To tell the school my child will NOT go to detention..

[Nataliaa]

DD year 7 has been given a 30 minute detention tomorrow afternoon, after school. Since starting secondary, she has received 2 detentions- 1 for forgetting her PE shorts and 1 for not completing homework.
I fully supported the school and the consequences DD had to face on these 2 occasions. She did learn from each time and since then, she has always been organised with PE kit and completing homework.
DD is well behaved, works hard and all school reports have been brilliant so we have no concerns.

Back to today… it is 31 degrees and the school allowed blazers to be left at home, but still expected the children to be in their shirt, ties and trousers (the school recently banned skirts, and does not allow shorts so all children are in trousers. All year round)

During lunch break, DD loosened her tie and untucked her shirt as she was so hot and sweaty… and then forgot to tuck in her shirt and redo tie before going back in.
She walked into English and straight away the teacher told her to tuck the shirt in and do tie, which she did.
Then whilst sat down she untucked the shirt again… she then got up for something and the teacher noticed the shirt untucked and as she had already been told once, she was given the detention.
DD tried to explain she was just so hot and sweaty, she felt she couldn’t concentrate and loosening the shirt helped.. she was then told off for answering back.

I do not agree with this detention at all. Other local schools have let kids go in wearing PE kits in this heat. The teacher was not wearing shirt and tie- she was wearing a floaty and cool summer dress.
I can’t think for the life of me how an untucked shirt would affect DD’s education, and why it’s more important to stick to a strict dress code rather than doing whatever is comfortable in this heat!!

I have never been in the position to disagree with the school, and not sure what would happen if I refuse to let DD go to this detention… also not sure if that’s setting the wrong message to DD, as I always encourage following school rules!!

Any advice? Is this a hill worth dying on? What would you do?

@Alltheyellowbirds what Local Authority?! They are certainly not strict in Edinburgh anyway.

Madness. No workplace would enforce this. Why should a school?

This is absolutely pathetic. It’s 31 degrees. The girl was told about talking back because she was trying to explain why she did it, and with 31 perfectly good reasons. School needs to back off during the heatwave and maintain their dragon rules another time. I would refuse the detention 100%.

But this isn’t a usual uniform issue. This is a health and safety issue. It is one thing to enforce strict rules in normal circumstances but most schools, even the strictest, recognise that no good comes from over heating the pupils. How the children learn anything I have no idea. My local school has said children can some in mufti this week to keep them cool. Their safety comes way above any uniform policy. I’d want to change schools just for not fulfilling the duhty of care the school should have for the pupils

Your housing association? Why do they have more responsibility for your health than you do?

I agree that some rules about uniform are draconian, but that is irrelevant to this thread because the student want given a detention because of uniform, she was given it for doing something she’d just been told not to do and for being rude to the teacher.

People constantly complain that standards of behaviour in schools have slipped and that behaviour is out of control, but this thread is full of people that will actively teach their children to ignore and disrespect their teachers. We can’t have it both ways.

@BoredZelda what Local Authority? Edinburgh is very relaxed as as schools attended by people I know in the rest of the lothians.

The problem is it encourages others to start or join the conversation, eating into teaching time.
i think parents should sit in class and observe on occasion, maybe the struggles schools
habe would be clearer. It’s important parents are on board

A few detentions were dished out for breaking uniform rules. DD said it was mostly people removing their ties

because they have turned it into a sweat box. window restrictors even though there are no kids here. over insulation i had severe chest pain yesterday morning which is a symptom of heat exhaustion. What do you mean why do they have more responsibility for my health? I cant wave a magic wand and make this place cooler. Im not Piper from Charmed. And i had to have all these things done because i was threatened with my tenancy if i didnt

Aye

I wouldn't be letting her sit that detention and I would be complaining to the school.

One of the symptoms for heat exhaustion is being irritable, along with others. Please educate the school on this especially if astudent who usually wouldn't behave like this has. They should know their students this late in the year.

I’ve specifically asked the school to give detentions during their own time since I don’t ask them to punish my kids on their time if it’s something that occurs at home.

totally agree… adding to the long list of reasons I did not want my DC educated in the UK… seriously caring about the wrong things!!

No one wears suits and ties these days. I commute into London and most men wear chinos/chino shorts and a cotton shirt or t shirt.
If pe kit is acceptable why can't they just wear that?
It's a hill I would die on.

Where did you move to?

Love all the people deciding this girl was just explaining and not being rude. We don’t know, we weren’t there. But I know when my daughter claims she was just explaining, she definitely wasn’t, and she’s generally incredibly polite, never had a detention etc.

The correct procedure when challenging rules is to take it to management.

For all those saying she shouldn't have answered back do you not want your children to learn to advocate for themselves, express their needs and stand up for an injustice? I'm very glad when I hear these utterly batshit rules being adhered to in this sort of heat that my children are home educated.

You don't 'let' your child go to detention or choose if it's valid or not. Schools have a legal right to give detention and don't need your permission. If they don't attend, it gers escalated up the behavioural policy until it gets resolved one way or another.

If you don't like it, find another school.

If I was the OP I’d be happy my child feels confident to answer back for something she doesn’t agree with and to try and defend herself. It’s barbaric how schools are so controlling over children.

Exactly.

there’s answering back in a rude way and then there’s politely explaining your point. In this case ops DD shouldn’t even have had the opportunity to answer back because she should not have been told off in the first place under these circumstances

op I would not be letting my child do a detention for this providing she has simply explained her situation in a polite way and I would be telling the school she will not be attending detention

Luckily there was no injustice, she just didn't fancy having her shirt tucked in and was rude, which frankly would have made little to no difference to her temperature.

Yes agreed it wasn’t about the uniform but answering back. Unfortunately, if you go against the school this time, your DD may learn that she can get you to get her out of a punishment next time. I would make her suck it up I am afraid.

I do agree with you about uniform in this heat though. They should have been allowed to take their ties off. In the real world women don’t wear ties to work and I have always thought it odd to have girls wearing ties but it is probably a separate issue.

I mean you have more responsibility for your health than they do! If where you are is too hot then I have sympathy, but there is plenty that you can do about it yourself before blaming a housing association.

Window restrictors prevent accidents and suicides as well as being better for children. It is more important for a housing association to prevent a suicide by fitting window restrictions than it is for the windows to be able to open fully on a couple of freaky hot days a year.

Slightly off-topic, but didn't detentions used to be for actually naughty kids? So they actually meant something. I remember when I was at school, you'd be mortified to be put in detention because that's where all the kids who were going to COME TO A BAD END hung out, not Adrian the Computer Nerd who had forgotten a PE sock. When did detention become the magic answer to all pupil failings of whatever magnitude? Forget your rubber. Detention! Throw a chair in class. Detention!

You want all the children to feel confident to answer back? How do you feel that would impact on the education of the pupils?