To think that family holidays are bloody hard work for mothers?!

[Bliss1985]

I’m three days in and I’m shattered.
The mental load of organising everyone, remembering to pack all the stuff for whatever we are doing that day, sun creaming, snacks, referring the kids arguments. It’s bloody hard work is it not?

DH just doesn’t see all the donkey work I’m putting in and thinks he is carrying equal load, and can’t understand why I’m cranky.

I suppose they can be if your partner doesn’t pull their weight. Mine always has so our holidays have been nice, although when children are young, holidays can come with more work than being at home in some ways.

I think he probably can see it OP, but is probably just ignoring it. Why wouldn’t he see it? He just has you to do it and what’s a bit of crankiness from you if he gets to do less? He’s still getting away with not pulling his weight.

I’d be frustrated at a partner not just doing what needs doing and he wouldn’t last 5 minutes with me tbh.

Where do all these equally responsible and hardworking family men come from that posters claim they have? I've never met one in real life

The trick is you have to pick them, and make sure they function correctly BEFORE you decide to have kids with them. Simple.

My DH probably took on more of the hands on care, and planning load, with our kids than I did tbh. We worked opposite days, opposite shifts to care for them at home before they went to school and during the primary school years. I often pulled double shifts, longer weeks etc than he did (having said that he still worked full time hours himself), which meant he had more time than I did with the kids. He did everything necessary for and with them.

You are letting him. My husband does almost everything for the kids when we're on holiday - all the packing for the kids (at the beginning and end, and then the daily stuff like sunscreen etc.) is done by him, and he cooks all their (and our) meals. I do the washing up and keep the place looking tidy. I would say to your husband that the workload isn't even and divide it up if necessary. Allow him to fail and learn. I hope you enjoy the rest of your holiday. X

Where do all these equally responsible and hardworking family men come from that posters claim they have? I've never met one in real life

The trick is you have to pick them, and make sure they function correctly BEFORE you decide to have kids with them. Simple.

This ^

My Dad was like this
My dh is
His Dad is
My brother is
My BiLs are
My ds is
My dds' partners are
Before we get on to nephews and nieces partners and friends of our and friends of the next generation.

None of us would choose to have dc with men who chose not to pull their weight in a relationship.

Really? I think it’s quite a low bar to find a man who doesn’t think I’m beneath him and therefore must pick up the drudge work he doesn’t want to do. DH would never treat me like that, firstly because he respects me, and secondly because he adores our DDs and would do anything for/with them.

Is it just on holiday though? I’d saying being a mother is hard work generally. I’d have kids if I could be a dad! They seem to get the easier ride.

Why do you need to make the lists tho? Is he incapable bc he’s a bit thick or just can’t be bothered? Weaponised incompetence? Or it bc you’re a bit of a control freak and prefer to organise what goes down and he’s passive and just gets on with it?

I can never understand why women let men who are presumably bright enough to be employed get away with fuck all of the organisation and mental load. It’s enabling them to be shit and you can’t then complain if you’re having to do it all the time. Not meeting your standards is one thing but you should expect them to take some of the responsibility for their own children and family holiday.

Only if you made a bad choice husband and father wise. (No judgement btw, I did, and holidays were hard, many an argument, now, obviously, divorced). There are good guys out there.

The reason men get away with it is because they grind women down. Chasing them to change their shitty behaviour becomes just another chore, on top of everything else.

That's why I don't understand why people go abroad with young children we just went to holiday parks in this country. Half board so only had to worry about lunches lots of things to do and evening entertainment.

There aren't that many of them. Statistics back this up.

That’s because your own family will have similar values to you, you’ve learned from them - and you will have found similar friends. Birds of a feather flock together. There will be other entire groups of friends where all the husbands are the good ones.

Dh and I share the load so I don’t feel like this. It always amazes me how relationships are portrayed on mn. It would never occur to dh to leave me to plan everything.

Ugh absolutely and part of the reason we haven't had a family holiday since we only had one dc. It is a task that I'm not up for tbh. Packing and organising everyone , getting 2/3 outfits ready every day while on holiday and then coming home and having to unpack and do laundry. Dh is good at entertaining them but everything else falls to me. It's the same with most families I know apart from two that I can think of who are hands on.

I think your DH is the problem. Start delegating and don’t just do everything yourself

Why are you letting your husband get away with not doing the work? Don’t be a martyr. Tell him to look after HIS kids.

I’ve banned self-catering holidays for this reason.

I don’t want to go on holiday to have to cook, clean, make beds etc.

it a lot easier if you go AI!

I'm always amazed by how out of step Mumsnet is on this point with:

Large scale population time-use surveys (although to be fair I don't think they ask about division of labour on holiday - but one does assume that if one parent does more donkey work at home, it's quite likely to be similar on holiday)
What I see around me

My DH IS "one of the good ones" in our circle of friends and acquaintances.

Does he do half?

No!

Aww poor OP, she was looking for a bit of solidarity and everyone just uses it as an opportunity to say how much better their husbands and life choices are 😑
Holiday are amazing but can be a bit of hard work too - siblings spending 24/7 together!!
Try and enjoy it ans don’t sweat the small stuff!

I hear you OP. My marriage was like this too but I’m now divorced from him…

This might be a slightly controversial opinion but I think age comes into this (I’m 44 as is my ex-husband) - it looks to me as though younger men are slightly better at dividing the load. Mine was almost Victorian in his attitude - I got more help once divorced.

I would also say though that your attitude is key to how you feel. I’ve been a single parent for 8 years now and in all honesty I don’t want a partner even though in SOME respects it might ease the load. This summer I took my 2 kids abroad myself and I honestly did have a good time. They’re 13 and 9 now so not tiny - but there is still a fair amount to do. At one point I asked a lady next to us round the pool if I could shift a sunbed a bit to get some shade and she was like ‘yes but I can’t move it and my husband is in the pool!’ I found myself thinking ‘I don’t need a husband for anything!’ And I don’t. I only mention this because - she was having a nice holiday (relaxing while her DH played with their kid in the pool) AND I was having a nice holiday (doing everything myself but accepting it). It’s about how you see it mentally.

All that said though I wouldn’t go on a plane alone with two kids under 6/7 - and I didn’t. I did do solo trips but UK beach stuff. So if yours are little still and your DH isn’t helping I get that it doenst feel restful. But like - let it teach you something about how you want to be in the future. It doenst have to be that way. x

But these men get away with it because of the attitude of “all men are like that”, & “it’s just how it is for mothers”. It basically says that you shouldn’t expect anything better, and it should be challenged.

Indeed.

DH isn't like OP's husband and nor any of DH's friends or my friends' husbands to the best of my knowledge. My brother isn't like that, my father isn't and nor is my just turned 80 year old FIL.

Our current holiday is just as much a break for me as it is for DH because we split the general catering/cleaning/childcare/planning responsibilities equally same as at home.

I don't agree. It's not most women's "values" to do all the domestic work and mental load. They do it because if they don't then nobody else does and the household needs to be run and the children taken care of.

They would sooner their partners had better "values" of equal labour.

To say that families with this toxic dynamic attract the same, well I just can't get my head around that. It's almost like blaming women for suffering with this inequality.

Of course your DH sees it. He just doesn’t care that he watches you struggle with it.

Honestly, when will women stop infantilising men.