To think this is closer to a normal childhood than to extreme abuse?

[Greensl100]

I know you can’t and shouldn’t try to measure things like this but I am told that this sort of stuff constitutes extreme abuse and I just don’t think it does. I actually think it is within the realms of a normal childhood from the 90s.

Examples…

one occasion of parent trashing child’s bedroom

leaving 15 year old in home for a week while parents went away (in same country)

calling child self centred

saying child needed to be more like child’s friend

forcing child to spend time around a pet that caused child non life threatening allergic reaction

pulling hair and smacking

not allowing teen to use washing machine or cook for themselves in home

When left home and relationship broke down in twenties, told that they were not welcome in the family home and that if they visited they were a guest

these are some examples and of course I know none of them are brilliant parenting but I don’t think it equals extreme abuse?

I am both a trauma therapist and someone who’s childhood induced a diagnosis of CPTSD (diagnosed by a psychiatrist).

As a therapist, I would never insert words onto your story. Your parameters may be different to mine and also you may not be ready to accept certain situations or memories as abusive. Also you may be remembering situations with a skew or bias (or may have been subsequently told) and it is important to remember that you were a child at the time and will have been building your understanding as a child both mentally and emotionally. It isn’t about labels, it’s about processing your experience to allow you to live your fullest life.

As someone with diagnosed CPTSD, some of these things on your list have red flags. Just because they were ‘normalised’ at the time, doesn’t mean they would be now and this is where you are finding the disparity.

Your therapist shouldn’t be labelling your experience FOR YOU, it should be about you coming to terms with how you think and feel as a consequence of events in your story. In your own way and as you are ready, with guidance.

Best. Z

one occasion of parent trashing child’s bedroom
SUGGESTS MENTAL HEALTH/ANGER ISSUES WITH PARENT - TOXIC

leaving 15 year old in home for a week while parents went away (in same country)
DEPENDS ON THE CHILD AND SITUATION NOT REALLY AN ISSUE

calling child self centred
HEAT OF THE MOMENT ONE OFF OR REGULAR OCCURANCE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS AND CAN BE DAMAGING

saying child needed to be more like child’s friend
IN TERMS OF MANNERS, POLITENESS ETC WOULD HAVE THOUGHT WAS QUITE COMMON SO AGAIN CONTEXT

forcing child to spend time around a pet that caused child non life threatening allergic reaction
DYING GRANDMA / ONLY CHILDCARE THEY COULD GET.... AND A HAYFEVER TABLET MAKES IT MANAGEABLE? AGAIN NOT AWFUL

pulling hair and smacking
CLEAR NO. I GREW UP IM 90S MY PARENT WAS PHYSICAL REPIRMANDED BY THEIR PARENTS SO THEY STOPPED THAT -

not allowing teen to use washing machine or cook for themselves in home
RATHER ODD THEYRE MEANT TO ENCOURAGE LIFE SKILLS

When left home and relationship broke down in twenties, told that they were not welcome in the family home and that if they visited they were a guest
PRETTY AWFUL IMO (AGAIN IF YOU CAUSED DAMAGE, STOLE FROM THEM THATS A DIFFERENT MATTER)

these are some examples and of course I know none of them are brilliant parenting but I don’t think it equals extreme abuse?

Yes the behaviour described is abusive, some of it would have been considered “tough love” eg calling a child self centred, some of it would have been considered discipline (smacking).

While I think each of the things you’ve described are abusive, as a social worker my head goes to a different place when I think of extremes of abuse. The question of course is how much abuse is ok.

I’d be questioning why a therapist felt the need to label your abuse as extreme or otherwise, rather than work with your own experience and perspective.

With the exception of being reminded to think about how other people might feel - and not to be too self centered, I can confidently assure you that absolutely none of those things happened to me or DH (who I just read the list to)

i’m sorry you had a tough time. Having your room trashed, being made to live with something you were allergic too, having your hair pulled and being denied access to the washing machine? None of those things are normal parenting.

I’ve experienced some of there and don’t consider it is extreme, but it is certainly abuse. I had worse. But I’m in my 60’s and it was more acceptable then and parents considered it as discipline. Luckily I have never done this to my own children but the older generation think that we are too soft nowadays, so you can’t win.

None of that happened to me and my mum slipper was always on target no matter how fast I used to run.
I remember she bought ones without a proper sole and we piss ourselves laughing at it because it was like felling a cuddle. Yes, we were savages kids.
I would think none of your list wasn't normal in my childhood, I would classify it as abuse. Not extreme but definitely abuse.

Some of it is extreme, some less so, but all awful. No that’s not a normal loving childhood.

I grew up in the 90s and no it isn’t normal, it is abuse. Even if abuse is normalised, that doesn’t make it more acceptable.

You are getting too hung up on the label of how severe the abuse was, when it doesn’t really matter - I expect your therapist is doing this because you are minimising your experiences. I hope you can heal.

Saying child should be more like child’s friend, not exactly nice, but hardly abuse IMO. My (sometimes difficult but generally good) DM often said out loud that she wished we (4 of us) were more like our cousins, or so and so down the road.

I vowed that I would never say the same to my own dcs, and I never have. TBH I never wanted them to be like anyone else’s kids!

Odd thing is, though, that once we were all grown up DM often said how glad she was that we all got on - unlike her and her 4 siblings - she never really go on with any of them!

Not extreme, but not normal, either. I don't know how useful it is to try to determine where on the scale it falls, considering the absolute nightmarish atrocities that some 'parents' perpetrate on their own children... Compared to that, even neglectful parenting seems benign.

I expect you are sad because you have minimised your parents behaviour your whole life and having it pointed out to you now that they behaved horribly to you will be upsetting and difficult to process. Be kind to yourself.

@Greensl100 this is extreme abuse. I had the same experience with a therapist. I recounted something in a matter of fact way, as I didn't think it was that big a deal. She made me see it was and it will be how you heal from it.

Part of abuse can be making you, the victim, think that it's 'normal' or at least 'not that bad/not as bad as others have it'. You may also feel it wasn't 'extreme' because maybe you are 'relatively sane' (IYKWIM) or you have managed to cope. If so that is a testament to your strength, it doesn't change what happened. Ultimately though, what you call it IMO isn't as important as recovering, although you may want to unpick your resistance to calling it 'extreme'. Let your therapist help you work through it. Good luck x

What??? A child is never to blame for parental abuse. It doesn't matter if they're badly behaved.

Extreme or not…this is abuse, which is not ok at any level.

I think of extreme abuse as being locked out the house, not being fed or clothed, being repeatedly hit or screamed at, forced to live in fear.

I think some of the things on your list are definitely abuse, of varying degrees of severity. I would not call any of them extreme.

Some I agree are just how kids were treated not so long ago.

Edited to say I don’t condone any of those things, and if you endured all of them then collectively that is very abusive. I was just answering your question about the definition.

I’m truly sorry if that was your experience of childhood.

Yes, I'm a similar age and I agree with you.

I hope you are ok, OP

I grew up in the 90s, not one thing on your list happened to me. It's abusive.

It's unpleasant and very upsetting, but not extreme abuse, you weren't beaten, sexually abused, locked in your room or any of the really horrible things you hear that are done to children. I don't know how close to 'normal' it was some parts pretty much, pulling hair and trashing room definitely not normal, smacking once in a while or constantly and how hard, a slap on the legs once in a while could have been fairly normal the other extreme not.

I grew up in the 90s and I didn’t experience one thing on this list and I don’t know anyone else that did? It’s pretty extreme emotional abuse. Maybe you’re not thinking it is because you weren’t being beaten up or sexual abused but emotional abuse is still abuse.

Does it matter if it’s deemed ‘extreme’ abuse or not? I would say they’re all abusive expect the not letting a 20 something year old move home. Regardless it shows a pattern of neglect and disregard for the safety/autonomy of their child.

I would definitely say that some of it could be normal (eg calling a child self centred) but it would entirely depend on the context, tone of voice/reason for saying it (for example: you are hungry and your alcoholic parent who hasn’t given you any dinner because they’re drunk calls you self centred: abuse, vs your mum takes you out for a day trip where you are repeatedly treated all day, and then you throw a massive tantrum about not getting the colour of hair bobble you wanted, expecting your tired mum to turn the car around and go back for a second colour despite it actually being that you changed your mind after the purchase: not abuse).

Some of the things listed are definitely abuse. You have said you already know this.

There isn’t really anything on the list that by itself I would call “extreme abuse”.

However, it could be, depending on the context. How often things like that happened - eg, If it was every day that you were being told you should be more like your friend, that would be pretty extreme. Or again, depending on the context. If it was your mum’s intention to hurt you, then it was abuse.

I know a few people who have a form of Stockholm syndrome from their childhood. (My kidnapper fed me and gave me blankets so it wasn’t all bad, they could have done xyz awful things that other people have experienced, so really I should be grateful).

Sorry if others have given similar answers, I haven’t RTFT only your posts OP.

I’m also sorry that facing this makes you sad. It could be helpful to call yourself a survivor rather than a victim of childhood abuse. It is no small thing to be a normal functioning person after being raised this way.

I do feel quite sad for you.

I didn't go through any of that as a child.

I don't remember this, I was told when i was older but once my dad smacked me and he was so distraught with himself he cried. He never laid a finger on me in anger again. That is much more normal than an adult trashing a child's bedroom. How powerless and sad you must have felt 😭

I grew up in the 90s and this was similar to my upbringing I certainly wouldn't be traumatised or going to counselling over it but at the same time I also wouldn't choose to raise my kids this way. But I feel we've come a long way over the last 30 years.

I feel really weird reading this despite knowing a lot of my childhood was not ideal. Am NC with parents not because of childhood issues but when I look back there several similar behaviors to what you describe and worse. Smacked with shoes/hairbrush, forced to eat cold food I didn't like and made me gag. Things I'd never consider with my own kids.

It's so uncomfortable saying I had an abusive childhood, I was never left with bruises or neglected in the ways some of my friends were (also 80s/90s council estate upbringing) were.
It is what it is.

I get flashes of it when I see my friends faces if I say something and think it's normal and it's obviously not. And not from reading here either.

Not sure what the point of posting this is, just reflecting I suppose! I'm.probably not the best person to judge your situation and I'm sorry these things happened to you but hopefully you can move forwards and deal with it in a way that's right for you. Good luck!

Yes. Hair pulling and slapping is assault and battery under UK criminal law. Of course this is EXTREMELY abusive situation, as is forced exposure to any allergen that triggers life threatening allergic reactions.

Either you are being disingenuous or this is a twisted reverse.