Please? Or not

[IAmNeverThePerson]

Help solve an “discussion” between DH and the DC and I.

I (and the DC - 16 and 18) think that if you add please to a request that is adds optionality. So the person can say no. But if it is just a crack on and do it you shouldn’t say please. For example I would say to either DC. “DC pass me the salt” I wouldn’t say please but I would say thank you when they passed it.

DH thinks that is rude and you should always say please. We think that saying please is rude if the person shouldn’t say no.

what do you think?

I don’t say please for things like that, I do say thank you. Please sounds overly formal, almost passive aggressive in those sort of minor asks - you’re not asking for a big favour!

Polite tone and a thank you is more than enough imo, the word please feels unnecessary. I used to have a boyfriend who would go on about me “not saying please” and it would piss me right off!

Well yes I would say please when ordering a drink. Because the answer can be no.

The point is when the answer can’t be no.

Yeah I'm with dh. I'd tell my kids to do something with a please at the end, I'd still expect it to be done and for me not to be ignored.

The answer can always be no.

For the people who think that saying please is sarcastic, pointed or passive aggressive - how on earth do you say please? That's bizarre.

You should say please. If it's a question you are giving the option of yes or no. Eg 'could you pass me the salt please?'.
A statement doesn't suggest an option but can still be polite 'pass me the salt please'. Although giving someone an order without an option to say no is quite rude in itself unless it's a really necessary request. If you want someone to pass you the salt when you are physically able to do that yourself it should be a polite question not an order.

This is exactly what I was going to say.

@Arlanymor if i am in the middle of cooking their dinner and ask them to fetch an ingredient the answer absolutely cannot be no.

But why in a domestic setting is the thank you not enough?

If someone told me to pass them the salt, I'd tell them to shove it up their arse.

Do you speak to everyone like that or just your teenagers OP?

And how is passing the salt to you not optional whether you say please or not?

if i am in the middle of cooking their dinner and ask them to fetch an ingredient the answer absolutely cannot be no.

👀🤣🤣

so if i was cooking you dinner and asked you to pass me something you were stood next too but didn’t say please that would be a problem? Even if I said thankyou when handed the ingredient?

Depends who it is. With my family/ friends, I would probably say ‘can you pass me the salt’. I’d always say thank you. If I was in a restaurant/ cafe and I didn’t have salt and wanted it from another table etc I would say ‘ excuse me could you pass me the salt please’.

I think the only thing that "please" adds is politeness. I think we can easily take for granted members of our own family and therefore it's important to be polite to them.

To my ears, "please pass the salt," "please take your laundry upstairs," etc., do not sound optional. Just polite and respectful.

I'm team DH too. Although in a domestic setting if my otherwise polite DH says in a polite tone of voice 'can you pass me the salt" I wouldn't make a big fuss if he'd forgotten to add please on the end.

I'd find it jarring if he ALWAYS refused to use please when asking me to hand him things though, especially if his argument was that I had to do it....

Yes because it's rude.

Most 3 or 4 year olds manage to learn this.

I'm not sure how you've got as far as adulthood without realising it?

.

It can be no - people have agency. They can need the loo. Or need to answer the phone. And if you ask rudely - i.e. without the please, which makes it a demand - then they can absolutely say no on the basis of your basic lack of courtesy and politeness. If someone asks me to do something without the word please then I don't do it - don't command me, if you want a favour, be polite.

Because please and thank you are the two sides of manners when someone is doing something for you. It's not either/or. Not the way I was brought up anyway.

Please simply shows politeness/respect-if your manager asks you to complete a report, whether or not she adds please is irrelevant-you still need to do it.

I did ask nicely. I just didn’t say please. I did say thankyou upon receiving the item.

dripfeed: it was not salt.

I think it’s the level of formality. I say please to strangers or people I don’t know well, or if I want someone to do something they may not want to do.

It seems so unnecessary in a casual domestic setting such as “can you pass the salt?” that it comes across almost prickly. Like the equivalent of using the formal “you” with someone you’re close with if you speak a language with familiarity levels like that.

I don’t need or want to hear “please” from my family for tiny asks. “Can you” and a thank you is more than enough to make it a polite request instead of a rude demand. Tone matters so much more than the word please, and a needless “please” affects that tone negatively for me.

I don't know how you say stuff that makes it sound prickly - doesn't when I say it, or my family. It's not formal, it's basic decency. When I was little, I was taught to always say please - maybe this lack of courtesy is a modern thing? Although I am only 46.

Tone matters too - no one says it doesn't. But please and thank you are bookends of polite conversation and always have been. As I say, I have never heard 'please' said to me in a negative tone - I honestly find that bizarre.

Plus if someone demands I pass them something (which the lack of manners would make it sound like a demand), I'm not going to do it in the hope they might eventually find some manners and say thank you.

Maybe we were just all bought up differently? When I was little if I didn't say please, my mam would say: "Sorry, what do you say?" to remind me of my manners. It was't done horribly or to embarrass me, just to remind me that if you request something of someone you need to be polite. I always say please and I always say thank you - I don't know what that is so weird to some people.

of course when there is a possibility of the answer being no. As in a child saying. Please may I have…’

but “grab the pasta out of the cupboard love”. IMHO does not need a please

The answer can always be no.

If I said to someone in my family " pass me the salt" then I'd fully expect them to say no as I'd been extremely rude in ordering them to pass it to me.

Adding "please" takes a microsecond longer to say but transforms an order into a request. It makes the whole interaction different and so much more pleasant. That's why manners were invented, to make interactions between people more pleasant and smooth and render all the involved parties feeling better.

I don't think you're doing your children any favours in the long run in giving them an option to say please. When they're out in the world and in the workplace their lives will be easier if they can say please. The only place I can see that please isn't needed is for example in the armed services when orders are given or in certain medical situations.

I think you must simply be a very rude person tbh.