To wonder what’s going on with all the big lips

[Laurendelaney1987]

Everywhere I go I see women with massive lips. It looks like so many women are wearing lip fillers.

i totally get that if you’re someone with really thin lips then you may want to plump them up, but I see this look on lots of women from their 20s to 60s.

No, filler doesn't dissolve, but it can migrate to other parts of the face.

Yes, some men/boys are making themselves look ridiculous too.

It’s got to be the influence of social media, hasn’t it? And awful TV like Love Island?

Cynics might say that at least it acts as a filter when looking for a partner - you’d be well-advised to give people who follow the extreme trends a wide berth.

Another week, another MN post slagging off women’s appearances.

I’m sorry to be crude but to me the message is simple and explicit: I’m here to give you all the BJs you want, hun.

Some young girls might be horrified that they’re unintentionally giving that message but I’m sure for some women it’s absolutely intentional.

Read the thread. Your invalid point is answered several times.

I can only dream of a world where women as a whole give two fingers and say "this is my face. Deal with it or don't"

And do you know what ?? Men would still lose their minds over our bodies; men love the female form regardless.

I’ve read the thread. Just seems to be a lot of comments about how many blow jobs women are giving out and questions about whether men like it dressed up as feminism and faux concern.

If you see nothing concerning about often very young (and often poor and uneducated) women feeling social pressure to radically distort their natural appearance to conform to the dubious sexual fantasies of men (and horrible men, too), we’ll have to agree to disagree.

What seems to be entirely missing and correct me if I’m wrong, as I don’t watch any of these progs or blogs with women with ‘fashionable’ look, is the advice or examples of women improving themselves through education or enlightenment from reading or studying or ability to engage and grow and deal with people and their problems.
as a teen I got mags with sketches of fashionable people which I desperately wanted to look like but there was nothing on improving job prospects, interviews, expanding my understanding of the world -it was quite separate and still seems to be

Totally, 100% this.

I really despair of what’s happening to women’s aspirations- things seem to be going backwards. Someone upthread mentioned the ‘glow up’ (mess up?) that businesswoman Karen Brady has had and I checked it out and couldn’t recognise her. She was already an attractive woman!

When high achieving, mature women feel they have to look like 20 year old glamourpusses as well as being serious contenders in their field, that’s sad. Her business, of course.

I know this will get me flamed, but I do see a lack of aspiration for other than sexual desirability in some women, encouraged by social media pressures.

While I agree with you to a certain extent I think there are also other issues at play here.
It's primarily about creating or exploiting vulnerabilities, the more vulnerable you are emotionally then the easier you are to manipulate into spending money, then it's money you don't have so you are even more vulnerable.
Aldo It's about female bonding, being accepted and looking acceptable to other women and being allowed into a group
In the past women bonded in hair salons, also appropriate ( to the patriarchy)activities like pot lucks, sewing/ knitting circles etc
Now it's getting these procedures done and looking the same, there is no room for individuality or god forbid the worst crime of all ...ageing
Women berating and sneering at other women about their eyebrows was a thing if you didn't get those big microbladed ones

The Patriarchy uses women against other women and this is just one example because of course the most important thing as a woman is what you look like 🙄
Don't let yourself down or let yourself go type comments
More on the bonding stuff
For a long-time it was SW or WW-designed to stop you losing weight and keeping it off, about 1:600 women actually kept the weight off successfully
Who has sat in a social situation or at work and this was the main topic ?
Yep I literally sat there silently as the only one not doing it
Now it's moving onto WLI and code sharing
And once women are reliant on it ... the price shoots up !

Great points. The only thing I slightly take issue with is (often seen on MN) this idea that any criticism or social commentary about topics like this are ‘women bashing other women’. I’m not accusing you of this, NamechangeNightNurse, but some pps have taken that line.

That’s not how I see it, and that idea seems so often to be a way of trivialising, minimising and shutting down any genuine discussion about societal pressures affecting women.

At the other end of the spectrum you might interpret the recent fashion for prairie dresses, say, as a wish for a return to more traditional gender roles, or a reaction against the permissive fashion choices we’re discussing here. It’s all interesting analysis.

Of course women are free to choose how to present themselves (if anyone can truly be free of conscious and unconscious pressures) but I also believe we all have a right to an opinion on that. It is a ‘litmus paper’ indicator of bigger social trends, just as much as any other kind of behaviour, so to me it’s a legitimate topic for analysis and comment.

that idea seems so often to be a way of trivialising, minimising and shutting down any genuine discussion about societal pressures affecting women

What you are referring to @CoffeeCantata is a good example of a Purity Spiral
There is one ideology " you can never criticise because women" and in one fell swoop its utilised to shut down any meaningful debate
It hinges on the idea that women are not influenced in anyway and that their choices are made in a society where they have full control, power and influence.

Women can choose to do what they like with their faces but why are their normal aging faces never seen as enough?
That's the debate
It's a set up to fail situation
We are all going to age and die
Fact

However I was recently in a busy student city and there is a BIG kickback by many women and men - looking quirky, individual, interesting which is good

It's a bit like the grunge rebellion agajn- lots of kids in full on baggy and going scruff, as a riposte to the nike pro gang. I went grunge because I was already seen as one of the weird/ ugly kids, so there was no point trying to emulate the ones who knew how to do fashion and fit in.

I guess that's followed me through life because I don't want to look like everyone else. It's bad enough that I've decided i need to go the generic middle aged blonde like every other woman round here, without dressing the same or buying the same face. I don't go all out different, like when I was a kid, but you wouldn't ever realise which 'tribe' i was with in the pub. Unless there was tribe of women playing dress up in their heads.

@NamechangeNightNurse

I agree, and this kind of argument doesn't do women any favours.

I think fundamentally I've always had a problem with that kind of argument because I genuinely see people as people, individuals, first, rather than men or women. I've realised this only gradually - it seems normal to me! But I do encounter on MN and elsewhere the view that we are men or women first and foremost, which I think is a problem. It leads to all kinds of generalisations and assumptions.

And I think some people have a superficial reaction to discussions like this. They just come out with 'you're bitching about other women', rather than engage with the serious points being made. Possibly there is an element of that in all of us (depending on our tribe!) and it's just human nature and unavoidable, but it's not the main point and it shouldn't detract from serious points people are making.

I once saw a TV documentary about 'influencers' and one was (to me) a charmless, rude and unpleasant young woman with all the enhancements under discussion here. She was wearing very provocative clothes and decided to pose for her filming in the front garden of a private house. The owner, an older woman in jumper and jeans, came out to ask her to move. The influencer retaliated with comments like this:

'F off, you old cow. I bet your husband doesn't want to fuck you, you old bitch. I bet he hates your skinny arse!' She then wiggled her booty to make the point.

It was gross, but it was a glimpse into the mindset of those who have this kind of stuff done. This horrible woman seemed to think that the only basis for a relationship is whether your partner wants to have anal sex with you on the basis of you BBL!.

Fashion

That's good to hear - but maybe the student population is a bit more aware and confident in general about their appearance and self-esteem.

I think it's for Instagram/ SM
The big lips/ eyelashes photograph differently and the look is in on Insta but in RL it looks exaggerated and bizarre

I agree with this. And I think this goes for lots of work or 'enhancements' - botox, fillers, sonetimes microblading, extensions etc. Great with professional lighting and careful poses, horriffic in rl.

I know several people who look like models on their socials but in rl they look bizarre, especially the way the face moves when talking.

I truly wonder how many women there are who've had fillers and botox and think it looks wonderful because they only see their still face in the mirror or photos - but would be aghast if they saw themselves speaking or laughing.

Hydrolic acid dissolves.
There's as many women getting subtle aesthetics, as there are the exaggerated look. When women involved in the sex industry go exaggerated, they earn more. There's a level of misogyny in who men will wank over and who they'll date in front of their peer group. So stop with the 'men don't like it'.
Growing up my Mum had the same perm as every other woman in the 45-60 age range. In the 60's everyone dressed the same, it was in the 80's that individuality started.
A look has become available and some people are going for it. If you look, there were similar writings in the 17/18th about powdered wigs being ridiculous.

As for doing ourselves harm, heels really should be banned then. What the Princess of Wales is thinking of, I don't know, terrible example to Charlotte. After all William isn't wearing heels.

It's ingrained misogyny
Literally women doing the work of the Patriarchy for them

And the 'Abomination of the Hoop Petticoat' and so on. But they didn't affect women's bodies permanently.
However, we know the damage extreme corsets did. So we don't wear them.

I was a heel wearer. I've definitely damaged my knees, but didn't know 20 years ago, that it would come back to haunt me. Heels, really, are ridiculous and probably should be banned.

Hydrolic acid dissolves.

What sort of acid? I've never heard of that one!

And you need acid to dissolve the fillers?. And do things go back as they were? And is it expensive? I think quite wealthy celebrities have had problems with migrating fillers, so it can't be that straightforward.

I'm still not sold on this filler business.

I had my lips done and my hubby loves them, I get so much attention from the young men at the pub when we go for darts. each to their own but they make a world of difference in the bedroom

@PadWife

Whatever floats your boat!