To tell the school my child will NOT go to detention..

[Nataliaa]

DD year 7 has been given a 30 minute detention tomorrow afternoon, after school. Since starting secondary, she has received 2 detentions- 1 for forgetting her PE shorts and 1 for not completing homework.
I fully supported the school and the consequences DD had to face on these 2 occasions. She did learn from each time and since then, she has always been organised with PE kit and completing homework.
DD is well behaved, works hard and all school reports have been brilliant so we have no concerns.

Back to today… it is 31 degrees and the school allowed blazers to be left at home, but still expected the children to be in their shirt, ties and trousers (the school recently banned skirts, and does not allow shorts so all children are in trousers. All year round)

During lunch break, DD loosened her tie and untucked her shirt as she was so hot and sweaty… and then forgot to tuck in her shirt and redo tie before going back in.
She walked into English and straight away the teacher told her to tuck the shirt in and do tie, which she did.
Then whilst sat down she untucked the shirt again… she then got up for something and the teacher noticed the shirt untucked and as she had already been told once, she was given the detention.
DD tried to explain she was just so hot and sweaty, she felt she couldn’t concentrate and loosening the shirt helped.. she was then told off for answering back.

I do not agree with this detention at all. Other local schools have let kids go in wearing PE kits in this heat. The teacher was not wearing shirt and tie- she was wearing a floaty and cool summer dress.
I can’t think for the life of me how an untucked shirt would affect DD’s education, and why it’s more important to stick to a strict dress code rather than doing whatever is comfortable in this heat!!

I have never been in the position to disagree with the school, and not sure what would happen if I refuse to let DD go to this detention… also not sure if that’s setting the wrong message to DD, as I always encourage following school rules!!

Any advice? Is this a hill worth dying on? What would you do?

Ridiculous. I told my class today that 1) they could untuck shirts if it helped them to be more comfortable, 2) they needed to drink more than they usually would and 3) I understood if they needed to use the toilet more as a result of number 2.

These power trips just make teachers look petty and cruel.

Yup. I’m in Scotland and my kids go in shirts, sometimes a tie, my son wears black Nike shorts and they all wear trainers.

They seem to get on with learning just fine.

Do you manage answering back or just let it happen at the whim of the children?

YANBU. I would stick up for your daughter on this. Absolutely needless 'rules'.

That wasn’t answering back, that was explaining. Answering back is where you try to be clever.

The detention for forgetting shorts is equally bad. Detentions should be reserved for proper or multiple repeat offences. Schools used to give merits for good deeds and demerits for small mistakes. The world's gone mad.

As far as shorts are concerned, wearing the school spares would have been punishment enough in embarrassment terms. Schools need to work these things out

I would not enforce the rule. But if I had a rule in class and reminded someone of it, to find they immediately broke it then argued they were right to do so, that would have some sort of consequence.

Those aren't parents.

They are the dickhead teachers 😁 the kind who recognise themselves in posts about little Napoleonic adults trying to display their power...over a 12 year olds untucked shirt during a heatwave.

Detentions used to mean something when they were for genuinely bad behaviour. Now they are used as a form of crowd control, even for the good kids, so they have lost all stigma.

Totally stupid school decision
Absolutely do not send her to the detention.
Hopefully the school will admit their ridiculous mistake, especially as the teacher was wearing a floaty dress.
Once at college or university students no longer have to put up with uniform lunacy.

So anyone who didn't fancy PE could just "forget" their shorts. What could possibly go wrong? 🤔

Every English school needs to look at climate adaptation and that includes adapting uniform and having a summer uniform. Weather that’s pe kit or replacing shirt and blazers with a polo t shirt. Soon everyday in summer will be this heat.

Just wondering what the teacher is wearing in class? Her most uncomfortable, hot and sticky outfit?

Ok, so 30 kids all allowed to explain their view on aspects of school policy in a non
-clever way. Your classroom management isn't sound great to me.

Secondary teacher here. Our kids are meant to have shirts tucked in etc., and I'm a stickler. God knows why the teacher chose to be so unkind today. The kids, especially the Y7s, were really struggling. At a certain point we're meant to adapt to the conditions to ensure the welfare of our pupils.

If it was my DD, I'd refuse the detention. The teacher needs to understand that their adherence to school expectations needs to be moderated by their ability to meet the Teachers' Standards.

So teachers set the rules on uniform, I think not. They enforce it because it’s their job. They don’t allow answering back because it’s rude and usually done in a disrespectful way. Many parents cannot discipline their own children let alone 30 children all day every day in addition to trying to teach them a subject which when they don’t pass their gcse etc the teacher will be blamed by the same parents. 30 kids all going rogue, not following rules, not ready to learn all backed by their parents what a system, and parents wonder why teachers are leaving the profession and their little darlings are taught by supply teachers.
Here’s a novel idea, why don’t we support each other and not undermine the one person in the classroom who really wants your child to succeed, if you don’t agree with something email the head but back the teacher.

I spoke to her again about how she spoke to the teacher, and in all fairness to DD, she has been honest and admitted her tone was snappy. It definitely seems it’s not really what she said, but how she said it. I’m still catching up with all these replies! But seems in general, it’s 2 different issues. Detention for the rude backchat. And wanting to question the school’s uniform policy and see if they will allow PE kit to be worn in this hot weather.
I’m not sure if much would happen if I try and speak to the school about it? But I guess it is worth a try? And not approaching them in a defensive challenging way. May have a better outcome 🤷🏻‍♀️

Never in my working life have I been expected to wear a tie and blazer

Absolutely.

It’s always worked for me.

Yanbu. Management wouldn't get away with treating staff like that. Pupils deserve the same respect.

Amazing how most of the world manages to bring up educated teenagers without making them wear uniform. Our schools are fighting the wrong battles.

My dd was so skinny that her shirt never stayed tucked in.
God knows what she was supposed to do about it.

People never fail to amaze me. Who gives a fuck about a shirt being tucked in? Why can't adult teachers have any flexibility? What does refusing to allow a young girl to untuck her shirt in hot weather actually teach her?

She'll learn more from speaking up for herself, and from her parents backing her up, against stupid, needless punitive 'rules'.

To be honest, most of the schools here are the same. Other than the fact they let children wear PE kits in hot weather, everything else is pretty similar. We are happy overall with DD’s school. And what you have said is exactly what I was asking. If I start to challenge some of the rules I don’t agree with and not support the way they discipline DD, am I setting a bad example and encouraging DD to just not follow the rules she doesn’t like. I think I know the answer…

Watch out OP, your child’s GCSEs have been compromised by an untucked shirt! She’s rogue! She’s out of control! The System is crashing down and it’s all DDs untucked shirts fault!! 🤣

Honestly, it’s this sort of nonsense flying in the face of common sense that undermines schools and teachers more than anything else ever could IMO.

In this heat the children gaining some slight relief by adjusting their uniforms was entirely reasonable and sensible. The teacher went on a power trip and picked a needless, pointless fight, and her victim snapped at her petty stupidity. All extremely disruptive behaviour on the part of the teacher.

No. Some rules should be challenged. Their mere existence doesn't justify them.

Oh grow up, it was an untucked shirt during her lesson, she could have let that go but no, not on the hottest day of the year. I respect teachers but not those like the OP describes, jobsworths enforcing ridiculous rules and expecting kids not to be grumpy about being hot and sweaty.