To think the BMA have misjudged with another doctor's strike?

[Locutus2000]

Last year they got more than anyone else in the NHS along with an improved deal. Nurses and other AHPs received lower rises.

BMA have just announced another 'resident' doctor strike continuing to chase pay restoration to 2008 levels.

Having just had the major win with changes to IMG prioritisation and the clamp-down on PAs it feels a bit tone-deaf and I can't see Streeting going for it.

@poetryandwine I’m a teacher and my pension is not great now either. Old TPS was lovely, new one not really worth it. Same as most public sector pensions, they have been downgraded.

This comment makes no sense to me !

So many benefits

To be fair, no one working in the nhs would be given a night shift off because they hadn't slept and were exhausted etc, The likelihood of covering nights at such short notice is poor. Everyone else is also underpaid . I know drs are only interested in fighting their own corner, but the nhs as a whole is in trouble. The issues should be addressed at an organisational level, not just for one staff group.

It’s always been the same. Do people really not know what they are signing up to? My consultant thought it was really big of him to let me go home 1hr early when my mum was dying of cancer, my friend had to pay for his own locum for his wedding day despite having requested it off 6 months in advance and two of my friends worked through serious illnesses; chemotherapy and a Crohns flare because the culture at the time was that going off sick was not seen as an option as you were ‘letting the side down’ These were all 20 years ago so it’s nothing new at all. 6 month rotations with short notice of the rota are also nothing new at all. It’s a brutal job. It’s in the nature of it to a large degree. It’s not banking or law. It is more like the army or the police. You know this when you sign up.

I do sympathise re the TPS. USS (academic) is even worse.

You mentioned a few DB schemes that are better than the NHS - fair enough. But the vast majority of military, police, civil servants, etc make less money than doctors. And like the NHS (and USS - and possibly TPS?) all these have moved to some type of career average scheme. Oh, firefighters also. They prob have the most dangerous job of all so good for them.

Comparison with private sector pensions seems to me beside the point as the latter are essentially all DC. Greater rewards, yes, but at the cost of bearing the risk.

Benefits specifically covering the cost of relocation (which seems to be an issue for one or two mums):

The search for accommodation in the new area.
The purchase and sale of property (including legal fees and stamp duty).
Removal of furniture and effects.
Continuing commitments in the old area.
General or miscellaneous removal costs.
Additional housing costs in the new area.
Additional or excess travelling costs, so that resident doctors do not have additional travel costs associated with moving to a new post.

General benefits in addition to those noted here and above:

The guarantee of a job for two years post-graduation.
The highest pay of any degree.
Better employment prospects than all but two degrees, with an 85% chance of acceptance to first choice of employment.

Hardly any at really.

They did try and do that but the nurses weren’t interested in joint talks. Totally agree with you though, everyone is underpaid. And badly treated.

@Marchesman only if you move within 20 miles of your hospital. Which will change every 6 months so might move in middle of deanery so can commute. So more than 20 miles and no help.

@Marchesman guaranteed job for 2 years anywhere in the country. Oh and could be a made up one because we ran out of them.

Highest paid degree - are you mad ! Aldi graduates start on £60,000 and a company car after 3 year degree. So barristers earn less than doctors do they - weird as I’ve yet to meet a poor one.

Better employment prospects ? 45% of F2s don’t have a job in 3 weeks. What’s great about that ?

@ThePuredo you not want to make it better for your doctors ? Or because you were treated badly you’re going to do the same to them ? Really ?

I do want things to be better but;

1. do not think a pay strike is the way to go about it
2. I think that some of the hardship IS inherent in the job and you cannot expect it to be like a ‘normal’ middle class professional job. We are part of emergency essential services and so we will have our leave restricted and have some hardship to face.

A lot of nurses genuinely couldn't afford to strike anyway. Many do extra shifts each month to pay bills. Thousands opt out of the nhs pension each year because they can't afford it and need that money now. Obviously these issues affect lower bands even more. Band 2's actually had to be given a pay rise when national minimum wage increased in April. Shocking for an organisation such as the nhs.

@ThePure and I don’t think any doctor thinks differently. They know it’s hard etc, but being treated kindly costs nothing. Leave being restricted is understandable- someone was trying to make it out as a big benefit not actually a bit of a pain. I’ve not seen DD last 2 Christmas days and won’t this year, but she knew that and it’s expected. What would be nice is if doctors were treated with a modicum of kindness.

The right to strike is a personal choice and disagreeing with it is as OK as not.

I think the problem is that the young doctors have been brought up in a world which focuses on the individual and their well being. They then get thrown into the real world of the NHS!! And it’s tough, it always has been…… The whole culture needs to change, but unless the NHS is completely restructured/ replaced that’s not going to happen. It’s too big a machine to suddenly change direction. Financially the country as a whole is in a mess, and young doctors striking for themselves right now isn’t a good look!
Btw I also know of post F2 posts where no ‘locals’ applied. I don’t know why?? Maybe they haven’t been spoon fed how to search properly…….

@Minnie798 it’s so unfair as nurses are massively underpaid. Wish the union would stop sniping at doctors though, as if it their fault. Taking away the bursary was awful and should be reversed asap.

@littlemissprosseco again you have to be rude. Why ? Doctors I know grew up in a v real world of poverty and often neglect. They know more about the real would then you ever will.

Oh and it’s mainly private schools that spoon feed - state schools don’t have the time or staff !

Aldi is rated bt the Times as one of the best employers in the UK. The only salary I found is £50K, not £60K. Aldi is German, and rich. German doctors are paid better, also.

Only a few young barristers make major money, mostly at the top London firms. Various websites converge on an average salary in the low £40s for junior barristers nationwide. These juniors also have gruelling jobs.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2025/feb/27/only-5-of-uk-medical-school-entrants-are-working-class-data-shows

and the privately educated are still hugely over represented in U.K. medical school. At least a quarter are privately educated vs 7% of the population who go to private schools. That’s not to mention those from affluent backgrounds who are the vast majority. This is true in my personal experience too.

This is one of the main reasons that I feel it is not a good look at all for affluent middle class people to be going on strike to ask for more pay from taxes paid by people much poorer than themselves whilst simultaneously causing those people to have worse healthcare.

The general public do not have sympathy with this cause and my biggest fear is that this will damage the reputation of the NHS still further and lead to its demise which would be a terrible terrible thing.

What makes doctors think they are so special?

Aldi is not a degree; and lawyers, ie solicitors and barristers, earn less than doctors five years after graduation.

Five years ago 75% of graduates got the foundation programme they wanted and adjustments have been made to improve this. 92% of F2s who go to the trouble of applying for a training post are successful. But 56% of F2s do not apply to core or specialty training in the same year they finish F2 training (GMC 2024).

Absolutely no other career looks like this. However, if they won't apply for jobs I'm afraid no one is going to seek them out to try to talk them into it.

I'm pretty sure I'm not the one who is mad.

Not what, who?

I think the recent MN threads give the answer to that one.

92% of F2s who applied this year did not get into speciality training. No idea where that figure was plucked from. Probably more like 30% but figures aren’t out yet.

Quoting things that happened 5 years ago is a bit pointless as the whole point is how much things have changed.

Aldi graduates all have a degree, many many other firms offer much more than doctors earn. Many will earn much more over their careers. Medicine is not the highest paid job - it’s just that everyone who does it earns the same.

Oooh Seville is back to be rude ! Right on cue.

Where does anyone say doctors are special ? Weird comment