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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Trying to salvage friendships after a terrible holiday

143 replies

ChaosIsMyCardo · 04/09/2025 12:05

Hi, this is my first post. I am hoping someone can help me unpick a disastrous trip with some friends and our kids that I'm worried may have ruined friendships and I'm not quite sure what to do.

I recently went on a two night trip away in the UK with two school friends and our kids. Each of us has a four yo and one also has a baby.

One of these friends has the same day off as me so we have spent lots of time together over the last four years and our boys have had lots of fun together. They both have quite different personalities (my son is very sensitive and can be shy, whereas hers is more assertive and outgoing) so they've occasionally had their moments, but generally they have a great time together.

The other friend has a 4yo daughter (and baby boy) and we don't see each other as often and we are quite different people, but there is a trust between us that comes from knowing each other since childhood.

So, we had all booked this trip as a nice little get together before the kids start school. I knew it wasn't going to be a relaxing break but I still thought we'd have some lovely moments and the mums would have a nice catch up. I was wrong!

As soon as we all arrived in the house, things seemed very fraught and stressful. The dynamics between the kids were in constant flux with seemingly one always left out (to be expected with three, I guess), but the primary conflict seemed to be between the boy and girl of my friends. They weren't getting along and the boy would often lash out at/hit the girl. The girl would then come and tell the boy's mum, who would admonish the boy not to hit, but I could tell she was becoming increasingly frustrated with scolding him.

She is a very "gentle " parent, very in tune with his needs and his biggest advocate (as any mum ought to be), and in her view, the girl was teasing and winding her son up, which was just as bad as hitting, and she was annoyed that only her son was being told off.
I think she was annoyed with the girls mum for not being more present to referee the older kids. This mum did however also have a 9mo to take care of.

The girls mum is very upset because, from her point of view, she witnessed the boy not being very nice towards her daughter and felt unable to say anything, and she acknowledges that they are all only four and these things are to be expected. She also feels upset because the boys mum did not really engage with her speak to her for the whole trip, and they have not really spoken since.

I know this is largely between them, but I am not sure what to do as they both want to talk to me about their thoughts on this. I want to be honest and supportive with both, without betraying the other.

I haven't been able to be completely honest with the boys mum as I think she has been quite unreasonable in the defense of her son (e.g. by criticising the other child in a way she would not accept from others about her child) rather than just acknowledging they are all four and this will happen.

I don't feel able to say this to her as she is very defended around this and I don't want to hurt her or risk our friendship.. As another boy mum, I do know that sometimes boys act up in a way it's easier to scold, whereas girls can be a bit more complex/clever and perhaps "get away with" more (maybe, I dunno) I don't think she was intentionally malicious in any of this, but I do feel bad for the other friend who was essentially told her daughter is a shit stirrer and has now been ostracised by the boy mum, who is still very annoyed with her in a way that is quite irrational in my view.

Does anyone have any advice/ similar experience / insight into any of this?
Than you for reading if you got this far

OP posts:
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 04/09/2025 15:10

Diarygirlqueen · 04/09/2025 12:30

It's a shame these 2 women can't realise kids often fall out, especially at such a young age as personalities clash etc.
I wouldn't be discussing each one behind their backs, it'll come back to bite you. Say you have differing parenting techniques and its a shame to lose a friendship over young children and move the conversation on. Hopefully the friendship can move on, but I wouldn't be meeting up with the kids involved. Keep it to the 3 of you.

This exactly!

They're four...

Some kids just won't /can't get on.

Adults only... Well until the kids have gotten a bit older and then try them together for the odd hour and see.

Although I'd have hated to be forced to go away with a child that was wanting to fight all the time when I was a kid.

TonTonMacoute · 04/09/2025 15:11

Oh goodness. Keep well out of it!

Now they have all started school everyone will have something else to worry about.

TheSquashyHatofMrGnosspelius · 04/09/2025 15:11

How come none of you saw 100% of this? Leaving them unsupervised to the point there is this much conjecture and I think you all got away lightly and what happened was all that happened. You can't just fling nippers in a room and leave them to it.

Bumblebee72 · 04/09/2025 15:23

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Didshejustsaythatoutloud · 04/09/2025 15:45

Not your argument! But the v gentle parenting mother sounds like a victim blaming dick, imo.

ginasevern · 04/09/2025 15:53

And that's why I've never been tempted to go away with other people, especially where kids are involved. Recipe for disaster and trauma.

VictoriaEra · 04/09/2025 15:55

Miraclesforme · 04/09/2025 13:02

Not your sink, not your washing up.

I love this. Will definitely borrow this phrase.

Goody2ShoesAndTheFilthyBeast · 04/09/2025 15:57

My advice is stay out of it!

ChaosIsMyCardo · 04/09/2025 16:15

Thank you so much to everyone who has commented. I appreciate you taking the time and you've given me lots of food for thought. Cheers!

OP posts:
Loz2323 · 04/09/2025 19:56

MyDogHumpsThings · 04/09/2025 12:27

Four year olds cannot be shit-stirrers, surely. It’s a long time since I’ve had to deal with one, admittedly.

Ohhhh they most certainly can!

Ponoka7 · 04/09/2025 20:04

Are you Jim Davidson? He famously said, in an interview, about hitting Rula Lenska,
"strong, intelligent women can argue so well they make men hit them".

FluffyJawsOfDoom · 04/09/2025 20:04

Espressosummer · 04/09/2025 12:58

You and the other boy mum seem to be going out of your way to excuse the boy's violent behaviour. You're making out like the 4 year old girl is some conniving, manipulative shrew who had it coming. She's 4 for fucks sake. And the victim of repeated violence. After the first hitting incident why didn't the boy's mum supervise her child more closely?

Have you considered the girl's behaviour was actually completely fine and all she did was not give into the more assertive child?

So much this! And why were they not being supervised?

ThreePointOneFourOneFiveNine · 04/09/2025 20:08

Refuse to discuss it with either of them. You need to be really firm on this. It’s not fair of either of them to try to put you in the middle. Just politely explain that you won’t discuss it, and this is the same for both of them, and then change the subject. Repeat as often as needed.

Glittertwins · 04/09/2025 20:10

Definitely stay out of it let them sort it between themselves

MrsTerryPratchett · 04/09/2025 20:12

I can’t stand the rhetoric of ‘girls are so manipulative and sneaky and clever and dangerous’ when they DON’T hit.

As far as I can tell, they aren’t allowed to hit and boys are so they have to develop other skills. Just manage boys better and they might find some social skills as well. FWIW my DD was allowed to finish it but not start it. Which she did effectively. And is neither manipulative nor sneaky.

OP my message to friends would be, “yes we know everyone pressed the big red parenting critique button. But the kids are 4 and we aren’t. Let it go.”

AnotherNaCha · 04/09/2025 20:14

Loubylie · 04/09/2025 12:19

My hunch: the boy is aggressive and assertive and used to dominating. The girl stood up to him ... and got hit.
You are wise to stay neutral though. Just keep saying neutral stuff. Trip was a bad idea. Personality clash. They're very young. Etc.
Then keep an eye on your son's friendship with the other boy. Make sure he isn't being overly dominated by him.
It was a lovely idea to organise the trip. Sorry it went to shit x

Also agree with this. A shame the girl is already being labelled as manipulative (ie complex/clever) by “boy mums”

anon4net · 04/09/2025 20:14

That's a very tricky dynamic/situation Flowers

Try to remember this really has nothing to do with you at all apart from your witnessing it. I'd have a sentence to say like "It can be so hard to be in such close quarters with children who aren't used to being together 24/7 and with of course different personalities and families. Hopefully we can put it behind us or you and X can sort it out between yourselves." Repeat as many times as necessary.

I agree that it wasn't okay the boy was hitting. Sounds like her "gentle" parenting isn't teaching him what he needs. Four year olds may hit on occasion but it sounds like he was doing it repeatedly and targeting her? Girls are often blamed for boys outbursts....this is not okay.

Also, we never ever share accommodation with friends. We will get smaller cottages on the same property, or rooms in the same guest house/hostel. We also don't share accommodation with Grandparents as things simmer and boil over quickly. It does mean we can't take advantage of cheaper deals/shared costs but I've found it is far far far better all around, everyone gets a break! I'm sorry your time away was so fraught.

Good luck. Flowers

ChaosIsMyCardo · 04/09/2025 20:16

Thank you so much x

OP posts:
DreamTheMoors · 04/09/2025 20:18

Say to both the other mums:

”This is none of my never mind.”

PacificState · 04/09/2025 20:24

5128gap · 04/09/2025 12:37

I think you have a choice. Either be true to what you really think and when boy mum speaks to you about it be honest and defend girl mum, or tell both mums you don't want to get involved and don't intend to talk about either of the others behind their backs. The worst thing you can do is sit and listen passively while they complain about each other to you. This is disloyal to both and often has a strange habit of circling round so you're at fault.

Yeah, this. 100%. The way you survive this with both friendships intact is to play a totally straight bat. Either say exactly what you think to both (as kindly as you can, but without mincing your words - tricky to do) or say ‘no, I am friends with both of you and it doesn’t sit right with me to listen to this, can we write it off as a bad holiday and talk about something else’.

Four year olds are wankers. Lovely, but wankers. They are all capable of behaving absolutely terribly in the right circumstances. If you are proper friends with the mums, don’t lose a friendship over what a collection of 4yos have done under stressful/non-standard circumstances. Or, if you do lose a friendship, at least let it be because someone else can’t get it in proportion, not you.

jetlag92 · 04/09/2025 20:31

We had a holiday like that when my children were little.
DH refused to go on another holiday with friends with kids for years.
It never works unless you're all completely on the same page when it comes to parenting.

ThisDeftBrickOtter · 04/09/2025 20:34

I had some friends who would slag off each other's children after we all got together. It drove me nuts, they are kids ffs. Thankfully they are all older, and we're all too busy for group hangouts. I just stayed neutral, but found it really tricky.

LGBirmingham · 04/09/2025 20:49

MyDogHumpsThings · 04/09/2025 12:27

Four year olds cannot be shit-stirrers, surely. It’s a long time since I’ve had to deal with one, admittedly.

They definitely can. A four year old boy kept acusing my son of hitting because he was jealous of him. I know because another mum witnessed the whole thing and told me.

MyDeftDuck · 04/09/2025 20:53

Stay well out of it……..not your problem so let them sort it out between the two of them. If necessary, tell them both that you’re not taking sides and you don’t want to discuss it.

Depressedbarbie · 04/09/2025 20:58

MyDogHumpsThings · 04/09/2025 12:27

Four year olds cannot be shit-stirrers, surely. It’s a long time since I’ve had to deal with one, admittedly.

They absolutely can!!

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