Feeling pushed out of DGC life

[NannyJignea]

Hi all, I have 2 children, my son is 25, he has 3 children a 5 year old and twin 3 year olds. Obviously he was young when he became a dad but he and his partner were always amazing parents.

In January he and his partner broke up, he’s a joiner but works for the council so not making loads and decided on a one bedroom flat. He has children every other Saturday night from 4pm and until 5pm on Sunday.
Now we only see the children for a few hours on a Sunday afternoon every other week. My son likes them to stay at his on the Saturday night.
We have asked their mum if we could have them the Friday before but she said no as they have tennis on a Saturday morning, we have offered to take them to tennis, still no. We have asked if we could even have them for dinner one night a week or fortnight - still no.

Mum works in a school nursery so she has said we can have the children on in service days, but otherwise we arrange it through our son.

I have asked our son to have the children all weekend every other week and they can stay with us on the Friday but he has said no he’s happy as is.

In addition to this, they have agreed the children will always spend Christmas with mum, so we won’t see them until Boxing Day. They also spent birthday with mum but she did invite us to their party on the weekend before and out for dinner on their actual birthday.

Tomorrow is our eldest granddaughters first day of school, we had the children today as it was in service day. When mum picked them up I asked if we could go over and see them off in the morning, she said no she just wanted it to be her the children and my son as otherwise they would be overwhelmed.

We bought our eldest granddaughter her blazer (which is stupidly expensive), lelli kellys and her school bag and coat, and nursery shoes, bag and coats for the twins. We always spoil them when we have them here etc.

Am I being unreasonable to feel it’s not fair how little we are seeing them, and that mum is being quite controlling?

Yes i was thinking this might be the case, mom does sound controlling and the kids wont thank her for it when they were older and they find out that dad and grandparents would have loved to see them much more but wernt allowed.
From someone who has never had anyone to have my almost 10 year old overnight ever...id welcome the break :)

As so many others have said, the issue isn’t your ex daughter in law being unreasonable, it’s your son not stepping up as a 50/50 parent.

He could get a suitable flat NOT in the massively popular, expensive, village but somewhere else, and sort his work out so he can drive his kids to school regularly on his days. Or employ a childminder or child carer to take the children to their school. 8:30 to 4:30 is absolutely standard working hours.

I appreciate that this hurts and you miss your grandchildren but I think you need to remind yourself that they are just that. They’re your grandchildren not your children. Yes you love them, yes you miss them but that doesn’t entitle you to spend weekends, birthdays, Christmas with them. Whilst it’s lovely that you want to be included it’s unfair to expect it. Even without the parents separating this becomes exhausting for both parents to have to accommodate someone else in every event. The situation is difficult enough to manage right now without you adding extra pressure. As for first day of school, no this is not the place for grandparents. Ask her for a photo instead

op didn’t buy anything for her DIL, she bought things for her grandchild

So your son has a shit job, won't better his earning prospects, chose an unsuitable sized apartment, won't fight for the kids he created, won't use public transport because it's too much of an inconvenience (despite loads of us single parents who don't drive having to use public transport), and basically has absolved himself of all responsibility and made out to you that this is all her fault.

It's your precious bloody son thats the problem.

Mum is making an effort, she invites you to birthday parties and out for dinner, you have the in service days and your son is sharing some of his time with you. Im sure this adjustment is hard on everyone. The children will be unsettled, you feel pushed out, your son is starting again in a new home without much access to his children, and however much she loves her children im sure solo parenting 3 children 90% of the time isnt mums idea of fun.

You say your son and his ex have always been amazing parents. Whether you agree or not with the details of their decisions (who gets Christmas day, who gets to be there on the first day of school etc) they are (most likely unless you've left lots out!) trying to do their best for the kids and maintain an amicable relationship and it sounds like they are doing a good job.

I think their mum is being pretty accommodating letting them stay over somewhere they dont even have beds once every couple of weeks and at their age that's a lot of time. My three year old would not be able to cope with that arrangement. A night away affects him for days. Add your house into the mix too and things will feel really unstable and unsettling to the kids.

You aren't unreasonable to feel pushed out and upset at how things have turned out. But you would be really unreasonable not to recognise that your feelings are the least important here. What works for these very young kids comes first, then whatever the parents need to get on with each other and stay sane. There is a temptation when you feel really hard done by to raise it and try to "fix" it, but it might not be in the kids best interest at the moment and you may well do yourself out of the good relationship you have with your sons ex at the moment and lose the time with the kids you do have.

Could you learn to drive? Our tennis lessons weren't all year round. It sounds like your DS has created a number of easily solvable problems ensuring he has his DC far too few hours for a hands-on NRP.

Erm, even the OP admits the dad could have his kids more than he does, but he “doesn’t see the point”.

Do you also have a deadbeat son who can’t be arsed seeing his kids for more than 25 hours in two weeks? So blaming the mum and calling her controlling feels better than facing reality?

OP I echo others that thinking what’s ’fair’ for you as grandparents is quite low on what’s important here. The children’s needs top everything and then their parents learning to coparent well comes next.

Your son really does need to step up here - you’re making a lot of excuses as to why he can’t help more but he should be working on solutions to those. Does he have his name down on any childminder waiting lists? What’s his current plan to find a bigger place (3 kids can’t share a bed for long at all!) It really is the only way you’re going to see more of them, and I have to say I think Mum is being quite accommodating especially in offering to let you see them every inset day. Other than that she’s trying to keep a good routine in place for her very young children.

Don’t try and see them for their first day at school, the less fuss made that morning the better.

And if he is being paid peanuts for his council job as you made out it's hardly likely he is paying an actual decent amount of child maintenance.

Also OP it sounds like you have a 3 bedroom council house and then mention it’s really hard for your son and ex to find appropriately sized council houses as there is a shortage… hmmmm…. Perhaps your two unused bedrooms are contributing to this…

25 minutes is nothing. How pathetic of him.

Good point. They could do a swap. Sounds like that would work much better for the DGC.

Sorry but I don’t see the problem here. You are seeing your GC every other week, that’s really decent time seeing as you are not their parent. I only saw my GPs a couple of times a year growing up. When did GPs get so bloody entitled?!

also my partner works for the council and has flexible working, as does practically every other person there so I call BS.

I am sorry I have to agree with the majority of people here.

your son is not seeing nearly enough of his children. They are very young and he isn’t an active and involved parent. I see my nieces and nephews more than he sees his own children!

you are painting him as the hero and her as the villain when the truth will be somewhere in between.

its amazing how men can make so many excuses for mot being able to parent their children. He could work part time to spend more time with them (many parents do), he could petition the courts for more access.

the children don’t NEED to see more of you, but they NEED to see more of their dad.

Your son barely sees his own children. One evening a fortnight is absolutely nothing, so he should not be giving that up for them to see you.
He needs to see them more.
You've said you need to get a bus to help with school runs, you'd be too early... Can you not collect them from school one afternoon and give them dinner, then dad collect and drop them home? You've made many excuses for him not seeing his children more, but he finishes at 4.30, he could see them if he wanted to. He'd be at court if he truly wanted to see them.

@NannyJignea sorry if this has been asked already but, hand on heart, how is your relationship with your son? From everything you have said, it sounds like he is trying to limit your time with his kids as much as the mum is, or at least he is not taking you up on your offers to spend more time with them - he doesn't want you to take them on Fridays, he doesn't want to sleep over at yours with them, he is happy for them to spend Christmas at their mum's.

And with all of these suggestions you have for the kids to come to yours more often, on a Friday evening or for dinner once a week and back to mum's (which I am sure would soon turn into a suggestion for a sleepover), how do you expect the kids to get to yours if you don't drive? Has your son offered to drop them off and pick them up or is this something else that you expect their mum to do in addition to looking after them, feeding them, doing all the laundry, doing all the school runs, helping them with their numbers and letters and putting them to bed?

I really don't mean to give you a hard time, but it does sound like you are asking for quite a lot but are being pretty inflexible. Sounds like the mum is doing an amazing job with very little practical support.

To be honest, seeing your grandchildren every other weekend is as much or more than many grandparents. If you saw a lot more of them before your son and his partner split up, I wonder if that also reflects on your son's reluctance to be a particularly involved father, if he relied on you to take on some/much of his parenting role, that now falls wholly on their mum.

the mum isn’t being controlling, you are. They are navigating a difficult split. Custody needs to be between two parents not factoring a third layer of grandparents to the mix.

💯

Maybe puts all the kids in the brpedroom and sleeps on sofa. They are all very young

Why does your son get to make working time decisions without factoring his children in while their mother obviously can't?

He sounds extremely useless, probably why they split up, I bet he'd a huge list of 'reasons' he couldn't load the dishwasher or put kids to bed too

OP, having read your messages, you're full of excuses for your son's measly 24 hours every two weeks with his kids, but it's up to him to work his life around his children. He could live in a cheaper area to get a bigger home, he could get a joiner job at a company instead of the council, he could pick up extra work like bartending three evenings a week to afford a bigger place - there are all sorts of things he could be doing. He's young and this is the time of life to hustle and work hard, instead of just working for the council and accepting a mere 48 hours a month with his kids. Sorry, you might not want to see it, what with being his mum, and you clearly think that nothing is his fault going by your responses on this thread, but it's a him problem.

Is it a possibility that you or your husband could learn to drive? It would be helpful if this was part of the equation; you could be more of more assistance to mum and as a result, see the GC more.

Ultimately, it's down to your son to facilitate all of this this and step up a bit more as a dad but you could certainly help your case by being more more useful as a grandparent rather than listing your access requirements and examples of your generosity.

I have a young-grand daughter myself and I never thought I'd say it, but having had a tricky, demanding MIL when my son was small was very useful, I learned early on what type of mother-in-law I wanted to be.. the opposite of her and one that is on stand-by to assist, not make demands.

It's obviously really distressing when your child separates from their partner which has the knock on effect that you see less of the grandchildren. I have a grandchild now and I would really struggle with this. You sound like you're a good grandmother and are very helpful with the school uniforms and so on. I would let the dust settle a little. I would keep in touch with my daughter-in-law and offer help. It will be tough for her looking after the three of them on her own. What I don't understand is how you managed and how your son managed before they split up. How did he get to work then? How often did you see the children then?

Your son needs to see them more then you'd see them more unfortunately. I understand he doesn't have much income but can he really not stretch to a two bed? I ask because my dad didn't bother getting us a bedroom til we were teens when he and my mum divorced when i was 8, in his home and because he snored I used to sleep on cushions by the front door, and even so sharing with siblings and father in one room doesn't really feel like we had a place there. Does he long term plan to increase this or is he happy just seeing them this much?

Regarding the send off to school, that's the parents province ao enjoy pics and share the love as you have by helping with uniform, but buying it doesn't mean you then have an automatic right to see them off to school, as much as you love them and want to.

If your son had them more then you'd see them more essentially.