Maintenance Payments Ending

[Hula0565890]

The spousal and child maintenance payments between me and my ex are due to end in September as per the court order. From Oct all costs of our kids will then be shared evenly between us.

My ex earns at least 3 times the amount I currently do. AIBU to ask if they will be willing to split the costs more than 50/50 in light of this, appreciating this cannot be enforced?

I think a lot of people (including ourselves until recently) are unaware of the changes to student finance over the years since I got my fees paid and a full grant. If your household income is over £25K your offspring will NOT be entitled to a full maintenance loan. The expectation is that parents earning above that will contribute. They will be entitled to a tuition fees loan paid directly to the uni, which will leave them in considerable debt for most of their working lives. They will also be able to get a loan of around £5K which will not even cover halls of residence fees of around £200 per week. It's easy to say "get a part-time job', but these are in very short supply as there are so many students looking. Also, some unis (including Oxford and Cambridge) forbid you from working in term-time - you can be thrown out - and many courses, e.g. medicine, dentistry, engineering are so full on that it is not possible to work alongside and pass. A gap year could help you save some I guess, but a lot of unis are reluctant to take students on competitive courses like maths, as they think they will lose their edge in the year off. It is really, really important to save whatever you can to help. If you can't, you can't, of course.

@NanFlanders
A quick google proves this is bollocks.

@NanFlanders

It does depend somewhat on the course.

I've just had a look, if I'm not wrong SD's household income is a little less than ours, at £45kish, and the calculator tells me that would be £7500 a year in maintenance loans. I looked up Liverpool Uni halls and they start at £6,756 a year (£173 a week for term time only).

That leaves £744 which is obviously nothing like enough to live off. However, even if you have a very intense course, you can work over the summer. Even 4 weeks of full time work at NMW could save £2k, and students usually get around 12 weeks off so I don't think 4 is crazy, even if it takes them a while to find work. So that's £50 a week for every week of term.

If you can work even 4 hours a week PT, that's another £50, and I think £100pw should be enough to live off shouldn't it?

If parents can chuck in some money for a big supermarket shop a few times a year and cover train fares, I think that wouldn't be an uncomfortable life.

We will be giving SD monthly money when she goes to Uni but it won't be anything like the figures floated on here of £500+, we just don't have it.

Re dentistry and medicine, you do get a bursary for those.

@Stiffnewknee Those are the figures for Welsh students. I should have clarified - Scottish students get free tuition, Welsh students get a combination of grants and loans. For English students, the situation is as I described.

Yes they are and my DC were Welsh students but it can’t be that different for English students surely? There would quite rightly be uproar if they were worse off!

They should ask him, not you.
You are no longer connected financially with him. They are, as adult children.

@Stiffnewknee The situation is vastly different for English students. (Btw, I don't normally spout " bollocks". DD has recently had uni finance assessment and DH is a uni prof, so we are up to date on the situation)

Students also have the option to study at a uni close to where they live which saves on accommodation costs

You should sit down between you and figure out how / if you support your children through uni - and dad can pay direct to his children

for non term time you can ask fir a contribution for food etc from
your ex if your children will live with you those terms - but he can say no

@MascaraGirl Also true, of course. Assuming it's a decent uni that offers the course you want. Degree level apprenticeships are another good option - but extremely competitive.

Unfortunately there is quite a difference. I've not looked into it in this much detail before, but it's better than I thought.

SD will only get £7684 which won't cover her expenses. There's another £500 ish because she has a younger brother living at home.

The "expected" contribution from parents is £2480. That's around £200pm so for separated parents, or £100 each pm which is reasonable.

I don't know whether @bumblecoach is on a much bigger income than us or if she felt her precious darlings couldn't survive at uni without fine wine and caviar, but I can't find any evidence that you're actually expected to contribute many £100s every month to your child's living costs.

@MrsSunshine2b
Plus when you factor in that they are only really there for around 8-9 months of the year. My eldest was home at least 1-2 times a month as well because she was only an hour away. Using the argument about Oxford and Cambridge forbidding students from working, well everyone knows they are elitist which put DD2 off applying despite her school encouraging her to. The head of 6th form actually called me and said she should apply as a bright student from a single parent family and a disadvantaged postcode! However, by insisting students can’t have a part time job they are excluding many on lower incomes inadvertently. Not working was not an option for either of my DC. For those saying there aren’t any jobs, my DC never had any issues finding part time student work. They only graduated in 2023/4 so not as if things will have changed that much!

OK. I think I can see where some of the difference in perspective is coming from - if a Welsh student can get over £12K in a combination of grants and loans, then some work over the summer making it up to £14 or £15K would make it possible to 'do uni' without significant parental support. An English student with parents earning £60K would get c.£5K - a far larger shortfall to make up - so I think could have a reasonable expectation of parents contributing. (NOT that I think they should have to - there should be a system in place - like the Welsh one - where it is possible for an adult to go to uni independently). Btw, I wouldn't discourage lower income students from applying to Oxbridge - if they are on a full loan, then terms are shorter than elsewhere (8 weeks), there are lots of random bursaries, and the benefits are huge. A Sutton Trust study from a few years back found that even when factors like socio-economic background, previous educational attainment and attendance at a private or state school are taken into account, there is a very significant earning differential compared with other institutions. They will only become less elite if a broader cohort apply.

The situation for English students is indeed massively different from Welsh students. The reason there isn't uproar is probably that Welsh students are so few in numbers compared to English Students that most English people are unaware of the difference in funding.

On a separate topic, Low income people shouldn't be put off applying to Oxbridge, as the terms are shorter, the accommodation often cheaper and many of the colleges offer bursaries for students on lower incomes.

As they’re turning 18 they have to become a bit more responsible for themselves. It’s unusual for most families to financially support a child through uni and you should only do so if you can afford to.
If you can’t afford to fully financially support what they need, then you tell them what you can afford and either they need to get a bursary/grant/loan/job and/or speak to their father about how much he is willing or able to contribute.
They are not children anymore.

It is not uncommon for financial order on divorce to make a court order to continue child maintenance when a child is still in full time education including uni either paid direct to spouse or shared if child returns home during breaks or to ex spouse if child lives at home where there is significant income discrepancy. Not all DC at uni can also work and it not fair that the resident parent on lower income bears all financial responsibility.

My autistic ADHD DC has struggled with his first year due to not being medicated awaiting a cardiac referral and DSA not providing agreed support and his summer break has been taken up by revision for retakes to allow progression to the next year.

His dad stopped maintenance when allowed to do so legally and hasn’t contributed a penny since because no court order is in place but could afford to do so as a higher rate tax payer.

Good fathers make good choices in the best interests of the child. It’s not a question of money but helping where you can. Not so good fathers who are relatively high earners need a firm hand via court order before they step up.

They are 18 not kids. They can make their own decisions on that surely?

Why would the money go through the spouse when the children are adults?

I agree that it's morally right to support your children as much as you can whilst they are in education but there has to be a cut off. An adult who has left home is not the legal responsibility of their parents regardless of marital status.

Well bearing in mind they will have had the ability to vote for 2 years before reaching 18 shortly ...

This is not my experience are you referring to the tuition loan. As far as I am aware, the maintenance loan starts reducing with a household income of £25K. So the child of a single parent working 40 hours a week in a min wage job would likely not even get the full loan.
It seems crazy to me but recent governments have continued to freeze the thresholds, they’ve been frozen since 2021 and I can’t understand how they can justify this with the cost of living, inflation and the rise in min wage.

I can only speak from my own experience of the Welsh system which seems to be better. There’s no expected parental contribution but the grant is means tested. Each student gets the same amount but students on lower incomes have less to pay back.
From what people have said, the English system is not as good.

Thank you for clarifying. I am on the English system unfortunately. I don’t know much about the Welsh system so it’s interesting to compare.

It seems that students in Scotland don’t have to pay?

My DC will not get the full maintenance loan next year even though I am a single parent working F/T on min wage. The threshold is very low.

Yeah - that’s what most students at Uni do. My grandchildren all worked. Working part time doesn’t hurt them.🤷‍♀️

They are 18 and thus "adults". They should be working etc as best they can to help fund uni costs etc .... your agreement was made until 18 for good reason!