I hate anti-vaxxers

[An89]

How can anyone in this day and age be an anti-vaxxer? London and West mids currently suffering from a meassls outbreak. DS is under 1 so cannot yet have vaccine, I know of someone whose 10momth old contracted measels as they were too young for vaccine.
Ridiculous that reckless and tardy parents are putting all our children at risk. Actually terrible.

My kids showed signs of autism before their MMRs. I'm autistic and too old for MMR.

My dad was probably autistic , before any measles vaccines.

However, it is really hard to counteract that element of doubt once it creeps in. It would be helpful to look at the consequences of not vaccinating compared to having the vaccine. It's all about risk.

Dh Aunty had diptheria as a 3 year old, was in quatantine away from family for weeks on end and her heart was damaged. She lived until her 60s but with life long effects from a now preventable disease.

@BlackeyedSusan Im sure a lot of it comes down to the basic human need to be safe with a big dose among some of wanting to be different and edgy.

But the lack of any sort of intelligent thinking is genuinely frightening. I don’t think the answer is to try and stop these viruses artificially, but to understand them and support the body through them, because if you really understand the laws of nature, you will know you can’t. when you're talking about diseases with a 50% death rate really make me think that there should be a test before people are allowed to vote or procreate :P

It's people like you who.need protection from herd immunity.

What the hell are you talking about? Which disease has a 50% death rate please?

Shingles is really painful. I wish I'd been in a position to have the kids get chicken pox vaccine.

This!

They should have vaccination mandatory to attend school .

Vaccination mandatory to receive child benefit or any other benefits.

Yes, they blindly follow their uneducated friends and never see the irony in calling anyone who doesn’t agree “sheep” 😂

My mum had it when she was 5s. She spent 6 weeks in hospital with no visits from family or friends. Her parents could visit and look through a window.

Someone gave my mum one of those cut out paper dolls where you cut out different clothes.

They were not allowed out of bed so the older girls did the cutting out and then put the 'doll' in between the pages of a book and threw the book bed to bed.

Smallpox

The infectiousness period occurs when the lesions are heaviest. There are five known classifications of smallpox. The ordinary form is the most common (~90 percent) with a 30 percent case fatality rate. The flat form accounts for about 5 percent of cases, and has a 97 percent case fatality rate. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK221063/

Eliminated by, oh yes, vaccines.

50% was a rough average I took. (their bolding, but read the sentence after).
They are at least working on a vaccine for the bubonic plague, which killed an estimated 30 - 60% of the population at the time.

Just how, exactly, do you 'plan to support the body through' smallpox or worse bubonic plague when between 30 - 90% of the people who get it die? Never mind the percentage who actually get sick, which is going to be higher?

Plus as many people who are actually trained and studied this have said, we are going to get more pandemics not less.

This information is very easily available. But others have said all this many times upthread, so no doubt it will slide off your hide like water off oilskins.

There was the notorious case of Princess Alice (one of Queen Victoria's daughters) in the 1870s. Every single member of her family caught this highly contagious disease, and Alice and her daughter died.

It’s a tricky one
Other people have the right to do what they see fit for their children. The R part of the MMR made my dd dangerously ill. My kids all caught natural measles and the first one who got it contracted from a vaccinated child who had been abroad. They were very unwell but got over it, it was similar to chickenpox ime. Public Health England were very reassuring that the vast majority of healthy kids have no real ill effects from measles (I was surprised about that given what we’re told about it)
i do feel fir you though, I wouldn’t want my little baby to get it (or any other childhood illness) when they are little.
Not giving my kids the MMR doesn’t make me a bad person- I’m not going to sacrifice my children’s health for other peoples kids to be protected. Not when my own child was so very ill after the jab. People are very stupid though when it comes to this subject- my GP surgery still moans there’s a spike in measles and therefore I should give my kids MMR… even though they’ve had actual measles

This is an interesting idea
Personally, I don’t think people who fear side effects from the jab would sacrifice the potential of that for a school place or £17.50 a week.

The more that people choose not to vaccinate, the riskier their decision not to vaccinate becomes (to themselves and others).

The level of ignorance and selfishness is outstanding. Vaccination and clean water are the two biggest reasons for significant increases in life expectancy in the UK. Personally I would remove government funded childcare and school
places from unvaccinated children. Vaccines are safe and effective and protect vulnerable people.

The safest thing to do is the thing that everyone else isn’t.

So if everyone else is avoiding jumping off a cliff, the safest thing would be to jump off the cliff? Or am I misunderstanding you?

Dr Sears actually wrote in his badly researched scaremongering vaccine book.

"I also warn them not to share their fears with their neighbors, because if too many people avoid the MMR, we'll likely see the diseases increase significantly
"

more the opposite. If everyone else is vaccinating then there’s no risk of catching the disease so quantitatively the risk of the vaccine is larger than the risk of an illness you will never get.

If people aren’t vaccinating then then the opposite is true. Once the vaccination date is low enough that outbreaks occur then vaccinating is almost always safer except in rare circumstances.

Does this apply to other things? Like wearing seatbelts? What other solid public health advice is it best to do the complete opposite of in the face of data?
🤦🏻‍♀️

I see your point, now you've explained it. It's always going to vacillate then; but since some people are never going to be able to vaccinate due to risk factors, I think that the onus is on the rest of us who have no known factors to get vaccinated.

The growth of the anti-vax movement means that tipping over the edge into outbreaks happening is more likely though, which means that anyone sensible living in society who doesn't have a known good cause not to vaccinate, should. The ones who don't are either supremely selfish or very stupid, and short sighted in both cases.

100% this! The heavy handed approach to the Covid jab was always going to make some people sceptical of more traditional vaccines. It's human nature I'm afraid.

Pretty sure small pox was already on its way out, as the jab was being developed.

What a coincidence! It was hanging around since ancient Egyptian times and then disappeared completely after a mass vaccination program.

It certainly wasn’t on its way out when the vaccine was developed in 1796. It didn’t start heading out until large quantities of people got vaccinated.