TW - SA. To think that infidelity is rape

[Driftingawaynow]

Just interested in opinions here. I’ve been in relationships where my partner has been unfaithful and continued to sleep with me
i think part of the trauma of finding out is knowing that you’ve had sex with someone when if you’d have known you would not have done it.
So youve been tricked into having sex. That’s not consent, so is it rape?
I’ve also been raped in the more traditional sense whatever that means
if it is rape, what are the implications if we become aware that someone else is the victim of infidelity and they don’t know..

Yes, but if we are discussing a heterosexual married couple, one of whom secretly cheats whilst continuing to have sex with their spouse, it would be unfair if the wife were considered to have been raped by this behaviour whilst the husband was not.

No, some people are saying she shouldn’t be asking the question, that it minimises the experience of people who have experienced rape and don’t agree with her. Bearing in mind she has experienced rape, so is in an informed position to have an opinion.

Sex is a leisure activity, an itch to scratch, a goal, good fun, the end to a great night out… it’s no longer seen mainly in its former context- relationship and monogamy.

There was a thread on here a while back where a friend was swinging, without condoms, outside the knowledge of his heavily pregnant girlfriend. Many many people thought she should keep her nose out of his business.

YABVVU of course it isn't rape. Otherwise half the relationships in the world would be classified as rape. An affair is deep deception of course, but there are many other little deceptions both men and women are guilty of that could negate consent. Can a man say he is 'raped' when the woman he slept with claimed she was 28 but was actually 33, and he didn't want to have sex with someone over 30. Or a woman could say she was raped because she wanted to have sex with a doctor but found out the man was a student nurse pretending to be a doctor
What about a woman who has straight silky hair and a golden tan but the next day had frizzy hair and pale skin, the man could say he was raped because she deceived him. Honestly I could give a million other examples of how ridiculous your theory is.

The op doesn’t get to speak for all rape victims

If this would be a legal matter, than there would be a burden of proof and evidence required for these cases, which I suspect would throw out all the more frivolous ones (and in the rare case that it turns out there is an individual with severe pre-existing trauma around being intimate with someone with blue eyes and their partner was using coloured contacts to hide this, then there presumably would be evidence of some kind of the issue that could be brought to support their claim and be weighed up by the judge as to its validity).

So whilst Leonardo DeCaprio might be able to argue that he was deceived into sleeping with a girl over 25, Fred from work probably wouldn't be able to.

Yabu. And offensive.

I wouldn’t consent to have sex with a man who had had 50 previous partners. Who did drugs. Who has slept with other men. Who doesn’t see his kids.

by your definition most people don’t disclose everything about themselves before they have sex so in fact you could argue that 99% of first sex is rape.

In my case, I’d argue that my ex was actively cheating at the time because he would come home immediately after having unprotected sex with another woman, and have sex with me. Sorry if TMI but he was literally introducing another woman’s bodily fluids into my vagina without my knowledge. That felt like an assault to me. I think it gave him some kind of power trip. I apologise if anyone finds that offensive but it is how I felt.

Exactly this 👏

Having been both raped and cheated on, no. I don’t think it’s rape personally, or even remotely close to the sense of violation and fear as each other.

What a disgusting and insulting post to people that have actually been raped.

And to people who have been cheated on.

You have a warped mind and need to seek help.

As per user name. I’m not sure I’ve ever got over my experience of this. It was violating in the circumstances - the day before he knew he was going to leave me and our young children and wilfully take our lives apart, bit by bit.

That wasn’t consent.

Absolutely

What would happen if both partners were having an affair? Would the 2 "rapes" cancel each other out or would they both be guilty?

If he's passed on an STI to you it can be illegal to intentionally or recklessly transmit a sexually transmitted infection (STI) in the UK. The law focuses on intentional or reckless transmission, particularly of HIV, but also applies to other STIs.

My rather pedant mind does wonder how this works in reverse where a female partner is having an affair behind her male partners back ?

Thank you for the thoughtful responses, I’m sorry for those who have taken offence, and my heart goes out to everyone that has shared stories of being violated in whatever way.

I think that there is definitely a difference between consenting in the moment (even though you’ve been tricked into it), and a nonconsensual act, which is definitely sexual assault.

and so IMO there should be another category, some really good suggestions have been made

not holding my breath for this to become law, but that was not the point of the thread.

I really think you have a point OP, and Ive never thought about it before. If stealthing is considered rape in law, and you could be charged for it (doubtful in reality), I don't see why consent by deception couldn't be considered rape.

I remember when my exDH pretended he wasn't sleeping with other women to reconcile with me and I slept with him several times. I was absolutely devastated when I found out, and definately would not have consented. I felt really violated. I think thats as bad as stealthing.

Presumably the same level as the dumbass women that cheat and then sleep with their husbands/partners. Or do you think only men cheat?

Yeah. Like just say someone only wanted to sleep with millionaires. Their sexual partner claimed to be one, but actually only had a modest income. They had sex.

It's deceptive but not rape.

I agree with this.

Obviously it is deceptive and a horrible thing to do to someone but it is not rape in the legal definition - and not do I think we should be pushing for it to be.

Sex by deception being rape just opens up a can of worms, especially if it’s deception by omission rather than outright lying. Are we meant to tell everyone we ever sleep with every potential detail that could influence their decision to sleep with us? How do you know what would influence one person and not another? Aren’t people entitled to privacy? Especially if those details are in your past (e.g. virgin or not, raped previously, once had a drug problem and is now past it). Obviously there are caveats for safety (getting tested etc) but if the person has been responsible aren’t we all entitled to move on from our past and have a fresh start?

I also think it’s very dangerous to legislate on morality in these ways. Historically laws are only ever really applied to the lower class and the rich/powerful can get away with whatever they want. Anti-adultery laws and punishments are never applied to the rich man who cheats on his wife. But they are used to punish the woman who was raped, but she can’t prove it was rape, so in the courts eyes she was just unfaithful.

Of course I’m not saying it’s not horrible and in some cases traumatic to be cheated on and lied to. But to legislate on morality in this way with so many grey areas is dangerous and I think would inevitably end up hurting more innocent people and women. Cheaters deserve social consequences but I think legal ones are a step too far.

Oh, now, you see you made a presumptive value judgment.

But to bite your bait, yes, I think just as poorly of women who shag about and then shag their partner. Ok?

Oh, now, you see you made a presumptive value judgment.

But to bite your bait, yes, I think just as poorly of women who shag about and then shag their partner. Ok?

It’s unhealthy thinking, seeking condemnatory outcomes.

I don’t agree this is rape and really where do you draw the line? My sister use to say if a man sleeps with her after telling her he wants a relationship then she finds out it was a lie and he just wanted to get her into bed then she feels that it’s rape, I think you will get a lot of people claiming any kind of deception is rape.

I don't think technically this is right actually because it would imply some level of control over the other person's body. For example, what about if person 1 said to person 2 - "I don't want to have sex with anyone who masterbates", does that mean if person 2 has a secret wank and then has sex with person 1, it is rape?

It's also just not legally correct at all.