Thread 6: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

[DisappointedReader]

The Observer The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

Second article in the Observer
https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/the-salt-path-whats-in-the-book-and-what-the-observer-has-found

Third item in the Observer
https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/the-salt-path-the-truth-behind-the-blockbuster-book-video

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Thread 5 Thread 5: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film? | Mumsnet

Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement Raynor Winn

NB Please be careful when it comes to naming or implicating people who aren't in the public eye or have no connection to the story, especially where details are unclear or still emerging i.e. DON'T DO IT.

Keep on the path. No saltiness. Thank you.

New posters welcome. It would be helpful to read at least the three Observer articles before posting.

I suspect that Bill Cole may have come to realise that his "investment" in this couple was unwise.

He says that the health problems and being let down by friends resonated with him, so part of his "investment" may have been to try to attract good karma by doing a Good Thing, or to make amends for something, or to show to himself that he was a good and kind person -- altruism can be connected to all sorts of motives which may sound selfish but if they bring about good, then what's the harm in that?

Plus he might have been hoping to boost the value of the cider making business by association with TSP.

It must have become clear to him that his investment was not paying off. Maybe he told the Walkers they needed to start paying a decent rent now that they could afford it. Maybe he told them that more cider needed to flow! So TW spins another yarn about being at death's door, to get them off the hook, then they flit.

I'm assuming that Bill Cole has signed something with the observer which stops him from speaking to other media outlets.

NB all this is conjecture!

It seems cruelly ironic that Bill couldn’t live on the cider farm himself because his wife has cancer and they need to be near a hospital, so he lets it out to a couple… where the husband has a degenerative terminal illness. Maybe they thought the hard physical labour of cider farming would be nearly as good as a long walk for Moth?

In the Observer podcast CH and her editor said they hadn’t expected such huge interest in the story. With other papers hot on their heels, they probably needed to publish what they have to stop the story running away from them.

My impression from the podcast is that CH is working on other aspects of the story but she was fairly circumspect.

So basically it's always been a load of old cobblers.

The clue we have from Moth himself in the Raworth interview is we enjoy reading and we thoroughly enjoy taking books and stories apart and trying, you know, to express our feelings and you know and just discuss a very good story

You have competition between the two wannabe author brothers with Tim and Sally coming up with misery memoir, nature, financial deception, achieve life and death cliffhanger via medical diagnosis and miracle cure.

What sells books to the older book buying public - book clubs, we need women to buy this so Raynor/Sally steps up.

Inspired by Simon Armitage getting a couple of books out of long walks, that gives them a structure to pin lots of 'what makes a good story'. they are not a funny couple so it's not going to have Simon's deadpan humour or 500 mile walkies absurdity.

So points for the reader believing it's true, points for staring at nature and getting an emotional kick, points for cider making, small holding, anything from John Seymour's self sufficiency books.

Due to going down the Moth illness route, he can't strip his top off and scythe the meadows like Poldark in the first few books but if we get a second film he'll be out there.

The pair of them must be as fit as fleas entering marathons. The virtual London one in Oct 2020 was a good test.

Chuck in Hardings beautiful cover and the whole enterprise suddenly takes off beyond everyone's expectations.

Next we'll have the Walkers ' True story' proper memoir, with Raynor in knots about being discovered , Moth wishing he could help but stressed at the pressure of churning out the next book for the Evil Emperor Penguin Publisher....

And then after that it will be a couple of Jeffrey Archer type novels.

That's my prediction!

I think that's precisely what they claim- that in rewilding the farm, they were "rewilding Moth." Jeez it all sounds so constructed to tap into a readership.

CH/the Observer first contacted them in March, so they've known it was all about to unravel for the past 4 months. When was the film publicity happening; did it overlap?

Have you not heard of other very successful businesses people who buy another business thinking they will be successful there too. Read kitchen confidential by Antony bourdain or look at Simon Jordan who lost £40m owning Crystal palace football club. They often go in with rose tinted glasses
Also I expect he was going to leverage their fame as a selling point for his cider "salt path cider" would be a good name...did they want a large cut of the profits, did it never get that far as they didn't produce cider?

Inspired by Simon Armitage getting a couple of books out of long walks, that gives them a structure to pin lots of 'what makes a good story'. they are not a funny couple so it's not going to have Simon's deadpan humour or 500 mile walkies absurdity.

Funnily enough that sounds plausible.
Bloody Simon Armitage has a lot to answer for!

April and May they were publicising the film.

Cannot understand how Sally could sit there on national telly plugging a film based on her lies book knowing all this was coming. Maybe she was just enjoying it while it lasted but Christ it takes some front, something she seems to have more of than Blackpool.

This was in 2007. Back then I don't think there were any symptoms of a "complex neurological disease" let alone "incurable cancer". I think this just exemplifies Sally/Raynor as a spinner of yarns.

It sounds like it was because they were doing sweet f.a on the farm:

Bill made the couple an offer to live on the farm for a very low rent with a small fee for helping out .

Then:

Richard says he was concerned for his friend, however, because the farm was losing money. Cider was not being produced and the orchards were not being attended to.

Sounds like they wanted the house and lifestyle but without the graft.

And how uncannily familiar this sounds after what we've alredy found out about them!

That was my read of it too. Tim’s brother had by then been told Sally had massive credit card debt (suspect this was a cover of course for her theft from Hemmings) and that Tim had a degenerative disease, and now the cancer story that had been spun in France. It won’t have been the brother’s first experience of Tim’s lies, that’s for sure. He was wise to tie the loan to the business and charge interest. Can only imagine he was absolutely done with the pair of them by the time he was declared bankrupt and their debt could be passed on.

I’d say that the journalism is based on real life, so it’s not necessarily going to follow an expected trajectory. I like that.

I do think the interview with Bill makes a difference in this story. It shows the couple tell completely different stories regarding Moth’s health depending who they are speaking to and what they want to get out of the situation. It shows that they exploit and manipulate other people’s kindness and empathy whenever possible. It shows they shittalk the same people who help them in their books without a care. It shows they’re happy to lie to the media if it makes them look good - letting the cider farm deteriorate vs making cider for Rick Stein. It also shows they have no concept of paying back or forward the help they receive from others.

I still don’t understand why people are tying themselves in knots to give the benefit of the doubt. If it wasn’t clear what is expected of you when someone essentially lets you live in their farm for free, would you not just ask them? How entitled to think you get such an opportunity and you can do fuck all. I don’t even stay over at a hotel I’ve paid for without putting all the towels together and tidying up 😁

There is also an odd turn of phrase in Sally/Raynor's statement that sounds as though there was to be some financial sleight of hand involving this loan that the Walkers got the loan of £90,000 but they weren't paying any interest which "Cooper" "would cover".

In 2008, we asked for the money back. He said he didn’t have it but offered us a loan through his company. We agreed. Because the loan was coming from his company, he said it had to follow the company’s standard loan terms: 18% interest, which he would cover, and a charge on our home in his name. He assured us this was standard practice and only temporary as he would soon repay the loan to his company, and the charge would be removed. We were uneasy, but after so many years, it seemed like a way to finally resolve the issue. We trusted that Cooper would honour his word and repay the money to his company, as repayment of our original investment.

https://www.raynorwinn.co.uk/

Not really odd. Chloe has said that she had no idea her article would blow up like this. I should think it was a one off, that they are now adding to.

The article doesn’t say the cancer comment from the brother’s wife was 2007. It says the neighbour saw the brother a few times while he did maintenance on the dove cote and the last time was ‘a decade ago’. Through the wife he learnt of the cancer. This could have been in 2015.

Just noticed this: RayMoth did the Landlines journey May -Sept 2021. In October 2021, Moth tells Bill he's got just until Christmas to live. Seems to undermine the whole concept of walking in nature as Moth's miracle cure.

Bill was completely gaslit.

Ah, come on. He, like millions of other people, took the events in TSP to be true. He's hardly alone in that.

He expected something in return, it clearly states that in the article.

And no, he wasn't a vulnerable person but considering his wife had cancer, I'm very willing to cut him some slack.

Pretty much everyone was being taken in by them. If he was an outlier, then fair enough, but he's not. He's one of many.

Until this most recent article, I had wondered whether RW was the driving force in being somewhat economical with the truth and that poor Moth might have been somewhat manipulated. Seems not.

So the cancer comment by the brother's wife could have been no later than 2015 i.e. it was made some time between 2007 & 2015.

Chloe H said she (and presumably the Observer) didn't realise it would be a massive story, so they probably thought a three-part expose last week was all it was going to be.

They didn't reckon for the entire news world to be hotfooting it to France and Wales!

Only if you take anything she says as true. Which I find quite a stretch right now

I still don’t understand why people are tying themselves in knots to give the benefit of the doubt. If it wasn’t clear what is expected of you when someone essentially lets you live in their farm for free, would you not just ask them? How entitled to think you get such an opportunity and you can do fuck all.

I agree.

Snide and unpleasant about others who help them seems to be their MO.