OH wants me to leave PT job to work FT....

[GreenLemonHedgehog]

My OH wants me to leave my part time job, it doesn't pay that well although it's term time. I do 3 days pw tutoring. Start at 9 and finish at 2.30. This gives me enough time to collect the kids/school run morning and afternoon. We have 4 children, they are at primary school.

My 2 days off; one day is spent on washing, housework, errands. The other day is spent volunteering for a SEND organisation. I advise parents on the phone, help with the EHCP process and other things. I plan to move into a local authority role in a year's time, which has scope for progression as kids get older, better salary and flexible/home working with liklihood of term time working. (I had an interview recently for this very job, it went really well but they needed a little more experience and asked me to keep in touch.)

OH and I agreed this was a good plan and both happy with it. Now he's exploding,
telling me to leave my job and just get a better paid job anywhere else, doing anything. He feels weighed down as the breadwinner and wants more from me financially. He's told me he expects me to bring in 2k pm to lift the burden. I'm no where near that. I have an 8y gap in employment due to children and had a rough time with my MH during that time. I've just started dipping back in and now feel completely responsible for his satisfaction with life and money.

I've explained I'm trying to help as much as I can, and my wage goes into the pot. I've explained we need to think about school runs, him wanting me to just go and find anything else will mean unlikehood of term time working, or hours not compatible with school, who will care for the children? 4 is a lot. The school run wrap around care but it is expensive, £400 pm for 4 children.

I want to contribute more but I'm struggling with his expectations, which I feel are quite demanding and unrealistic. It's caused a huge argument and he is now passively aggressively sending me jobs to apply for.

He says I'm not doing enough to contribute financially, I feel like he only sees money as worth and can't see anything else. He works very hard, long hours/early mornings, I know he is feeling burnt out. We've gone through finances and cut backs.

I feel like I'm juggling a lot already. I get the feeling he resents me, feeling I have the 'easy ride,' which I don't feel is fair at all.

When I try to explain my feelings or respond to his views, I'm dismissed and 'talking boll***s.'

AIBU???

His stress is going to be eased with more money coming in that's ops problem too not just his. 4 kids needs income

First of all - you’re not being unreasonable.

My mother had four children and worked full-time. The pressure she put herself under was extreme because she did everything at home. When looking for a partner to settle down with I was adamant I would only be with someone who could provide for a family so that I could be there for my child.

I recognise that raising families now can be more challenging than it was in the 80’s & 90’s. Back then if I was sick I would be dropped off with an Aunty. I simply don’t have the support my parents had back then. Not only that my family doesn’t live close by and my only in-law that lives close by has a job of her own.

But the thing I am concerned with is you volunteering. The volunteering absolutely needs to stop immediately. Your time is valuable and that day a week could be better spent working a paid job or getting some sort of training to transition to a full time job. Your laundry doesn’t need to be done one day a week on the weekday. It can be broken up to washing every single day and your husband needs to do more around the house and take on errands.

My sister went from working part-time to working full time when her husband changed jobs. She was still doing everything around the house. Getting up ridiculously early to get the kids lunch ready for school, get everyone dressed and out the house and taking them to school and going to work herself. I assumed my brother in law stepped up when he was home. Turns out he went to work early, came home early and went to the gym every single day. My sister has been running herself into the ground and driving for hours in traffic every day only to have to come home and make dinner. She also volunteers on top of her full-time job which I think is absolute madness.

I don’t think it’s reasonable you work full-time hours with four primary school aged kids. But it’s also not reasonable that you volunteer when you could be working.

The problem is though that once you start having kids and think it is easiest at the beginning to have that kind of divide stopping having that kind of divide is nearly impossible

It doesnt have to be. I work at a corporate with lots of women who are in very senior roles working 4 days a week etc and earning 6 figures. People assume its not possible to maintain their career and stop trying.

*He doesn’t value the parenting you’re putting in quite clearly. So agree to full time but sit down calmly and explain you’ll need:

• Childcare wraparound and cost.
• Cleaners and costs - currently this is your free labour and you won’t be able to keep up.
• More convenience food and costs as you’ll be working full time with limited free time so not the home chef now.*

Don't you know any families where both parents work? In lots of families both parents work & share the cooking and cleaning. These days appliances mean housework is a fraction of the burden it was in days gone by. Yes you need childcare but by and large, especially including pensions, you are almost always better off with both parents working vs having a sahp. You get less leisure time, yes.

You have a brilliant plan for your futures, but I voted you are being unreasonable.
This job you’ve set your sights on is not set in stone. They may not have a vancancy / lose the budget etc in the next year.
Your husband is telling you that he is burnt out, he’s struggling, and he needs help. Supporting a family of 5 and having the majority of that pressure on your shoulders alone is a lot.
I think you could look at ways to bring more money in, up your tutoring to 5 days or a couple of evenings or weekends in a supermarket or whatever. And the volunteering has to go, you don’t have the luxury of time / money to do that right now.
I don’t see it as you’re not pulling your weight, and I definitely think your husband will have a shock when he sees how much work is needed behind the scenes. But you’re a team, and right now your team mate isn’t happy and you need to work together

Yes but so is the balance isn’t it. If more money is coming in that means the OP is working more so other things need to be allocated out so free time is the same and the burdens are the same and an understanding of childcare etc. With 5 year old twins as well that isn’t going to easy.

the fact he wants the OP to earn more isn’t the issue it is the fact that he isn’t getting how that would work practically especially if she went back full time.

because once you add in the extra costs and time etc the only reason it is worth it is for career development

Was this all discussed prior to having 4 children? Who did he think would be caring for them?

Thing is though, OP wasn't sitting at home having two free days a week to lay on the couch, watch tv and eat bonbons....she clarified the reason that she had those two days at home: she was looking after the twins (who have only this week started school). On one of those days at home with the twins, she was doing a volunteering role (to gain more work experience/CPD in order to increase earning potential). The other "day off"? Looking after twins AND catching up with the housework. The 3 days a week that the twins were at nursery, she was working. I really think she has done bloody well.

Her OH wouldn't have been able to do the hours at work/have the career progression that he's got without her (massive) contribution to the family. She has made things a lot easier for him to progress over these years. Having just two DC did a number on my health, and stalled my career progression (and that was with me working FT from when DC were tiny - had I stopped work, I would have lost pension contributions, my NMC registration etc and would have been in a world of shit - even though at least I wouldn't have been forking out a fortune on childcare, juggling work and parenthood). I was only able to go for promotions etc when my youngest was at school FT (and with some serious negotiations of my shift times when XH buggered off for pastures new). I know her OH's stressing, but I really don't think he's taken this all into account.

Playing the middle man if this is out of character or out the blue I’d be worried his job is at risk / debt you don’t know about / gambling etc etc

If this is genuinely coming out of nowhere and isn’t just one example of him being dismissive, I’d be worried about him. Being the sole earner is enormously stressful and 4 children is a lot for anyone. So unless he’s generally unpleasant I’d think he’s really scared. No excuse to talk to you like that but if he’s really heading for a burnout - and not just tired like anyone else - that’s a serious mental health condition and you need to address it before it gets worse. If he’s really breaks down and has to stop work altogether you’ll be in big trouble.

What about working evenings or weekends so you can offset childcare? I know lots of people who work opposite hours. You could do your tutoring during the school day and work in retail or hospitality on the weekends or evenings? How are your finances? If you genuinely can’t afford your life then someone needs to change something - he might not be communicating this well but he might also be in a panic (assuming he hasn’t always been this awful to you)

What's clear is that he is worried about bills. He isn't starting the discussion in the correct way, but you need to try to get things back into a more sensible discussion. Here are my thoughts:

1. Drop the charity SEND day, your family can't afford this, so immediately switch this charity effort to paid work only.
2. All 4 at school means you can pick up an extra term-time day; work with him on what this means for housework - would a cleaner earn less than you and be worthwhile, or are you going to both do it with the kids on Saturday mornings, then alternate a Sunday lie-in for rest?
3. What has spooked him, is it just rising bills or is he worried his job is at risk? Some big hugs instead of rising up against his unreasonableness may be needed to get you both on the same page. Apart from finances, what can or should be done to relieve his stress?
4. Holiday care - work out where you would split holidays, any grandparent days and then the cost of clubs; check together that you have a plan and your earnings would exceed this. Consider options like you working just a few weeks of summer holidays while he is off with the kids to get more money without excessive costs.
5. Earnings; at 37.5 hours per week minimum wage would bring you £24k/ year, to get up to £30k/ year you'll need to earn a bit more. Over 39 weeks term time working 25 hours per week you would need to earn £30.79 per hour. What are you earning now, is this realistic with the extra 2 days? What other jobs can you do? If you consider what you can achieve, then look at it openly with him then hopefully both your expectations can be more realistic.

Could you supplement your existing tutoring with some private students?. Going rate for GCSE where I am is about £40ph and £50 ph for A level. Two one hour slots from 6:30pm on three evenings a week would increase your income significantly and your ‘D’H could look after the children so no extra outgoings?

Yes, poor man, all he wants is a woman who will create and birth 4 children, work full time, do all the childcare, school runs, sick days etc, and keep a clean house and cook him dinner each night. Oh and of course to have other women on stand by to pick up his kids from school so he doesnt have to. Is that really too much to ask?

Start sending him higher paid job ads too…

Up until this September the OP has been balancing the childcare. I don't hear her partner saying he is going to take career advice and look for a job without a commute so he can help with the childcare when the OP finds full-time work. He is just pressuring her to find all the solutions.
As you have pointed out he may need professional mental health support.
They need to be able to sit at a table with childcare costings & timings (e.g. School pickups) and work a solution out together ( including what is causing the partner's stress), but for whatever reason, stress, lack of respect, it doesn't sound as if the partner can do that right now so the OP is in a difficult position as the job that fits around childcare and her partner's commute does not start tomorrow.
The OP also understandably sounds too stressed & involved to see this objectively. Me, I'd be giving him local jobs to apply for and asking for his plans for childcare cover every time he came to me with a list of jobs to apply for, I'd also be prepping him that he will need to pick up childcare/household planning at short notice when my private tutoring business gets its first evening bookings. I am not tired from looking after 4 children, confused by a sudden change in long term agreed plans, or being berated by a stressed partner who is being bitter and unkind though.

You refer to him as your OH, are you married ?

If you consider what you can achieve, then look at it openly with him then hopefully both your expectations can be more realistic.

I agree they both need to look at it rationally.
But I very much feel like he looked at a number (£2k) and decided the OP had to earn that without considering at all the impact on her working full time

• who would do the how, washing etc etc
• cost of before and after school clubs plus holiday clubs. We all know this will eat a hell of a lot on the OP income and they might well not have that much more afterwards.
• he hasn’t thought about it all, just gave ultimatum/demanded/is now PA, aka he hasn’t shown what he is willing to do to make it happen. (It also shows that he has no idea of how much the OP is enabling him to work FT wo a second thought). He basically is not acting as a partner but as the ‘boss’ - I have a problem, I’m giving it to you and you solve it.

Because of that, I think HE needs to look at what’s manageable re the dcs. The before and after school clubs, organisation during the hols.
Some posters have talked about the OP working at weekends, splitting all the hols to avoid paying for holiday clubs etc…. Would be be happy about looking after his 4 dcs on his own every single weekend after ‘working FT all week’?
Would he be happy to spend all the hols on his own, with the dcs? And dealing with all the HW, washing, cooking as the OP is currently doing?
HE needs a reality check and it’s only going to happen if he is the one doing all the research re childcare. Otherwise, it’s just going to be yet another task for the OP whilst he’ll want nothing to do with it.

If it's just about having money coming in then getting an evening job in addition will help surely? You go out once dh is home. Or working one day at the weekend would still give you family time too.

Personally I'd be totalling up all the cost of you returning full time and not just the wraparound care either, weekly cleaner, weekly ironing service, supermarket delivery, then don't forget school holidays camps, those cost a bomb!!
This is really important. There will be a not insignificant cost associated with working FT, which will impact your overall income. in addition your OH needs to realise he will need to do an awful lot more.
However, Whilst I think your voluntary work is admirable, if your family is struggling for income then I think you need to consider using that time to earn extra money.

I completely agree he's not thinking practically and saying go and get a FT job with 4 primary school age children is nonsense without offering to share the physical and mental load however, I do think volunteering is a luxury you can't afford and can see how this might cause resentment. I'd be dropping that and increasing to 3 days a week for now and then start to discuss the practicalities of increasing your hours/days. For example, if you work 5 days a week will he be willing to spend every saturday morning cleaning the house together? Putting a wash on every morning? Cooking dinner after work? Requesting flexible working hours to drop or collect DC? You need to spell out everything you do and ask for solutions as it doesn't sound like he values your role.

I do know these families, but this man has been used to this unpaid labour and will most likely not step up (tale as old as time).

Unless he agrees to do everything 50:50 (which is doubtful) then they need to budget for help. I know many working mothers burning the candle at both ends because most men are categorically lazy and will leave it up to women to maintain children and a house. So she better lay out her expectations early to save herself grief later.

I personally work part time as I couldn’t keep up with house, children and full time work. Kudos to the women who do but I’d rather not be burnt out or pay thousands in childcare. A lot of men (including my own DH) underestimate the work it takes to do all the hidden labour. There’s so much data backing up how household chores are divided and women still picking up most of the slack.

Get a weekend job and he can look after the kids at weekends. Easiest way to keep childcare costs low and bring in more money.

Op so you have a clea handle on what your financial situation is?

If this is our of the blue then maybe your DH is stressed out about money and you are unaware of how bad things are.

It's a bit unfair to suddenly expect you to step up when you've had a massive career break, If only it was that easy to just earn more.

I wonder if the twins starting school is a bit of a watershed moment and he has pinning his hope in you being more financially stable.

I woul personally work out the costs associated with you working full time including holidays clubs and show him that it doesn't add up.....write it all down so he can see it. (Assuming it doesn't)

He also needs to factor in him picking up the pieces in terms of home and life admin.

I feel that it's such a problem with out society that lots parents have to both work long hours just to pay the bills.

Are you married?

Arm yourself with numbers OP and then calmly sit down and present them in a excel sheet so he does get it.
If it helps I was paying £250 a week for 1 child to attend a summer camp. Even with my DH and I taking alternate holiday weeks and 1 week of my DM helping it was still £750 for 1 child 3 weeks holiday childcare x4 and that's 3k for 3 weeks.

I would say £400 per month childcare for 4 children for morning and afternoon club is optimistic at best.

You say you do tutoring though could you also set up freelance via one of the platforms and get some extra in that way? It would most likely be evenings or a Saturday but I'm sure as childcare is so easy he can have the 4 kids whilst you work!

You can’t work full time and look after 4 young children and a house without getting very tired. I’d be questioning the full day of voluntary work though. If you drop that until the children are older and work until 230 for 4 or 5 days a week that would be fairer to DH.