To ditch a friend for cheating on her OH?

[SeenHerSelina]

Been best friends since each of our first kids were born 16 years ago, I thought I knew everything about her. Always thought her OH was a bit quiet, maybe even unsociable but that contradicts all the stories about him from my friend about how outgoing he was before kids came along, and maybe quite naturally kids changed all that. BY all accounts though he’s a nice bloke, good Dad and very attentive and romantic to his OH.

I’ve been out occasionally with my friend over the years, she attracts the attention of men but nothing unusual in that I guess.

Through a mutual friend I heard what I thought/hoped was an unthinkable rumour that she’d been unfaithful with someone it turns out we both know. When I put it to her thinking it was scandalous, she told it was true and the details even more gruesome than rumoured. She then went on to reveal that before they had kids she’d been cheating behind his back for years.

I’m totally shocked and struggling to see her the same way I did before. I can’t help but feel deceived, but I also feel completely stupid for judging her OH.

There is one occasion that I can’t get out of my head a few years ago when I left her walking back from a night out with a guy. A few weeks later her OH made passing reference about her coming home the following morning, assuming she’d stayed at mine. I haven’t asked her about it, I almost don’t want to know.

AIBU to just ditch her as a friend?

Your "friend" is an abject liar who is babbling the cheater's script as though it matters. It doesn't.People will assume you fuck around too as you are fine with a fuck around friend.

And nothing - not one single word she says - can be trusted. It's kind of amusing that you think she'd tell YOU the truth when she lies to the face of the man she made vows to every single day. I wonder what she says about you when you're not there?

You're an absolute mug.

So she used you as a cover when she stayed the night with someone? I wonder how many other times she’s done that to conceal her cheating? If she’s been cheating for years, she's probably used you as an excuse multiple times tbh.

The reason I think this is that it happened to me years ago. A close friend pretended that she was spending time with me to hide a relationship and of course, when it all came out, everyone assumed that I knew and had been helping her. I had no idea!

So be careful, OP, it’s going to get nasty when her OH finds out. If you do decide to remain friends, I wouldn’t meet up as regularly, perhaps stick to meeting up in groups, for example. She really needs to sort out her relationship.

Well if he wasn’t a close friend then my loyalty would always be with my friend. I’d be upset for my friend and support her. Not really about ‘judging’.

Wow! MN at its bitchiest finest!

Such a black and white response - life is far more nuanced.

I wonder why you're so rude towards me about my friends behaviour?

Well, I find it weird that if OP had posted that she'd found out her DH had cheated on her, let alone having an affair for years, it would be a near-unanimous LTB. Yet at the same time it's a completely acceptable, normal thing that nearly everyone does and is unreasonable to judge. 🤔

Affairs, particularly long term ones, cannot be conducted without repeated lying, breaking of trust, being inconsiderate, selfish, thoughtless, and cruelty.

I don't think it's 'demonising' someone to suggest that none of these are positive character traits. I also think it's a bit naïve to suggest that someone who repeatedly exhibits those traits only does so in the context of their affair and is at all other times a lovely, honest, caring, selfless person.

Everyone makes mistakes, but cheating on someone once is very different to carrying on a lengthy affair.

We're all allowed our different lines in the sand, and personally I genuinely think it's impossible to be a 'kind' person while also doing something you know will devastate the lives of the person/people you are supposed to love most in the world.

That's why I would judge both my partner and any friend who I found out about - not because I have strong morality about the sex aspect, but because someone who thought that is okay would not be someone I could trust or respect, and those attributes are essential to me in the people I choose to love and spend my time with.

Also, the most I said was "cheaters are rarely nice people." You then made the rather large (and inappropriate) step to comparing it to genocide!

Yes, absolutely this!

The double standard of the immediate "LTB, block him, go no contact" if it were someone's husband but this "Hey, everyone makes mistakes, I would never judge a bestie who did this - ooh, OP, you are so judgemental" attitude needed calling out.

there are A LOT of bitter ex-wives on this forum, I wouldn't worry too much about it!

But because the reasons for being unfaithful are so different for everyone and so many people are…you can’t make a sweeping statement such as that.

Unless you genuinely believe around 60% of all people are not nice people.

Also, we aren’t really meant to be monogamous so we’re all constantly fighting nature.

Affairs, particularly long term ones, cannot be conducted without repeated lying,

@Delatron It’s the lying part that’s motivating me to advise the OP to be careful around this friend.

Yes, a lot of people cheat and I wouldn’t be judgy about a ONS, for example, but my experience of being used as cover for a “friend’s” relationship has made me wary of people having full-on affairs.

When it came out, everyone, both her family and mutual friends, assumed that I knew what was going on and had helped her cover her tracks- so it damaged me.

A real friend wouldn’t put someone in that position and tbh, it does say something about their character if they do. So I think that the OP should be careful from now on and stick to group meetups, for example. Once her friend’s marriage implodes, it’ll be a huge mess.

You think women who have been betrayed by their husbands, repeatedly lied to, their physical health put at risk and their mental health damaged, not to mention that they will also have to pick up the pieces of their children’s shattered lives don’t have a right to be “bitter”.

BluePearOntheRocks you should be ashamed to be so callous and sneering to people in pain.

And before you ask, I’ve been happily married for more than half my life.

You say ‘bitter’ I’ll say women who are aware of the trauma, the ptsd, the anxiety, the destroyed self confidence and esteem, the destruction of the family unit, the long term effect on the children… etc etc etc of cheating.

’bitter ex-wives’ is such a vile term!

I do agree that it’s wrong for the friend to use OP as an alibi and not even tell her.

my understanding is the 60% figure refers to at any point in someone's life, is nebulously, defined, i.e. some people considered emotional affairs, flirting, online interaction, etc. as cheating, not just sexual affairs.

I specifically referred to long term affairs, because that's what the OP is about. Snogging someone else in the club aged 19, or flirting with your colleague at the office party isn't the same as cheating on your husband for several years.

'we aren't really meant to' is such a pathetic cop out excuse
we aren't really meant to eat food with e numbers or live beyond 80 without medical intervention if you start wanking on about biological essentialism.

If you don't feel monogamy is important to you, don't get married and legally commit to it for the rest of your life! If you're unhappy in your marriage there are options other than having an affair.

Why? It has absolutely nothing to do with you!

I agree that it’s all dependent on the definition of “cheating”. For me it’s sex. Nothing else. I’d be highly pissed off if my bloke took his clothes off and climbed into bed with another woman. He flirts all the time and I’m fine with it, it’s a game. He didn’t promise me not to flirt or have a close friendship with another woman. He promised me not to have sex with anyone else so that’s what I hold him to.

I’m more talking about the argument that every single person who cheats is a nasty person. I believing it’s far more nuanced and complicated than that.

I think some people are confused about legal marriage. ‘Till death do us part’ is (a) not a legal commitment and (b) an optional vow. The short civil marriage ceremony we had involved declaring nothing other than that we were free to marry and that we were marrying one another. I certainly haven’t legally committed to my DH for the rest of my life.

I'm struggling to know how I'll react when I see her OH without bursting into tears.

Oh come on. That's ridiculous. It's not like her DH is your good friend. You're making it all about you and your emotions, now. Wanting to burst into tears when you see him is massively over the top.

Seeing him will feel awkward of course, but crying..?

Does that mean you haven’t committed to fidelity either?

Nope. That’s not a legal issue.

I just looked up the form of words from short ceremony of the register office we married in, and the wording of the key part was exactly this (1) Declaratory Words and (2) Contracting Words

(1) ’Are you, X, free lawfully to marry Y?’
’I am.’

(2) ‘I, X, take you, Y, to be my wedded wife/husband.’

and vice versa.

You can, obviously, add person vows if you want. All we committed to was that we were free to marry, and that we were marrying one another.

I agree with you. I’d urge everyone who disagrees with the OP to have a listen to the podcast series The Affair, in which a relationship counsellor talks to people who have cheated or are cheating, have been cheating or who have experienced parental cheating. It’s heartbreaking in places.

Nobody has committed legally.

My thoughts: It's up to you what behaviours you're willing to put up with/overlook in a friend. It's a very subjective thing and will differ between individuals. If this is something you really can't get past, then you're not unreasonable to end the friendship.

I would advise that you let her know why, though. Don't ghost her. I'm in a situation where it looks like I'm being ghosted myself, and even though the person in question isn't a close friend, it's still hurting my feelings and is leaving me to feel bewildered. I realise it might feel uncomfortable and awkward to send her a text message explaining that you want to distance yourself from her, but I do think she deserves the respect of being told straight, rather than just dropping her with no explanation.

Why did you get married?

I'm not being rude, i'm genuinely interested.

I thought infidelity & promising to just be intimate with one person was part of the reason for marrying, as in showing that level of commitment to someone.

Was it just for financial reasons?

Found a cheater.