To not want to look after my daughter any more

[Goaheadflameme]

My daughter is 8. She is recently diagnosed with autism. No problems at school but a nightmare at home.

Predictably, being out of the school routine has made her challenging behaviour more challenging. She regularly tells me she hates me, wishes I was dead, that things would be better without me. Everytime
I say something she mocks me. She won’t do anything she is told and consequences are meaningless as she just doesn’t care. Today she has also thrown food round the living room and when I tried to stop this she has violently attacked me multiple times. Previously she has broken my finger and scratched me to the extent that I was hospitalised due to a serious infection in my arm.

I just honestly can’t do it any more. This has been going on for more than two years now. It’s completely ruining me, my relationship with my husband and our family life (we have other children). The violence triggers me so badly due to childhood abuse and I don’t feel safe in my own home.

Do social services take children away in these circumstances?

This is an 8 year old child you are talking about nobody ,can say how's shes going to present as an adult stop terrifying the Op
I'm not sure whst medication you think can be prescribed to mellow out an 8 year old?

Hi OP, so sorry you're struggling.
I just wanted to say you're not alone!
My daughter is 19 now but lots of what you describe have been issues for us over the years.
Dd had always been challenging but excelled academically and had model behavior anywhere except at home!
Age 10 she had what we would describe as a nervous breakdown. She couldn't get out of bed & totally shut down. We ended up at CAMHS where she was quickly dx with high functioning ASD but the psychiatrist mentioned a possible personality disorder (then discharged us & denied ever saying this!)
Long story short, shes improved a lot just with age and managed to get English & maths gcses (I home educated her as couldn't get her to school) but she's currently doing absolutely nothing and we worry a lot.
I think your dd could be lashing out at you simply because you're her mum and we are often the closest to our young kids.
Im afraid all i can suggest is to hang on in there! Hopefully, she will mellow a bit as she matures.

You like your studies don't you?
The fact is there is a limit on what csn be offered at this stage that's a fact no its not ideal but it's reality.

I have 4 autistic DC. DS3 is the only one with challenging behaviour. It's incredibly difficult and I have considered at times that splitting would be better for us all.

I don't think it's a horrific idea, and there's a dad I've seen on social media that documents his situation, where he and his ex have 2 autistic DC together and they swap them over weekly. They trigger each other and this set up works for them.

For the OP, I hope you'll take the useful information here, like requesting a carer's assessment from SS and applying for DLA.

Whilst no behaviour has been seen at school, do they observe any difficulties? If you have the funds, maybe look into an OT assessment including sensory. This has been the most useful assessment DS3 has had.

I would also add DS3 (now 12) improved a lot when he stopped attending school. He now has EOTIS. He was not a masker from YR1, which made the EHCP battle a bit easier.

I'm not trying to scare her at all. I apologise to her wholeheartedly if I did. I should of added the violent autistic patients we had were mid teens and non verbal! Her daughter IS verbal so that helps ALOT!! I am sure that she will get much, much better with therapy and assistance and as other posters have posted with teenagers and adult autistic children who were violent at her age but after age 10 one poster said, after therapy and assistance their child was no longer violent towards them and someone else said their adult son who is 27 was the same but amicable at other times and therapy helped him alot. There is a huge range of behaviours based on the spectrum of autism, the fact her daughter is verbal is a fantastic sign and she is more likely to benefit greatly from assistance and therapy. And regarding medication I have ADHD and needed to be medicated as young as her daughter so YES!!!!! ALOT of autistic children ARE in fact medicated to mellow out the violence alongside other practical therapies. Apologise I did not word my post better. I was shhing my 17month old to sleep so was distracted. I did not mean to frighten her at all.

Medicated with what my son us severely autistic non verbal etc medication has never been suggested, and I know a lot of autistic children/ young adults through my son I don't think any of them are medicated at 8
I on an American Facebook group for parents and carers of severely autistic children/ adults and I know medication is used far more widely in America.

@x2boys Fluoxetine, an SSRI, is often prescribed for autistic children with challenging behaviour, especially if accompanied by high anxiety/OCD, both of which my DD had.
DD started this at 10.
After a couple of years this was no longer adequate, and her behaviour became awful. She was then switched to Sertraline (another SSRI) and Risperidone, an antipsychotic often prescribed for autistic children with challenging behaviour. Frankly, I believe this saved her life. And mine.
There were other children at DDs school also on these medications. One started at 9.

Medications won't be prescribed for all autistic children, because, as you know, they're all very different with different behaviours and needs.
But the high functioning, verbal children who are struggling with anxiety, OCD, angry outbursts etc. are sometimes prescribed SSRIs and/or antipsychotics.

Two people who have said they are social workers have stated that it is in the best interests of a violent child to remain within the family home at all times. I’m assuming they are basing this statement on documentary evidence and not just on warm fuzzy feelings.

At no point have either of them said that a violent child remaining in the home is in the best interests of the rest of the family.

I find that quite telling.

My Son is heavily medicated. It helped for about 6 months.

To add to my above post Risperidone can be prescribed from age 5; Fluoxetine from age 8.

These are NHS guidelines, btw!

My son is 6 and the EXACE same.
Except hes not able to attend school now.
He doesn't sleep, trash talks me all day long, wants me to die, attacks myself and his sister.
I don't meet the criteria for according to Social services.

Always happy to chat to other parents in same boat.

I really appreciate all these replies thank you so much. Am busy reading through.

I haven’t made any calls yet. We have been out today and she has been absolutely fine 🤷🏻‍♀️ It’s so unpredictable which is what makes it so hard as you never know what is coming.

I think I will film the next outburst so there is something to show the professionals

Be careful with filming. Be sure DD doesn’t know.

BTW - some professionals have a knack for seeing something other than what you see. Instead of getting help supporting DD, they might say you are not taking correct action or you are making it worse. Or that you are intimidating, abusive …etc

Well, we didn't actually ask what she meant as our daughter was with my husband & I in the meeting. The Dr said "we could be looking at a possible personality disorder here" and then explained the findings of the autism screening (ie where the psychologist & psychiatrist note their findings etc.
Our daughter has been on antidepressants for a year, which seem to help a little at first but she gets serious episodes where shes depressed for weeks on end then randomly things suddenly turn & she will be sleepless and really excitable.
I've encouraged a trip to the Gp many times but she plays down what is happening and now shes classes as an adult, I can't really do as much.
Sorry for the lengthy reply, but wanted to answer you properly!

A female child with a learning need at 8 - absolutely should stay in the family home:

• with an ASD assessment via the neuro- pathway and the parenting courses that must be done alongside it, for obvious reasons. -EHCP put in place if appropriate. -For most children who are verbal and in mainstream they would be opened to the targeted support/early help service rather than a disabilities team within social care

-Robust support and safety planning around mitigating/de-escalating/ managing the challenging violent behaviours would be put in place considering all family members including the child. This would mean the allocated worker visiting regularly and giving oversight and support and escalating the case if appropriate.

-Two able bodied adults- one of which is a male could easily be shown how to safely contain their child from harming herself and others by using their own strength/bodies in a safe, calm loving way.

-Services charitable groups and other organisations can be signposted to as well as clubs and activities over the holidays

-if child is eligible for DLA/ parents have the funds sign posting to short break respite also happens

A persistently violent 14 year old male with a single mum and younger siblings could quite possibly be taken into care if dad/ no other family members would take him on.
Very often the mums don’t want this though and continue to work with services including the police each and every time it happens until they are left with no choice which utterly breaks them.
It is devastating to see.

However, I’ve seen it turned around many times by intense intervention such as the child to parent violence service via the YMCA and social care - marvellous service in this area. Doing great work.
Child to parent violence it is much more common than people think and at the moment in my case load (adolescents team) the main ones are females around 13/14 no SEN, more the result of gentle/ hands off parenting, identity issues within a blended family, and one older one 15/16 who has idealised going into care in her head and sees hitting mum as a way to get there.

( Excise typing- I’m on my phone with wrong glasses on )

Interesting. But…

How does this benefit the rest of the family? OP has already been hospitalised as a result of violence by the 8 year old girl (possibly younger at the time) and has sustained broken bones during an attack. OP also finds the aggression and violence triggering as she is a survivor of childhood abuse herself.

Additionally there are other children in the home and they will be witness to the violence meted out by their sibling to their parents, and possibly on the receiving end of it themselves. Are they not classed as vulnerable? Aside from sibling violence, is there any other situation in which social services would expect children to live under the same roof as a violent individual?

Does the position of social services change if the siblings are younger than the challenging child? Does the age of the siblings change the level of mitigating/de-escalating behaviours they are expected to perform in order to lessen the chances of being hit or precipitating a violent outburst targeted at their parents? Young children may end up believing that their parents are being assaulted because they dared to refuse to acquiesce to their sibling. Is the potential for self-blame by the siblings ever considered?

What level of trauma is acceptable to expect a family/individual to deal with before social services consider, at the very least, a part-time residential placement?

”-if child is eligible for DLA/ parents have the funds sign posting to short break respite also happens”

This is what I would hope would be offered as part of a normal support package, yet it appears this isn’t the case. My ire is directed at the apparent blindspot of social services in offering this to too few of those who would benefit from it.

@Goaheadflameme re triggers, I quite like the analogy I heard about 'static electricity'. For children who have issues with sensory overload that can lead to panic/meltdown/lashing out, there may not be any obvious triggers. It can be that there's been a build up during the preceding hours, and if there's been no release, at some seemingly random point it all comes out - like a static shock, when you haven't noticed it build up.
Whilst looking for triggers can of course be helpful (eg there may be specific ones such as fluorescent lights) it can also do wonders to build in times throughout the day where you 'release the static'. Eg calm spaces, opportunities for stimming, sensory feedback such as a rocking chair or trampoline. Helping the child stay within their comfortable limits. This way of thinking can be particularly useful when built into the school day, to combat what a lot of posters have referred to, their child holding it all in at school and then being totally unregulated when they get home.

Does she have any OCD and separation anxiety? Have you looked onto PANS/PANDAS

Why would OP take her DD to A&E? A&E is for medical emergencies. They're not going to admit a medically fit child onto the paediatric ward because her parent is (albeit understandably) struggling to cope.

I did once work with a parent who tried to abandon her child at the nearest Hospital thinking they would be taken into care. The Hospital called the Police and they took her straight home.

The idea that every child who receives DLA is eligible for respite care or a residential school placement is pure fantasy i'm afraid.

Because it means there is an actual record which is also verified by professionals and can help build up a picture , as opposed to just mums version of events.

The same could be achieved by asking the school safeguarding lead to make a Children's services referral, or visiting the GP.

Yes, I agree.
OP be mindful of surrendering your parental rights, most of the autistic teenagers surrendered end up in psychiatric wards as longterm inpatients, I wouldn't wish the experience on my worst enemy. I would only considering it if I was half dead.
You can't get them out.
Patient 19 and investigating Essex are two podcasts that delve into the treatment these patients receive.
Do your very best in helping her overcome her issues and anxiety.