Father in law said he couldn’t come help us because he’d be too FKD

[Starlightbright200]

Hello! I’ve just hashed it out with my father in law but I feel like I need an outsiders perspective to know if I’m being overly sensitive or if this is behaviour to expect.

I recently gave birth to DC 3 a couple of days ago but it was whilst I was pregnant my FIL really pissed me off. My partner and him have a good enough relationship but they’ve definitely had struggles particularly since we’ve had kids. For my partner it highlights his dads absence and lack of support when he’s been really struggling. My MIL who is no longer with FIL is going through chemo and whilst she has always offered support we dont feel it’s fair to take it, knowing that she’s also physically struggling. Her partner is also useless and is a functioning alcoholic so she doesn’t have the best support herself. She is also based really far from us. My mum has helped us the most in the past and I would say she is our main support if we need it but she isnt that close by either, she is also 10-15 years older than my in laws and single. I’ve also found she doesnt actually like having to make the long journey and doesn’t always willingly want to help as she’s older so we try not to ask much. We are actually very self sufficient as we do so much ourselves and pay for nursery and baby sitters if we have the spare money but it’s never to do anything for fun it will literally only be for childcare whilst at work. In fact all of our family support is still just for this. I think in the five years of having kids we’ve been to the cinema once on our parents time. We’ve never done anything else!

My DH missed the birth of DC2 because we didn’t have childcare in place in the middle of the night and because of this we asked my mum to come stay with us until the baby was born 2 weeks before due date. A really big ask but she agreed. 2 weeks pass and we feel like she really needs a rest because she’s been helping out so much around the house whilst I focus on all the childcare and my partner is at work. We really want to give her some respite so we ask FIL if we paid for his train fare (because he’s used cost of travel a reason for not coming in the past and he lives 2 hours away) would he come for the weekend just so my mum can rest and come back. His reply was “sorry I can’t it’s my works end of year do and I will be out eating and drinking all day, sorry it’s not my fault it’s this week” My partner then said well could you just come on the Saturday morning instead and leave Sunday and his response was “sorry I’ll be too FKD” My partner sarcastically said thanks for your help and his FIL said “it’s not my fault it’s on the same day. Don’t wanna fall out with you over this”

Is this normal behaviour to expect? Were we asking too much? I personally was shocked by the order of priorities but also zero offer of an alternative day or week. we said absolutely nothing back.

fast forward to today..
FIL’s wife keeps in touch and asking about the baby but I feel resentful in wanting to share much detail because FIL hasn’t said checked in at all about baby’s arrival. I explained the birth was chaotic, my partner was worried the baby had died and that whilst we were all doing ok the journey here was quite traumatic. I kept asking why FIL still hadn’t called his son despite knowing this information so he sends me a message by way of her instagram saying he hasn’t heard anything for three weeks because he thought we were annoyed at him. I urge him to call his son himself and not talk to me about it. Hours pass and I have enough and call him and we hash it out. He says I’m not the boss of him, he didn’t want to not go to his work outing, he wanted to go to it and he wasn’t not going to go because he has plans. He then says more excuses as to why he won’t come such as I hate London, I hate trains. No one’s going to change me, I’m not gonna be the father he wants so we are never gonna be ok. I was thinking, he literally just wants you to visit!?! What the fuck is he actually asking of you that is so wild. He also said I’m not at your beck and call… this is the only time we asked you to come down and we thought the reason was pretty valid!?

when we go to where he lives, he is hands on with our kids and they really enjoy each others company. But that happens about 4 times a year. there is zero effort ever to put himself out or to come to us.

am I being ubreasonable in thinking he should’ve at least offered an alternative day he could do some heavy lifting instead of a 72 year old woman? Or is this a common mistake to think this way.

I don't think it's usual to ask for so much help from relatives. You shouldn't choose to have 3 children and then expect folk to come running to you to help at the drop of a hat. His night out is probably only once a year and he's been looking forward to it so shouldn't have to change his plans. Sorry but you expect too much.

Wow. YABVU.

I'm pregnant with my 4th. We have lose plans in place that we will call grandparents/a couple of friends depending on the time of day to watch the others but if they can’t I go alone! I don’t have a relationship with my parents but OHs parents would laugh at us if we asked them to stop eveything in case the baby comes, which is the reaction I would expect from them!

Abit harsh.
I feel it was reasonable of OP to expect some support from family whilst she was in hospital giving birth.
FIL's plans were for a social event, irrespective of whether they had been planned in advance

@DonnyBurrito

and..? Getting pissed can be pretty fun you know! He was probably looking forward to it all year.

This is what I don't get. OP and boyfriend were at work, she says they pay for nursery, what exactly was there to wear mum out all day?

She wasn't in the hospital giving birth though!

This thread seems to be full of sour people who could have done with some help around the birth of their child. Thats how society worked for hundreds of years, people would help highly pregnant and post partum women and its for a reason.

I dont thing OP you are wrong to need help and I think PPs are playing dumb asking why did your mother help with housework. I dont think your FIL should have canceled his work do but he could have offered some help, ie on the Sunday.

Apologise for what???
I think OP is being given a very hard time here

@Starlightbright200

I think you are both reasonable and unreasonable.

I can understand why you wanted some cover for delivery- not unreasonable, given you have said you had a very quick Labour and the wider family are far away. I understand it would be nice to have more support- but this is what happens if you don’t have family close by or parents who are in poor health. It’s not ideal, but you made a choice to have children and to live where you do. I would also say you knew what level of support is available to you when you decided to have another baby, and presumably decided the status quo was something you were comfortable with when you decided to have a 3rd child.

Your FIL does not sound an overly involved grandparent, which is not what you’d hoped for and I understand that is disappointing (particularly for your partner). But, he also still works- ? Full time- and lives far away from you. He probably can’t actually be there as much as you would like, even if he wanted to. On the plus side, you say he is good with the children when you do see him. If you don’t value what support he is prepared/able to give, and feel he does not make enough effort- then simply scale back the effort you make with him accordingly. It does not have to be a big drama or a big falling out.

I do think, though, that I think you have very seriously taken advantage of your mum if she is so exhausted after 2 and a bit weeks (2 weeks before the birth and baby now a few days old) that you needed to try and draft in help to give her a break. I think you should reflect on that aspect of you and your partner’s behaviour during the last few weeks and how you got to this point. After all, you said she was there to provide cover just in case you needed to make a quick dash to the hospital- she was not there to run around after you all, doing your housework (possibly also helping with meals and childcare).

What were you and your partner doing in the last 2 weeks? I get you were heavily pregnant, but what would you have done if your mum wasn’t there? You’d both have had to crack on with it. I’m not saying she would not want to help at all, of course she would- but why did you let her do things to the point where she is so exhausted you felt the need to get FIL over to give her respite? You could, and should, have insisted she pace herself. And now that she is needing a break, you should let her get one (without needing to wait until you have someone else to help). Why does she need to come back after a rest? Why can’t you and your partner cope by yourselves?

I don’t mean to sound rude, but I do wonder if this sort of expectation/tendency towards taking advantage of others has perhaps impacted on the level of support available to you?

As for your FIL, he did have pre-arranged plans and he did not wish to drop them. I don’t think it is unreasonable, especially as you wanted help so your mum could have a break- it wasn’t like you haven’t had any help/ support at all and were both at the end of your tether. I think most people would think “why do they need almost consistent help when they are both at home and her mother has been with them for weeks?”.

You are recovering from birth, but your partner isn’t- why can he not manage to do the essentials with your support as you are able? How long are you expecting to have 24/7 on-site additional support from your mum or someone else? It just seems a bit, I don’t know- precious? we managed perfectly ok between us after the delivery of each of our children- it was exhausting, chaotic etc, and yes the house was not spotless, food was either quick and easy or things I had prepared and frozen in advance etc. But it was fine! You would be fine too, I should think.

The fact your FIL felt the need to say “I don’t want to fall out with you” makes me wonder if he then did not contact you because he thought didn’t want to hear from him. Perhaps a little childish- but your partner did not call him either. I suppose it’s also possible that as his wife had been in contact, both your partner and/or your FIL didn’t feel it was necessary. Or perhaps he felt you would not welcome too many calls and as his wife had already been in contact, it would be annoying if he called too (though a message asking if it was ok would have sorted it all out, if that has been the case). The fact that your FIL didn’t immediately offer another date is not shocking- I can easily see why he might not —perhaps he thought you only wanted help that particular weekend and so offering another date wasn’t necessary/helpful.

You then phoned to “have it out with him”- I think that was for your partner to do, in all honesty, if he is unhappy about the situation.

But @Starlightbright200 you did say in one post:

I am very aware it’s not “normal” but I took the advice of my midwives to be prepared from week 38 they said can anyone stay with you. I said my mum maybe so I asked her and she said yes. There was no pressure if she said no we would look at other option but she said yes.

So if there was no pressure on your mum and, if she'd said no you wouldn't hold it against her, why are you holding it against your FIL? He said no.

I agree it wasn't ideal, but I don't see why he had to give up his works do because your mum had knackered herself out doing stuff you didn't need her to do - that's her problem to be honest. I do agree that he could have made it for mid day on the Saturday or whatever day it was after his works do. So that was just an excuse on his part. But he'd still only been there until Sunday as I imagine he'd have work - like you and your partner do.

I think you were unreasonable to expect him to give up his work night out. You should also tell your dm to stop doing housework if it's making her too exhausted....she needed to make sure she's not too knackered to help out with childcare for the birth.

Lots of people have long distance families these days so it's not unusual for family to be some distance and not be available for ad hoc childcare for date nights etc. We either used nursery staff or did babysitting trades with friends.

I agree with this.
BUT . . . look at the positives, if they weren't willing to put themselves out for you when you are in need then you have no obligation to them if they are in need.
Let them reap what they have sown.

At time of writing, 91% of 1381 people think she’s being unreasonable and there are hundreds of comments detailing why. You might not agree, but it’s been made abundantly clear what the issue is felt to be with regards to her conduct towards him.

Apologise for that.

You have kids, you should be able to deal with life accordingly. You shouldn’t have had a 3rd if you couldn’t already do it.

Even if she was doing nothing it would have been nice to go home to your own place and relax in piece.

@Mrsbloggz

but where does that end though?

Are there any limits to that?

should you do anything and everything your adult son/daughter and their partner ask of you even if it’s adversely affects you mentally, physically, socially, emotionally, just in case they then decide not to help you in later life and throw you in a nursing home?

It is great when (competent) help is given by family willingly, but expecting it does risk upsetting you. I had zero (literally) help from my parents and in laws and I never asked for help. I never called it out, if it wasn’t offered willingly I didn’t think there was a point. In contrast, my younger sister and brother have received lots of help. Years ago when my kids were about 12 and 15, my Mum was talking to me and my sister and at some
point in our conversation she was talking about who would look after her when she got older, genuinely, and with no malice, I matter of factly said I would help as much as I had been helped. That was a mic drop moment.

Then she needs to just do that- nobody should be being pressured into providing help they do not freely want to give.

This ‘the youth of today are so entitled’ schtick cracks me up when the generation above us had a functioning nhs (and lose their head when a gp dares to call them instead of offering a face to face), could afford mortgages on a single income, got to retire at 60/65, had no tuition fees if they went to university and STILL lose their actual minds at the idea that a winter fuel payment should be means tested and not just given out because ‘I’m old and worked my whole life’. Not to mention the pension triple lock. If I was a younger person today and gestures at the world I’m not sure I’d want to even get out of bed!

She was exhausted, she was over worked !! Not just “stepping up”, you described her as

we feel like she really needs a rest because she’s been helping out so much around the house whilst I focus on all the childcare and my partner is at work.

Also, sounds quite dramatic, why did your partner think the baby had died?

Actually, even if one has helped and supported one’s offspring over years and years, they don’t necessarily feel any obligation or desire to offer support in one’s later years……

Well, I agree. If you read my post, I said her expectations for him to cancel his plan was unrealistic. I didn't say he was available - just making a point that lots of people seem to be saying nobody should ever need any help. IF it's available then she should absolutely take it.

Obviously this time it wasn't.

YABU

Your FIL had other plans that weekend, it did not suit him to visit and he communicated that.

You already had significant support with the children as you had your partner and your mother there to support you both before and after the birth.

While managing children and recovering feom childbirth is intense, you did have support and your FIL was busy with a prior commitment of his own. He was not exactly abandoning you in your hour of need. He does not live close by so it was a big ask.

As most people agree : 3rd child is a big step and you are responsible
Should've stuck to 2. They are not obliged to help. Advertise for a mother's help
Loads of 18 year olds would be free now after A levels.
Payfor help, like everyone else.

Goodness! I'm wide eyed at some of these responses. Shouldn't families support each other? Isn't that the definition of a family? A network of blood / linked by marriage or adoptive relatives who love and care for each other whenever they can? I've not read the whole thread, but understand that OPs MIL has been unwell and going through chemo, so OP can't ask her to be available. But I'm amazed that FIL wouldn't give up a boozy night to be on call so his only son could be at the birth of his third baby. My mum was wonderful when I had baby 3 in another country - she flew out early at what was a really traumatic time for us. If she'd not been able to come, my dad would have or my MIL or FIL. And you know what? When our parents were ill, what did we do? We dropped everything to help them...because we loved them (still support my 97 year old dad) and because that's what families do!