To be annoyed DH used dishcloth to wipe babies face?

[namechangesafe]

NC I don’t want this post linked to others.

Just had a bit of a disagreement with DH and wondering if I’m being unreasonable here.

Our baby, three months old, was sick down his chin and on his bouncer and DH grabbed the dishcloth that was sitting by the kitchen sink to wipe it from baby’s face and mouth. I said “are you really using a dishcloth?” and he said yes. When I asked would he use one on his own face, he said yes he’d use it on his own face (so what’s the problem, in other words).

The cloth was taken from our washing up bowl, and the cloths I had recently bleached yesterday. It was a microfibre cloth and DH uses these cloths to wipe up mess from the floor, we use them to wipe the sides and wash dishes.

AIBU or am I being a bit too precious about this?

Another example, he often picks baby up by both arms, did it this morning to take him out the bath and carry him two metres across the room and he keeps doing it, just another example of things he does that I don’t agree with.

Whenever I point things out to him he instead gets defensive and says “don’t tell me how to parent DC.” When he points things out to me I change what I’m doing, because my goal is just to want the best for DC but he thinks my safety concerns are silly and trying to wrap him in cotton wool.

Generally we are struggling with our newborn to be on the same page with safety concerns and I’m feeling very stuck and isolated as he will not respect my wishes when I call things out.

I’m really struggling.

@Lolapushthe is more intelligent then most people I know, yes. He is more intelligent than me and I think this is what often gets in the way. I’m not dumb lol I’d say I’m still fairly intelligent but he’s good with logic and sciences but low in emotional IMO and this is what creates issues,

He’s doing it to show OP he can do what he wants. He’s asserting his dominance by doing exactly what he pleases.

He is also doing it because he is abusive.

Good men do not do things like this. He is deliberately doing dangerous things with his newborn son and then scolding OP for being nanny-pamby/soft/spoiling a baby when she speaks up. Her instincts are yelling at her to protect her baby but because he’s manipulated her into thinking she’s the problem and trained her not to cross him (we don’t know how ie if he becomes physically violent or just verbally with the threat of physical violence) she has stopped voicing her concerns.

So far we know he picks a newborn up by their wrists, laughs while tapping his soft spot after being told it was dangerous, regularly squeezes water over baby’s face while bathing, left him on his own in a dark room for 20 mins crying his heart out until he was sick, refused to put a blanket on him when he was a few weeks old at 10pm…I may have forgotten a few things.

OP seems to think she can mention these things to him and he’ll change. He will not. There have been too many things in 12 weeks for him not to be aware of how to care for a baby. At this point, it would be better if he was a useless dad who didn’t do anything with the baby. At least that way he wouldn’t be risking leaving him to come or dislocating his arm.

OP - PLEASE speak to someone today. You can’t change him because he doesn’t want to change because in his eyes he’s not doing anything wrong. You just said he never thinks he’s wrong. Why will he change his mind??

OP - please read this post again.

This behaviour escalates.

He has already conditioned you not to speak up. He takes no responsibility for his dangerous behaviour and minimises the risk of his actions. This means he will not anticipate potential harm as everything he does is fine in his eyes. if he dislocated you DC’s arm it will be because he wriggled too much, if he bangs his head off the wall etc it will be because DC moved the wrong way. Shuts his hand in the door…he should have moved it.

Posters with experience with people like your husband can predict how this is going to end and that will involve your DC being injured.

It’s just not normal to have to ‘call out’ issues constantly. Or if you are saying what to do it shouldn’t feel like, or be received as, ‘calling out’.

I’ve asked my husband to do certain things with babies/ toddler and he’s always receptive.

He’s the more cautious one of us, but when I’ve said ‘she’s ok let her do X’ if he’s not comfortable it’s totally fine for him to stop her (for example, I let her climb a lot and he worries she’ll fall, so I say ‘she’s fine, but get her if you want’ and he will. So with the dish cloth, the normal reaction would be ‘dish cloth is fine! But I’ll use a musliN next time if you prefer’ or ‘it’s fine to move him with his hands, ill support his neck if it makes you comfortable’ or even have a google.

if it was me I’d be taking a video either secretly or warn him - ‘if you’re so sure it’s fine, I’ll take a video to show the HV’.

Wild stab in the dark here, but does everything centre around DH?

Any issue or problem is turned into how it effects him, how it made him feel?

Is he concerned about what other people think? Does he expect you to change your behaviour so as not to be thought of badly by others?

What is his reaction if you go against what he has said or maybe challenge him in front of others?

When you’re out, does he walk in front of you?

Do you feel you’re always chasing yourself trying to keep him happy?

Are you the same person you were before you got married? Do you recognise the person you are now?

Did his behaviour get worse once DC was born?

What kind of pets does he have? Did you have any concerns about his pets being near the baby and what was his reaction to your concerns?

He doesn’t handle criticism well. He is arrogant. Makes out he’s very intelligent. Won’t tolerate being told what to do. Anything else?

Firstly, I’m so sorry you’re going this OP. You must be absolutely exhausted. I want to say really clearly that you are not the problem here. Yes, anxiety can be a significant part of the newborn phase but that’s not something to belittle or judge as a partner. Your body is literally hard wired to protect your baby so although you may be more alert to risk (like the gross dishcloth) it isn’t wrong to feel worried or wrong to point things out. You are being an excellent mum in those moments.

To be honest, your husband’s ability to be a good parent is always going to be limited if he has an inability to take criticism, listen to you or adapt to your child’s needs. It is important to note that your worries and opinions are based on science. It sounds like for the most part you have read or heard something that informs your worries. On the flip side, his opinions are just defending his very fragile ego. You can tell us all he’s intelligent but clever people don’t dismiss doctors, experts, or people who know better. You know better than he does. You have identified danger to your child and what’s stopping you is your husband’s reaction to feedback. Your daughter’s safety cannot be second to your husband’s feelings. You are her protector. I really strongly suggest you take the power back. It’ll feel scary but your daughter needs you to be strong. If your husband does something unsafe, like the arm thing, tell him you need him to stop. If he says no or belittles you, tell him that her safety matters more than his ego. Tell him that if he can show her any info that says that’s safe, you’ll leave it. Tell him that in this matter, you know more than him and he’s just embarrassing himself but standing by these things. It sounds harsh but you need to give him a huge shove back down to earth. He’s clever, maybe, but that doesn’t make you a good dad.

This man has convinced you you are so much less than you are. You have literally grown a whole human being. You are so strong. You need to use that same strength to protect your daughter. If you don’t, you could be explaining stuff like this to a dr one day (e.g how did she break her wrist?) and they won’t hesitate for a moment to investigate his behaviour/actions. In some ways, it’s only going to get harder as your husband begins to fight your daughters developing independence and personality. Don’t let your daughter be smaller and hide herself like you have been made to do. It’ll change who she is forever. Model strength. You are 100% capable of fighting back and the discomfort your husband feels is so so much better than the potential pain your daughter may feel.

I know mumsnet can be the last place to feel supported sometimes but a lot of women on here can help you feel empowered. Please stay on here and use the community to keep protecting your baby. If it helps, check in when something feels off and we can help you work out what is a ‘leave him to it’ issue vs a ‘time to stand up and fight’ moment. You’ll notice that you probably already know in your gut when serious but we can help you feel empowered. Just please pick your daughter’s safety over your husband’s immaturity every time.

I am not sure I agree that a baby being carried by its arms will be fine.

God this thread has made me so sad. Especially because in another thread OP said they’re doing split nights, so this man is in sole charge of this poor little baby for hours unsupervised with no other awake adult in the house every day.

Have you understood what people are saying? No one thinks it matters what your husband’s feelings are, or yours about him, we’re all worried for your baby’s basic safety.

That baby smiles at him is not proof of being a good father. I’m afraid abused children have a bond and feel love for their abusers, it’s how they survive and causes them many future problems.

It's so sad to see how he is controlling you and making you question everything you think and do. Deep down you know this is his fault not yours. While leaving must seem terrifying you need to do it to protect your baby and yourself.

He picks the baby up dangerously.
He feeds the baby dangerously.
He bathes the baby dangerously.
He doesn't listen to your concerns about the babies health.

You are stepping on egg shells constantly to try and apease him, do you want your child growing up like this? Your baby needs you to protect them

The lifting by the arms - just no. Get him told.

my grandad used to wipe my face with his cloth hanky - used. It gives me the boak thinking about it now but I survived unscathed.

You don't need to defer to him because he has intelligence in some areas: where it REALLY matters in life, he has none and no empathy either- namely caring for a child. Perhaps he could apply his scientific logic to the science of dislocated jouits and the dangers of bruising a babies brain by messing with the fontinelle.

We all have different levels of intelligence and bring different things to the table, but it sounds like he's worn you down to believing he is some kind of guru who has all the answers and you dont. I know men like this who are professionally top of their game but then bring that thinking into the home and other relationships. It doesn't wash. My uncle specifically said he'd marry someone less intelligent than him, it was a goal. He dominates her now and has for years.

A previous poster has mentioned escalation of behaviour, and this is a classic start to potential worse abuse. Noone knows how yo look after a new baby really, you learn on the job, but even people without kids knows you do not whack a soft spot or pour water down their face or carry them by their hands so underdeveloped wrist and elbow joints are bearing the weight.

Im trying to word this carefully, before there's a pile on, but OP I don't understand how or why you aren't listening.

I know you know it's wrong. The water over his face in the bath for example. Nobody picked up on that initially, so you brought it up again until someone did. You waited until a whole lot of people were horrified by it then said you'd mention it to him.

The cloth being used on his face, that was initially a dishcloth then turned into a floor cloth too, again obviously worse.

Then the blanket, the crying until hes sick it's all just bloody dreadful and the kind of thing you read about in the paper when you hear the background of a court case.

For you to bring these things up tells me you know it's wrong, and yet your solution is to tell the man to stop and that will fix it. It's no wonder posters are getting frustrated. I think you've had a very easy ride on here quite honestly especially when in your earlier posts you seem to rank a settled relationship higher than your child.

Im interested to hear what it was that happened to make your mother intervene. Surely she's your biggest ally in all this?

I appreciate that things are hard and your confused etc, but you can do more than you're doing while you get your head together. "You look tired H I'll do night feeds, oh ds has already had a bath there's no need for you to do it" and predominantly "if you pick him up by the arms again then im leaving you, hes a baby not a doll"

Are you frightened he will get unsupervised access if you divorce?

With how your husband has conditioned you, it might be hard not to hear your husband’s voice as you read all of these replies. He’d be telling you that we are all hysterical women making a big deal out of his behaviour, that he’s got a great bond with your baby and would never do anything to hurt her and that we are all just creating unnecessary drama. Please start pushing that voice to the side and let your voice take control. A way more accurate overview of this situation is a group of women telling you in different ways that your daughter isn’t safe around your husband because of his actions. If a woman was being physically abused, I’m sure you’d question them saying “he’s such a great husband, he just hits me sometimes”. You are saying something similar except there are two victims - you are being emotionally abused so you don’t trust yourself and are scared to speak up and your daughter is being physically abused. Please don’t disappear from the chat because it’s easier to hide, stay small and put up with the bad bits because there are some good bits. As others have said, this behaviour can escalate. Let us support you and protect your baby by stopping his actions. If it gets scarier and harder, that’s because he’s showing you how unsafe he is.

I disagree with the posters saying leave him now. I would stay with him for now so you can supervise him with the baby and gather evidence to show he shouldn’t have unsupervised contact in the event of a split.

Sadly other threads make it clear this man is doing a lot of unsupervised ‘care’ of this baby. Far better if she could move in with her mother.

The more you mention his behaviour the more horrifying it seems.

Take your baby to your mums today and don't return. Call your Health Visitor and Women's Aid for advice about solicitors.

He will keep thinking up more and more dubious risky ways to treat your baby because he knows how upsetting it is for you. Your newborn is at risk. You have to get him away from this person.

What is his job and education level

Exactly this! He's making you complicit op

Just wanted to say exactly this!

Op, do you have a health visitor ? At this point I wouldn't be worrying about what the man thought of me bringing unit up, I would want him to compute how unsafe he is being. So I would ensure the next visit is when you are both present and you can bring these things up.

For some reason our health visitor doesn’t come anymore @Y2ker

What creates issues is that he’s a fucking abuser, OP. You have a responsibility to protect your child. All this nonsense about ‘he’s not malicious’ (he is) simply does not matter. Do you not understand that? These things he’s doing could seriously hurt your baby. Stop flapping about going on about how confused you are and do something, ffs.

This is a deeply frustrating thread.

I would be very surprised if no one has sent the information in this thread to social services or the NSPCC. OP I don’t know if they will be able to work out who and where you are with mumsnets help, but you should talk to a professional as soon as possible yourself so that if they are able to they will see you as able to protect your baby. I feel so deeply for you, but I look at my own older baby and think if I saw someone treating him as your husband is yours I would sprint across the room, take the baby and go somewhere safe. You do have good instincts but you are not listening to them and that is putting your baby in danger.