Can anyone help me understand this social situation not sure what to do!

[Alysskea]

Honestly I feel like I’m in high school all over again trying to navigate the world of other toddler mums. Just wondering if anyone can help me work out what the heck is going on and if I’m the problem.

I take my 2yo to a sports session every week on my day off. She absolutely loves it. Afterwards the mums all go to a cafe and we’ve been tagging along because a) they invited us the first week and then said oh we come here every week b) she really enjoys going with the other kids and c) saves me having to try and feed her when we get home.

My issue is, these mums seem to go out of their way to exclude not only me but my child as well. Of course they all know each other better than they know me and I’m not asking for them to go out of their way to be overly friendly or anything, but we usually sit there for an hour and a half and they’ll talk to each other and ignore me completely. Don’t think they’ve ever asked me a question about my life. Fine, whatever. They also exclude my child! Last week one of them took out colouring pages and pens and handed them to each child except mine, and that’s just one example!

I am not sure what to make of it tbh. I have a few working theories

• they never actually wanted me there and asked me along to be polite. But this seems weird as I don’t know why they’d do this or how our presence takes away from their enjoyment of the experience
• they look down on me as I’m slightly less middle class than them. Honestly I’m highly educated and have the same job as one of them but I’m not quite on their level finance wise. You can tell that by looking at me. This makes me sound class obsessed but honestly I’m grasping at straws here.
• they for some reason don’t like me or my child’s personality. But again, I don’t understand why especially as they’ve never spoken to us!
• they’re just really cliquey and treat everyone this way. But I can’t understand how a grown ass woman would do that. It’s just nice to include people who YOU have invited out with you.

Honestly I find it quite upsetting taking my child along and seeing her excluded. She’s so good natured and describes them all as her ‘friends’ when they basically don’t interact with her because their parents have given them all toys and activities to do and not her. But she’d also be really sad if I said we couldn’t go eat with her friends anymore. It would make her even sadder if we didn’t go to her class anymore.

i am sure I’ll get crap for this post and get called paranoid and entitled, but I honestly just feel kind of puzzled and saddened by the whole thing. I am neurodivergent (I have ‘severe’ ADHD that is not medicated currently). But I generally get on well with people and have a broad group of friends including neurotypical middle class mums who seem to think we’re not beneath them lol. This just comes across to me as plain rudeness and seems kind of deranged 🤷🏼‍♀️.

Omg! The bloody cheek. You’re totally right about auditioning. It’s bonkers.

Had this over the years in various different settings, still happening with my children’s current sports club mums - now, I don’t try and puzzle it out, I just don’t put myself or my children in the situation, or limit it as much as possible. Some people are hostile to anyone new and I have no idea why but I dont expend any energy on them. Dont go next time, there are better people out there for you and your daughter.

Is there one mother (maybe the original inviter) you fell more comfortable with and can quietly chat to at first, sort of gradually easing your way in and listening for clearer cues? As a foreign mum here I found I often struggled in exactly this kind of scenario yet looking back I realise part of the problem was I was shy and unconfident and too quick to assume people hated me ... For the sake of my children I wish I'd been less self-conscious, though I still send you all my sympathy. Put it this way, if they're really not friendly it's still worth trying for your child's sake.

This^

What 2 yo will sit still and colour?

The women doing this are very rude and unkind, and so are the posters on here who are taking delight on saying "they don't want you there, stop tagging along" as if it's somehow you who is in the wrong

It isn't

When my DD was tiny I used to go to this stay and play thing in the village hall of the very cliquey middle class village we lived in at the time, and had a very similar experience. Even tho the event was supposedly open to all, I wasn't made to feel like that. In fact the only adult who spoke to me there was a nanny who used to bring her charge because her parents work hours precluded it usually - she was a lovely woman and we became friends, but we both felt very "left out" by the others - almost a school playground feeling really. I am convinced the other moms excluded me because I was poorer than them, and lived in a smaller house. Though ironically, through my friendship with the nanny I also became good friends with her employers, who lived in the biggest house of all (but were intelligent, interesting people rather than judgemental snobs) - though I seriously don't judge people by their wealth and material possessions at all, I will admit I took a bit if a vindictive pleasure in the fact that I ended up with a friendship a lot of thes people, with their bizarre obsession with status, and wealth probably really coveted......

Anyway, long story short, I feel your pain, but it's their loss - don't let them get to you. I would stop putting yourself through it though, honestly. For your own sake and you daughter's - she'll start to pick up on the exclusion before too long. Take her to a nearby cafe for dinner, or McDonalds, or any kind of treat you are comfortable with. She'll love some special time out with you, getting your undivided attention - and you'll enjoy the experience a lot more too. Looking back, I wish I had done more one on one stuff with my daughter, rather than feeling a pressure to take her to group events. I have such treasured memories of the times we did outings on our own, even just to the local Sainsbury's cafe. They grow up so quickly!

They were being polite but they are now an established friendship it's not that they don't like you or your child but the dynamics change when others join. Be friendly while at the group but don't join them afterwards

Get exciting food in and prep your DC in the morning that you have a fun lunch prepared. When you leave the group make sure you go promptly so your DC can see you have things to do. The time after could also fit in with collecting a new library book.
You make your own fun in life and these people are draining your happiness. Stop letting them do this!
Your DC needs to see that the pair of you can have fun so she doesn't spend her life as a people-pleasing option for others.

Sometimes when you get a group of long term friends who know one another well they simply dont want to let anyone else in. Its not a question of race, class or lack of cultural capital. Its not that you've done anything to offend them. Its just that they dont have the head space to make the effort to get to know others outside their little circle. Its too much effort. Im sure you are not the only one on the periphery. Is there another mum at the school who appears to be a bit outside the social circle? So why not begin chatting to them and start your own little coffee group.

I was on the periphery of a very cliquey group of private school mums at my sons rugby
all the kids sat an entrance exam, one of the mums invited me to coffee whilst they sat it, then failed to tell me the venue had changed 😂😂
so there I sat alone, in the wrong place
son passed, but hated the school
he went to a wonderful state school, gave up rugby that he hated too

and we lived happily ever after never seeing any of the snotty bitches again 😂

kindness costs nothing

When I was a new mum, years ago 🦖 , I wanted to fit in , be part of social groups etc as I thought it would be good for my children. Looking back, I felt highly uncomfortable at some toddler groups & most definitely on the periphery of established cliques and that would create bad anxiety for me, questioning why I didn’t always feel included .
I now have an Adhd diagnosis and it all now falls into place. At times my overthinking, anxiety and sensitivity is paralysing, causing me to ruminate and dwell on everything. I am a friendly, caring and a people pleaser, as I guess you are too, as it goes with the adhd territory, so when we don’t get the same warmth and openness reciprocated, it hurts. Rejection Sensitive Disorder affects me greatly and means it’s hard to brush perceived rejection off, as it affects me deeply .
Please don’t bother with the cafe, they won’t give a monkeys if you’re there or not and have a nice little lunch cosy together instead of putting yourself through that miserable scene - she will be fine xxx 😽

I'm sorry you are experiencing this bitchy behaviour!

I'm old & crabby. But I'm also of the belief that I get to choose who I spend my time with.

If these arseholes are treating you like this, you are not obligated to tag along.

Decline the next outing, you owe no explanations. I wish you well in finding your people.

I’d keep going for a bit longer if your DC enjoys it.

It could well be that they feel a bit awkward and think you’re a bit standoffish if you’re just sitting there not saying anything. It’s hard and I’ve been there but they may not be thinking about you what you are thinking.

We do subconsciously tend to put more importance in how we came across to other Mums who’s DC are peers to our DC because we want ourselves and ultimately our DC to be accepted in social situations where we see other Mums regularly, this can lead to overthinking what we say and do in front of them, in contrast to friends outside of that sphere who we are relaxed with.

Just tag along and be yourself, don’t worry about saying the wrong thing, just say something!

I’d make it my mission to annoy them by butting into conversation (not in a rude way just add something) and wait for someone to have to have the awkwardness of actually telling you to shut up and go away but they’ll still have to face you at the next session!

You may find they start to warm to you and have been waiting for you to join in, but if not, you haven’t lost anything. They’ve shown themselves up as rude.

It honestly doesn’t bother me in the slightest, or most other people, if I’m in a group chatting in a coffee shop and other people I’ve seen before at an activity dragged up a chair and joined in, so I don’t understand why they wouldn’t want you there in a public space. It’s not like you’re following them home and begging them to invite you in.

It's insane isn't it

For some bizarre unknown reason you haven't passed the audition. Like a PP's example.

It's pretty poor behavior, especially towards a child

Ffs

What on earth do you mean that you’re not quite on their level finance level “you can tell that by looking at me”?!

They’re dicks but why on earth did you keep going once you noticed they were excluding you 😭

Take it from experience that they are probably performing a public service for you by signalling how toxic they are. As poet May Angelou said 'When people tell you who they are, believe them'.

Be polite but Stay Away. The less they know about you, the less damage they can do & they will if you get in their web.

Sometimes the things we want & can't have is doing us a favour.

Keep going to the class, but don’t go to the cafe after.

I take DS - same age as your DD - to 3 classes throughout the week, and I’ve never really gelled with any of the other mums there. At first I was disappointed and a bit down about this - then I realised this was a very small part of our lives. I’ve maintained all my pre DS friendships and hopefully I’ll make friends with other parents when he starts school. In the meantime, for mum solidarity, questions & rants there’s always MN!

I agree with PP that said she’ll quickly forget these friends - children this age tend to play alongside, rather than with each other. That comes a bit later.

If you don’t want to go back home to make lunch why don’t you make it a special mummy & DD time after class? You could go for a picnic if the weather is nice, a hot chocolate treat & the park, soft play etc. She’ll love it and you won’t have to feel uncomfortable around other snotty mums!

They are rude. Fuck them.

Out of a class of 30+ children who will be much more fluid in their own relationships, there will be a parent mix of cliques, sport clubs, out of school club mums. None of those outside clubs guarantee friendship, I am with PP who say you've tried but these are not friends you want anyway (they sound at best close, at worst absolute dicks).

I'm sure you will find a friend or two through other events.

Not nice but probably just women blinkered and not realising how they are..

Suggestions:

Go and take along some colouring pages for all of the children saying that you thought it was your turn to provide an activity today.

Make conversation with just one of the group, maybe the person who lives closest to you. Making friendship inroads one person at a time is sometimes fruitful. You could invite her over for coffee or to the playground another time on her own.

If things don't improve when invited, ask if they really don't mind you there? That might shock them into seeing their behaviour.

Decline the invitation.

Be sure to tell them the truth OP if they ask you why you are not joining them any more!!

Why are some women like this? They seem enjoy circling their wagons.

I think the adhd is relevant if you normally experience rejection sensitivity disorder you are programmed to feel very hurt when you experience something you perceive as rejection . This will be hard for you to change but objectively I think most people are not out to harm or be mean to others but want easy comfortable social interactions . each of them probably also feels their own social anxieties that they have to grapple with . Chances are they aren’t one homogenous group against you , they are individuals coming together for ease and convenience same as you . Doubt they are life long chums . Just mums looking for an easy chat and time to kill.

You’ve probably been a bit stand off ish yourself . They invited you to go , your in , so just speak up , be yourself and assume you are in the group and not an outsider and things will change once you relax . If you always perceive yourself on the outside you always will be .

the colouring thing sounds a simple mistake. No one would deliberately exclude a child and they were probably apologetic or embarrassed themselves.

id give it another go if you want to be there .

I find it impossible to believe this isn’t deliberate behaviour. They’ve made it impossible to miss their not wanting her there, and I wouldn’t spend another minute in their company.