Why can't people respect the rules around toilets!?!?

[coffeeandmycats]

I’m really angry and just need to get this off my chest. Me and my sister run a small shop, just the two of us and a couple of customer toilets, one for biological women, one for men, signs on the door. Never had any trouble. Until today.
A regular female customer comes up looking pretty upset, says there’s a man in the women’s loo. I go in to check. At first it sort of looked okay, hair, maybe a trans woman? But then I heard a deep voice, saw stubble and a broad build, a wig that looked like a last-minute costume. It was clearly a bloke who didn’t pass. Not even close.
I said politely, this is the women’s loo, please leave. He stared at me and said flat out, “I was born female.” Not I identify as a woman, he literally claimed he was biologically female. I asked him to go and he refused.
So I rang 101, didn’t want drama and wasn’t sure what rights we had as shop owners. The police said we can’t challenge how someone describes themselves. If he says he was born female, that’s it. We’re not allowed to question it based on how he looks. And since no laws were broken, they won’t come unless he’s being abusive or refusing to follow reasonable requests after shouting multiple times.
They also confirmed that the new Supreme Court judgment about women-only spaces is civil law, not criminal. That means even though legally women are defined by birth, you still can’t challenge someone in the moment just because they say they’re female.
I looked into it after, and yep, the Supreme Court (in For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers) ruled that “woman” in the Equality Act 2010 means biologically female. But that applies to protecting women-only spaces under civil law. It doesn’t let us stop someone on the spot from walking into the wrong loo. The police still can’t act if someone says they’re female, even if it’s clearly false.
This bloke walked into the women’s loo, lied about being born female, made women uncomfortable, and we’ve got no legal leg to stand on to stop him. Women customers left feeling unsafe.
So what exactly are we supposed to do? Sit back and let it happen because the law only kicks in later on? Are we just meant to trust someone who’s lying about their sex to decide what sexed spaces they can use?
It feels like women’s rights are just words, no power in real life. Anyone else run into this mess in their business? I'm nearly losing my mind over how absurd this is.

Nope. I fully support women’s rights and “boundaries”, I just recognise that the idea that trans people are a threat to women is nothing but wild and raging transphobia.

Evidence from university studies has proven conclusively that females can sex males around 99% of the time. This isn't even in question. The empirical evidence is in.

Transwomen are the safest group out, the most powerful, the most celebrated, the most privileged sacred caste. There is never any reports of violence against them. Even if they were, male on male violence is NOT FEMALE RESPONSIBILITY.

You clearly have zero insight into male on female violence or the trauma of rape and domestic violence victims. 🤷🏼‍♀️ Or how vulnerable the female sex class is. A male in a dress is still a member of the predator and oppressor sex. Only with more protection and more powerful and higher on the totem pole.

Any MALE in a female space, is.

And using 'trans' as a cover doesn't change this.

No you dont.

You refuse to listen to women who tell you they don't want men in their spaces. You refuse to honour women's rights to asset those boundaries for themselves.

For the thousandth time, it is not 'trans' people. It is MALES. Regardless of how that male identifies. Some males have found a loophole in claiming to be trans.

They are still MALES. It doesn't matter if they're in a dress and say they are women. They are male. Hence have NO place in FEMALE only safe single sex spaces.

i absolutely support women’s rights.
.

that doesn’t mean I have to support all the phobias and prejudices of every single human who happens to be a woman.

I don’t support racism, homophobia, misogyny , ableism, transphobia… even if the people espousing these ideas are women.

Being trans is a-ok. Respecting trans people will not erode women’s rights or turn society upside down. There is room for everyone.

This is truly wild.

You support them destroying female only spaces so how can you pretend they, or you, are not a threat?

Don't lie. You DON'T support womens rights if you think it's ok for any male body to enter female only spaces. By doing so, you are supporting mens rights and promoting femphobia and misogyny.

If you think a fully intact male with penis and testicles has the 'right' to traumatise RAPE SURVIVORS like me in our 'sex' based spaces, you DON'T support womens rights.

Respecting the 'feelings' of MALES to enter female only safe intimate single sex spaces means you are eroding womens rights and spaces to appease predatory males, no matter their reason.

Female only single sex spaces are for FEMALES ONLY.

It's really that simple.

A reminder

Recognising men to be men is not a phobia.

In attempting to tell women that it IS a phobia, you're using that as a means of get women to shut up, not assert their boundaries and undermine their rights.

I totally disagree with your premise that allowing trans people to use the women’s toilet will “destroy female only spaces”.

What part of it is 'wild'? That it's been proven beyond all doubt by peer-reviewed university studies that females can accurately sex a male (and our survival depends on it so it's hardwired), or that you, demonstrably btw, don't understand the needs of rape survivors and Domestic Violence survivors - as you've proven?

But to not want these men in our spaces is 'phobic' Orfordness, remember.

You keep using 'trans people' as a cover for MALES, thinking we won't notice.

Again, it is not, and NEVER HAS been, about 'trans' people.

It's about MALES with their cocks and balls in FEMALE ONLY spaces.

Okay Tandora, when you put a man in a woman's space does it

A) remain a woman's space?
B) Become a mixed sex space?

A female only space cannot ever be a female only space if it includes men regardless of how those men identify.

I’m not using “trans people” as a “cover”. I’m using the word “trans people” because I’m talking about trans people.

Which is totally irrelevant to the judgement and the toilet question because that is about people's sex.

These parts are wild. Truly wild. the first and the third are so wild I truly don’t know what to say. Just wild. The middle statement is of course just a totally baseless personal attack.

Transwomen are the safest group out, the most powerful, the most celebrated, the most privileged sacred caste. There is never any reports of violence against them

You clearly have zero insight into male on female violence or the trauma of rape and domestic violence victims.

A male in a dress is still a member of the predator and oppressor sex. Only with more protection and more powerful and higher on the totem pole.

Umm . It’s of course necessary to talk about trans people in a conversation about where trans people should be allowed to go to the loo!!

You can’t just logic trans people out of existence no matter how hard you try. Thats not how life works.

Males. M.A.L.E Male.

A male with a cock and ball sack is still a male, even in a dress.

And it is important for female survival and hardwired to spot a male, and to have male-free spaces. Even if that MALE claims he is 'trans'.

It's not necessary to reference their trans status. As the judgement is only concerned with their sex. Male or female.

Trans people are either male, or female.

No male - 'trans' or not, should enter female only safe single sex spaces.

Why do you keep talking about a “cock” and “ball sack” as if trans people can be reduced to genitals? And What about trans people who don’t have them?