiliating to think you might be disbelieved and turned down.

Scammers have none of that baggage. They can concentrate on jumping through the hoops and giving the answers that will result in money getting paid out.

Id encourage anyone to practice emotional detachment with the DWP. But, my God, it's easier to do that when you have less to be emotional about.

So you think someone with severe schizophrenia can magically get better? Please tell me you're not really that ignorant

It is easy. Otherwise millions wouldn’t be on it.

Well I certainly wouldnt have bothered if I wasn't disabled. The process is degrading and anxiety building in itself

Do you know then that all of the claimants are 100% honest?

Again, how, without it impacting the genuine claimants, can you ensure the ones that aren't?

CCTV fitted to their homes? Trackers around their necks? What?

People may fraudulently claim, but surely they need medical evidence to get the benefit. Are you saying that doctors are lying too and confirming that patients have illnesses/disabilities that they don't actually have?

That is the very definition of a fraud - not claiming honestly, making stuff up etc.

Why is it so hard for you to accept that most people on Pip are genuine claimants???

I doubt it's most but im sure a fair amount are genuine- like a lot of the stories i've heard on this thread. What I cant understand is the naivety of a lot of these people (including yourself) thinking that everyone is so honest, wake up.

Thank you

• edited to delete - replied to wrong poster